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[than402]

well, i admit i'm horrible at creating balanced stuff at the first try, but i thought it like that:

in the early game, it allows you to have a reasonable quantity of reasonable quality weapons by the first autumn (or even the first summer if you want to go for the cheapest variant) without needing to set up a metal industry (you can even embark without a pick, not dig a single block and you'll be fine and well armed for a good amount of time if you chose your embark items carefully). just kill and butcher some animals and turn their skin, meat and life force into axes with eyeballs

in the mid game, with all the dwarfite (they are evil, after all) and the caravans running around, it won't be very useful, unless you don't have access to good metals or fuel, in which case you can emphasize in your meat industry and arm yourself with pretty good equipment without using a single forge.

in the late game you'll probably have access to top tier metals. you'll also have access to a lot of resources, however, and that means that you'll be able to produce weapons from the best quality material (slightly better than steel but takes a lot of resources) automatically in masterwork quality.

so the primary purpose of these weapons is to make metal entirely optional for the wasps. at least that's how i thought it, suggestions are always welcome and your idea about them having automatic syndromes is good. i should really learn more about using itemsyndrome...

also note that what i wrote in my first post, about the time it takes for them to grow, is entirely debatable. on retrospective, it seems that i'll make the worst grade only grow in less than a month and the best in a year maximum.

[heydude6]

To be honest this sounds more like a suggestion that should be in any future elf modes

[than402]

I don't know, man. When I say organic weapon, picture soul edge and you'll be close. There is an actual elf mode in progress, by the way, but it's based on a vanilla mod rather than suggestions and such. It's just that I felt wasps could do with another unique feature, especially in the military.

[heydude6]

Well I have 1 idea I'm just throwing it out there.

Idea: Hive thralls

Rather than having the wasps use their newly captured host for themselves  they decide to let their smaller cousins have a turn.

When an enemy gets this certain syndrome (haven't thought of the method of application yet) they will transform into Hive thralls. Hive thralls are pets that your civ can acquire (no embarking with them) that are pretty much walking landmines. They run up to any enemy and then they explode in a cloud of wasps.

I had three ideas for them. They do not explode and they merely have a breath attack that is a cloud of wasps. Another idea was having the explosion create an amount of pain that would knock anyone unconscious (wasps are immune)

And a final idea was having a stationary hive creature that when killed would send a swarm of wasps to a random creature making it a hive thrall. And if that hive thrall was killed it would target another creature turning it into a hive thrall and it goes on (The logic being that these thrall wasps could turn anything into a nest)

Which idea do you like the most? The third one is the most powerful.

[Sagus]

well, i admit i'm horrible at creating balanced stuff at the first try, but i thought it like that:

Ah, I see. That's a good idea indeed. I do think that it'd be really interesting to make it their full substitute to metal. Llike, they wouldn't be able to use metal at all. But I don't see how that would be enforced, so providing organic weapons as alternatives would be the way to go.

Well I have 1 idea I'm just throwing it out there.

That's a really cool idea. Biological warfare could be another good distinguishing feature for the wasps.

I like the first idea best; I think a interesting way of doing this would be using the "organic weapon" method that than402 suggested to make some "egg arrows" (like, aerodynamic ovopositors ) and being hit with these arrows would give a chance of giving the target the infection.

Imagine how fun it'd be to shoot people with arrows that make them explode with wasps.

[Meph]

Uh, fancy. I always wanted to do a biological warfare thingy that allows to poison/infect an invaders in a way that slowly spreads through the entire invasion. Its on my list for Skaven, but instead of those I made Warlocks...

[heydude6]

So you are talking about idea 3 then. It's not guaranteed that it will get in unfortunately. I personally prefer idea 2. Mostly because it's the cheapest one and so I don't have to worry about making up some huge drawback to make it balanced.

[Sagus]

So you are talking about idea 3 then. It's not guaranteed that it will get in unfortunately. I personally prefer idea 2. Mostly because it's the cheapest one and so I don't have to worry about making up some huge drawback to make it balanced.

No no, I meant the "having the explosion create an amount of pain that would knock anyone unconscious" as well. The "exploding with wasps" was just a joke; like, the explosion is caused by a bunch of waps bursting from the person and knocking everyone around unconscious.

[than402]

that's a cool idea, heydude. i prefer the second option (we already have a stationary creature that sends swarms of wasps). we could apply it with a poison, or with a grown weapon and give it a low possibility to take effect, since it's an instakill, or through the infectory to turn an unfortunate "slave pet" into a hive thrall

No no, I meant the "having the explosion create an amount of pain that would knock anyone unconscious" as well. The "exploding with wasps" was just a joke; like, the explosion is caused by a bunch of waps bursting from the person and knocking everyone around unconscious.

and we could name the weapon "stomachache"

[slay_mithos]

I don't know how deep the 40.x versions are, but in theory, you could infect an invader, make him retreat, and infect his whole civ in a few years as a result.

Pretty sure it doesn't simulate that much, but it could be cool.

[heydude6]

It would be cool but it would destroy some of the !FUN!

[heydude6]

Hey Than I figured out why meph made it so that the hired castes had their interactions given by the regular humans, it turns out that units spawned with spawnunit don't have their interactions. It's a simple problem for me to fix though so nothing to worry about.

[than402]

i didn't knew that, heydude, thanks for letting me know

[than402]

hey. so, i modded both the organic weapons and the thralls (and a new workshop, plus a second one that is the infectory insane suggested). thralls now release a syndrome stone when killed that works with autosyndrome and administers strong pain, dizziness and blisters (at least that's how it's supposed to work, i'm still not sure if you can cause a pain effect though an inhaled or contact syndrome, so maybe i'll have to use CDIs).now i would like to expand their clothing options: what clothes do you believe wasp people should wear?

[heydude6]

Personally I think they should wear robes. Ideally I would like it if they wore nothing at all (I drew all of my sprites like that), but that's not possible since they will constantly get bad thoughts from being naked, so robes it is.

Reproduction system update: I have fixed many bugs that I have encountered, queens now lay eggs that hatch properly. Only one thing left is to make the hosts activate a makeown script immediately after they finished their transformation so the new wasps will be part of our civ, unfortunately I have a very busy day tomorrow so I won't be able to do any work on that day.

EDIT: New idea, ceremonial ornaments. (think of the stuff that tribes wear, such as necklaces, loincloths and anklets.) Another idea is tribal paint.

The thing is we need shoes, upperbody and lowerbody clothing.