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[Splint]

Certain other creatures could be allowed, namely trolls, ogres, and animal men (the former two and larger animal men consistently providing soldiers due to being big and strong creatures while the smaller animal men, due to being smaller and such, consistently give workers. This gives incentive to take these creatures alive instead of slaughtering them wholesale for practice.)

[than402]

Certain other creatures could be allowed, namely trolls, ogres, and animal men (the former two and larger animal men consistently providing soldiers due to being big and strong creatures while the smaller animal men, due to being smaller and such, consistently give workers. This gives incentive to take these creatures alive instead of slaughtering them wholesale for practice.)

good idea. it makes sense too.

At the current moment any creature with general poison can become larvae victims although I can easily make it do that if you want it to.

yeah, using a weasel to make a soldier doesn't make a lot of sense... let's just stick to bipedal humanoids

About the infectory thing, I was thinking of making it so that the workshop operator (will be called WO from now on) would get an interaction that could  give a larva an interaction that allows it to give the tamed animal the parasite syndrome that also gives it an interaction to kill the larva that infected it.

I actually like the infectory a lot.

the infectory works perfectly now, it's not a problem. pasture a slave and a larva nearby, activate the reaction and you have a new infected victim.

[heydude6]

There should still be some benefit to using other animals, I understand your weasel example, but what about emus, moose, alligators, elephants. It makes perfect sense to use animals such as these.

Wait, I have an idea, I'm thinking about giving the larvae syndrome a temporary bleeding effect. The small animals will bleed out while the large ones survive. I can also use SUCKS_BLOOD or whatever it was to keep the larvae intact.

[Splint]

I think the tag is [BLOODSUCKER], and agreed.

[than402]

There should still be some benefit to using other animals, I understand your weasel example, but what about emus, moose, alligators, elephants. It makes perfect sense to use animals such as these.

Wait, I have an idea, I'm thinking about giving the larvae syndrome a temporary bleeding effect. The small animals will bleed out while the large ones survive. I can also use SUCKS_BLOOD or whatever it was to keep the larvae intact.

wasps are humanoids. the larvae mutate the body alright, but when you have an emu, for example, how are you going to turn a bird into a humanoid?

one exception could be primates. a wasp should be able to make a worker out of a langure, or a soldier out of a silverback gorilla. but taking a gnu and making it a soldier? weird, don't you think?

[Splint]

It'd take extra work but using things like  water buffalo could result in varying kinds of bitey and hateful pet creatures with varying methods of attack and size.

Spoiler: Ideas (click to show/hide)

Large Avians (giant birds, large flightless ones like ostriches and emu,) result in a worker-sized flying pest control creature with an overwhelmingly painful sting, even compared to the sapient members of the hive; low staying power, but one hit is all they need to leave them helpless for the hive's soldiers to put down. Obviously not applicable against pain immune creatures.

Large grazers, like cows and yak: powerfully built rhino-beetle like creature with a powerful ramming attack.

Large predators, like tigers and lions and giant predatory mammals: moderately sized biting creature with a mild toxin that can cause some severe internal bleeding (the toxin attacking vital organs.) Large reptiles like giant snakes yield  fire-ball slinging inferno wasps, a buzzing nonsapient wasp able to spew flames (these would be the most dangerous but also the most powerful as a result, and getting them would require being in places with large snakes/other giant reptiles.)

Apes: Based on size, same process with sapient humanoids. Smaller ones give workers, larger ones soldiers. giant ones possibly praetorians. Speaking of humanoids, kobolds and gnomes should probably just be killed outright alongside small snakes and mammals.

The largest beasts such as elephants and sauropods result in the Earthshaker, a huge brute of an insect that relies upon its immense bulk and pain immunity to literally crush enemies into submission( generally by stomping them into paste,) and otherwise must be summoned, giving incentive to settle areas where these large animals dwell.

The result is other creatures find a use, resulting in expendable creatures that depending on your breeding program and local prey can be hurled at the enemy alongside abberants with reckless abandon, as nobody will care if they die. They can also potentially be extremely potent in a fight (the stinging and fire ones in particular,) but at the cost of not getting civ members and potentially poor staying power/life expectancy.

[heydude6]

wasps are humanoids. the larvae mutate the body alright, but when you have an emu, for example, how are you going to turn a bird into a humanoid?

one exception could be primates. a wasp should be able to make a worker out of a langure, or a soldier out of a silverback gorilla. but taking a gnu and making it a soldier? weird, don't you think?

Well Than, in real life parasitic wasps do not transform their prey, they are more like chestbursters, (although they come out fully grown). Here I spent some time drawing a diagram to show you what I mean

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

1. Here we have the majestic emu(staravia), majestic and large.
2. Oh, what's this? It looks like there is an almost fully grown hivemind wasp larva, how did that get in there? Hopefully everything will be fine (notice how it is entirely contained in what is essentially the upper body)
3. see, it's fine.
4. Uh what's that? Is it okay (usually parasitic wasps kill their prey and then spend the rest of their time eating out the insides)
5. Oh GOD!OH GOD! there are some things in this world that mankind was never meant to see (When the wasp has finished eating the inside, it begins to nibble a hole outside and bursts out.

