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No

Only Judeism

Only Islam

Yes to both Judeism and Islam

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

I find it hard to fathom that anyone takes the Genesis myth with anything approaching seriousness. It's obviously just a creation myth of the same vein as the thousands of others throughout history.

What's your problem with it?


Is it the unholy amount of incest? Or maybe an all powerful being making man from dirt and twigs? Or is it that snakes don't talk?

[RedKing]

Or the nine-hundred-year lifespans, or fitting two of every animal species (and presumably plant) into a wooden boat whose dimensions are given and could not possibly accomodate that much biomass.

Or repopulating the world a second time from a small family (once again, yay incest).

Or the fact that Genesis and Revelations seem to get the "well it's not meant literally" treatment, but all the parts in between are meant to be taken at face value and form the basis for entire legal systems and codes of conduct. Except the parts that seem silly (like sacrificing three doves for this, two chickens for that, a goat for the other, not wearing different types of fabric together, etc.) in which case we can ignore those because Jesus.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying a religion has to make logical sense. If it did, it wouldn't be a religion. Taoism is chock-full of paradox and generally cray-cray shit (like drinking mercury to gain immortality! And not eating rice, because that feeds the Three Worms that live in your stomach and eventually kill you). But trying to protest that it's scientifically compatible is not something I ken to easily.

Maybe I'm more sensitive to this because of my background in archaeology, an academic field that is rife with people trying to "prove" the Old Testament through dodgy interpretation of Near Eastern excavations.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

It's really the everything. When I went back to reading the Bible some years after becoming an atheist, I tried to compile in totality all my problems with the first five books. I ended up losing track of the number fairly early on.

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

Christianity is not a religion

A religion is mans attempt to get to god


Christianity is gods attempt to get to man


Just wanted to clarify

[MetalSlimeHunt]

No, Christianity IS a religion by all meaningful definitions, and this special pleading for it is an argument older than most of the people on this forum.

And even if we were to accept your definition, then most theistic faiths also manage to fufil "god's attempt to get to man" in one way or another. Having a founder that claimed deific status is not really uncommon.

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

It is gods attempt to get to man


Why else would his son die one of the worst possible deaths?

[MetalSlimeHunt]

That presupposes that god exists.

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

I thought we were already on that presumption since we are talking about Christianity and it's beliefs not what the world thinks of Christianity

[Frumple]

N... no, christianity is a religion. Actually, it's an offshoot of an older religion, both of which crib notes heavily from other religions and local myths, so... it's pretty normal as religions go. Got hella' lucky in regards to history, but so did Islam and Hinduism and a good handful of others.

As for the latest post, probably for the same reason Dionysus got devoured until nothing but the heart was left. Divine figures dying horribly and then coming back (or just dying horribly) is... pretty common. Normal religious-y stuff.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

I thought we were already on that presumption since we are talking about Christianity and it's beliefs not what the world thinks of Christianity

You went outside the presumption first, by saying it isn't a religion. That brings it back to the context of the material world.

[Cheeetar]

Cryxis, did you ever get around to answering why an infertile man and woman getting married wasn't unholy and against the natural order?

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

*sigh



The saying it's not a religion is part of my belief, that's what they preach at my church therefore it's part of my Christian belief an in context of the thread



As for the infertile couple I don't know what to tell you I'm only a highschool student and my own inquiries have only taken me so far into what I believe

I guess in my opinion if they are both infertile then they are helping humanity by not taking away from the fertil population
If not I honestly don't know

[Cheeetar]

Okay- what about two infertile dudes boning each other? They're taking themselves out of the fertile population, after all.

[Cryxis, Prince of Doom]

Okay- what about two infertile dudes boning each other? They're taking themselves out of the fertile population, after all.

They are having sex outside of marriage so that's not right


Don't take any of this to offence I have no problem with homosexuals or at least not more than I have a problem with theives gamblers (I only think people who gamble their lives away are sinners the ones who do it for fun and not for the money are ok) adulterers and liars

And almost all of us are guilty of one of those things, including me

[Descan]

Plus, you know, the whole Jesus thing is kind of weird and skeevy. "Gotta kill my son in order to forgive humans for something their great grandpappies x1000 did!"

:v

Much easier for an omnipotent being to, you know, *not* hold a grudge for thousands of years, yeah? Also much easier if it's also omnibenevolent.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Basically God is kind of a weird sociopath and/or Rube Goldberg fanboy. "I'm going to create these things, but won't give them knowledge of good from wrong. And THEN I'm going to tell them it's wrong to disobey me, and that it's wrong to eat from this tree that will tell what wrong even is. And once they do that, I'll kick them out, follow some jews around the desert for a bit, wait 4000 years, and then go down to earth as my own son and have myself killed by the local hegemonic power. And THEN I'll wait a few more centuries before having some white dudes over in the colder areas conquer the world for everyone to hear of this really awesome gift of self-death-and-thereby-forgiveness I gave them! FOOL PROOF."

If God were actually, you know, existent, and if he actually cared, and if he actually had some measure of control, the world would not look like it does what with all the abject horrors and sufferings (completely removed from free will, like guinea worms and tsunamis and such), and the whole universe being literally incomprehensibly vast, and so forth.

We'd all have proof that would fit our own definitions of "reason to believe." What'll get you believing is not what will get everyone believing, and an omniscient God would know that, an omnipotent would be able to provide tailor made proof, and an omnibenevolent God would want to.

It's one thing to be all "I want you to come to me!", but it's completely another to be Worlds Hide-and-Seek Champion levels of looking-like-you-don't-even-exist. Plus, why would you create a universe where rationality and evidence-based thinking can unlock the secrets of the cosmos and ease life for all people, but also points to you not existing because you're logically inconsistent as a concept and also evidentially lacking? And then say "Oh, if you use that brain I gave you, you're going to burn for all eternity!"? I mean burning people for eternity is in and of itself horrifyingly evil, but the trick of "I gave you these tools, but using them is WROOOONG!" is just like, sociopathic games level of evil. Of course, considering this is the same God that's supposedly created us with innate homosexuality and trans-sexuality (for those of us who are, anyway) and then says it's evil and wrong and we're bad bad people, it's kind of par for the course.


God may exist, but if he does, he's a lackwit and a sociopath. 

ranty~