So I hope this has done an adequate job explaining how a giant bird can be used to hatch Hivemind wasps. Many parasitic wasps choose caterpillar as their victim of choice. (even though they have no arms)

Splint about your ideas, they seem to be more fitting for tyranids rather than parasitic wasps (someone should really make a tyranids mod).Also very few people like firebreathing animals, they cause too much friendly fire.

[heydude6]

Anyways ignoring the above, let's talk about what we should do with warp stone. I say create a new workshop that allows you to change larvae so they can hatch into new wasp types.

Let the tyranids suggestions begin!

[Splint]

Take previously stated idea, use warpstone at the infection thing to allow the larvae to mutate based on host.

And people do like fire breathing creatures, it's just a matter of the soldiers they support generally being too flammable, relegating them to sentry duty and as semi-expendable megabeast killers (usually being used on web and dust FBs from what I've seen.)

[than402]

Well Than, in real life parasitic wasps do not transform their prey, they are more like chestbursters, (although they come out fully grown). Here I spent some time drawing a diagram to show you what I mean

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

1. Here we have the majestic emu(staravia), majestic and large.
2. Oh, what's this? It looks like there is an almost fully grown hivemind wasp larva, how did that get in there? Hopefully everything will be fine (notice how it is entirely contained in what is essentially the upper body)
3. see, it's fine.
4. Uh what's that? Is it okay (usually parasitic wasps kill their prey and then spend the rest of their time eating out the insides)
5. Oh GOD!OH GOD! there are some things in this world that mankind was never meant to see (When the wasp has finished eating the inside, it begins to nibble a hole outside and bursts out.

So I hope this has done an adequate job explaining how a giant bird can be used to hatch Hivemind wasps. Many parasitic wasps choose caterpillar as their victim of choice. (even though they have no arms)

Splint about your ideas, they seem to be more fitting for tyranids rather than parasitic wasps (someone should really make a tyranids mod).Also very few people like firebreathing animals, they cause too much friendly fire.

oh, is that how we're doing it? because i thought they transformed their prey, mind flayer style. yeah, it makes sense.

+1000 for the diagram

we already have two building which can summon creatures and two types of mutated wasps, so yet another way to obtain war animals or wasp mutants is redundant. one use for the warp stone could be as a reagent for a new set of laboratory reactions , which provide a small buff rather than swapping stats. warpstone is an uncommon resource, so it will be useful but not OP

[heydude6]

Hey Than, can we give the Praetorians NOEMOTION?

Also what do you think should be the minimum size for an animal to be able to become a wasp victim (rather than having them bleed out)?

And finally, I think your passive buffs idea for the warpstone is a bit too simple and boring, we need to make it something more interesting and shocking.

[than402]

Hey Than, can we give the Praetorians NOEMOTION?

Also what do you think should be the minimum size for an animal to be able to become a wasp victim (rather than having them bleed out)?

And finally, I think your passive buffs idea for the warpstone is a bit too simple and boring, we need to make it something more interesting and shocking.

we can, but praetorians are considered pets. Noemotion will do nothing.
As for the victim size... Well, elf sized sounds fine. And do you have any ideas about the warp stone?
As far as war beasts are concerned, wasps already have pretty much everything: from weak, rushable aberrants to basically Godzilla. Maybe we could give wasps the ability to process warpstone and use itemsyndrome to make arrows and bullets out of the new material. And when it hits a foe, he vomits for a while (best case scenario) or dies (if you're lucky).
But at the end of the day, it's just a poison with another name. That's the thing: wasps already have lots of stuff, so thinking new and shocking ones won't be as easy anymore.
Another thing I can think of would be to create flesh or bone golems of various sizes which leave behind a "golem remains" item that can raise them again at a very low cost.
That would be fun, but as you can see it merely adds yet more creatures, nothing truly new or refreshing.

[danmanthedog]

How about the ability to make different types of ammo by mixing warpstone with gems or poison. Like on that causes mass bleeding, sleeping, ect.

[than402]

yeah, ammo made out of warpstone would most probably work, but that's it basically: more poisons. which would be nice, giving the wasps their own unique poison system (and more war critters to throw at their enemies) alone is actually worth modding, but it's not a new feature. just expanding two already existing ones.

[Splint]

yeah, ammo made out of warpstone would most probably work, but that's it basically: more poisons. which would be nice, giving the wasps their own unique poison system (and more war critters to throw at their enemies) alone is actually worth modding, but it's not a new feature. just expanding two already existing ones.

It doesn't all have to be shiny and new. Reusing what you have available is just fine. Especially since you can only do so much with DF as it currently is.

Just have to work with what you have. Warlocks have thier skeletons, kobolds got their ogres, shalswars, and poisons, humans are merchants, succubi corruption and love of the arts, gnomes love machines, and orcs are built around being warriors. The hive has its various monsters and possibly more direct warpstone usage (resulting in some of said monsters,) and it's reproductive method.

I personally threw out a bunch of ideas for an independant human group (an order of militant religious warriors and thier attending order serfs,) which drew on a little bit from warlocks and orcs (being based around the use holy icons and baubles rather than souls and castes primarily being focused on killing all things evil while also being powerful combatants - who refuse to learn noncombat labors for the most part.) It was different and all, but still relied on things already there.