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[Qassius]

There's some people that think that the specific arrest of the the guy into the unmarked vehicle was actually asset acquisition of some undercover or collecting some informant. You can kinda see the fed signal something with his hands, plus they never used handcuffs or any restraints. Which to be fair, if federal law enforcement were to be doing anything, it would be through undercover and clandestine means, rather than going in guns blazing.

[scriver]

"Wrist rockets"?

I have to say that shooting fireworks at people or rven just buildings is not in the same vein as spraying graffiti on walls by any means though. Those are explosives. There's a reason hospital staff hate all fireworksy holidays.

[delphonso]

There's some people that think that the specific arrest of the the guy into the unmarked vehicle was actually asset acquisition of some undercover or collecting some informant. You can kinda see the fed signal something with his hands, plus they never used handcuffs or any restraints. Which to be fair, if federal law enforcement were to be doing anything, it would be through undercover and clandestine means, rather than going in guns blazing.

It seems unlikely this is asset acquisition. I feel they would be better at that than just rolling up in a van and taking them. Especially in Portland during nationwide protest about cops breaking the law.

If everyone there is willing, this is more likely to be a planned discrediting of some organization. But that's for Infowars to come up with, because it is probably exactly what it looks like: cops abducting people.

[Virtz]

Oh no, a crackdown. How are idiots supposed to destroy federal property and throw shit at police officers from within a "peaceful protest" now? It's like there's actual consequences or something.

[hector13]

Oh hey it’s not like there’a a very important historical document that says the government can’t curb someone’s right to speak out against it.

Nothing that would be the basis for the founding of a nation or anything like that.

[delphonso]

Oh no, a crackdown. How are idiots supposed to destroy federal property and throw shit at police officers from within a "peaceful protest" now? It's like there's actual consequences or something.

Someone threw a rock. Time to start disappearing folks on the street.

That's hard to see as justice, Virtz.

[Dunamisdeos]

No see, protests are only peaceful if they don't cost anyone anything. You're supposed to make it as easy to ignore as possible. It's supposed to be a posturing thing, not a try to force a change thing.

[voliol]

One would think it would be hard to be angered and shocked by later atrocities, having heard of the previous ones. Turns out that is not the case. :/

Doesn't CBP file official arrest reports? I mean, if they don't it doesn't really matter if the agency gives a sweeping reason like "oh these people assaulted us first", it's still basically disappearing people.

[Virtz]

Oh hey it’s not like there’a a very important historical document that says the government can’t curb someone’s right to speak out against it.

Nothing that would be the basis for the founding of a nation or anything like that.

Pretty sure violence doesn't fall under that document. But keep pretending like you'd be fine having your windows broken and rocks thrown at you, cause that's just someone "speaking out against you".

Oh no, a crackdown. How are idiots supposed to destroy federal property and throw shit at police officers from within a "peaceful protest" now? It's like there's actual consequences or something.

Someone threw a rock. Time to start disappearing folks on the street.

That's hard to see as justice, Virtz.

Yes, "disappearing", like the ones who got released and told about it on twitter or whatever. Clearly we're dealing with the KGB or Gestapo.

What's happening now is basically a stop and search for people that committed crimes while in largely anonymous crowds with their identities concealed (and everyone else covering for them, cause "fuck the police"). It seems a pretty decent method of getting justice when dealing with violent individuals among a large anonymous crowd of people who refuse to cooperate.

And your idea of justice is so asinine to me it's not even funny. What you call "peaceful protest" is shit that'd get you dumped in prison even before the rocks started flying where I live, and here it's more often right-wing nationalists who clash with police because they don't understand a pride parade has a right to be there. You are abusing your right of protest and you're completely blind to it because it's your side doing this horseshit.

It's also wonderfully naive that you look at throwing rocks as harmless (and also ignore that it's not just rocks being thrown). They can kill people. They are still used for executions in certain parts of the world and, in the form of slings, were a weapon of warfare in ancient times, used on battlefields alongside spears, swords and shields. Maybe the cops should counter rocks by going Byzantine on them then, eh?

No see, protests are only peaceful if they don't cost anyone anything. You're supposed to make it as easy to ignore as possible. It's supposed to be a posturing thing, not a try to force a change thing.

The only thing you're really changing this way is persuading locals to vote against you. Nobody likes loud obnoxious self-righteous morons vandalising their neighbourhood.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

You forgot to call antifa the real fascists.

[Iduno]

Oh no, a crackdown. How are idiots supposed to destroy federal property and throw shit at police officers from within a "peaceful protest" now? It's like there's actual consequences or something.

Someone threw a rock. Time to start disappearing folks on the street.

That's hard to see as justice, Virtz.

And considering how many times in the last few months police have been seen planting weapons to justify further violence, a protestor throwing a rock seems about as likely as an undercover officer doing it as well.

(comment removed)

[Dostoevsky]

I have to say that shooting fireworks at people or rven just buildings is not in the same vein as spraying graffiti on walls by any means though. Those are explosives. There's a reason hospital staff hate all fireworksy holidays.

Yeah, fireworks can be very dangerous, I just found the "mortar-style" an amusing moniker to attach. Like an attempt to make it sound more militaristic.

I was probably being a little too flippant initially - my point wasn't that there was no real violence, more that CBP was lumping in a bunch of minor stuff with a few significant events in an effort to make it sound like "under siege for 47 days straight."

Doesn't CBP file official arrest reports? I mean, if they don't it doesn't really matter if the agency gives a sweeping reason like "oh these people assaulted us first", it's still basically disappearing people.

In at least some of the cases being reported on, people are being "detained" without any report ever being filed. One of those semi-technicalities to try and get around legal requirements.

Yes, "disappearing", like the ones who got released and told about it on twitter or whatever. Clearly we're dealing with the KGB or Gestapo.

What's happening now is basically a stop and search for people that committed crimes while in largely anonymous crowds with their identities concealed (and everyone else covering for them, cause "fuck the police"). It seems a pretty decent method of getting justice when dealing with violent individuals among a large anonymous crowd of people who refuse to cooperate.

Setting aside some of the broader trends of local or state police detaining nonviolent (often non-white) people without even filing proper charges and the like, what's going in here is federal enforcement officials taking the broadest possible interpretation of their legal rights/abilities in terms of policing.

The federal government does not have general policing power. Yes there's the FBI, but they are limited to the realm of federal crimes, which are a pretty limited subset of criminal law. Most criminal law, and general policing power, is within the realm of state authority and enforced by state police.

Under normal circumstances federal "police" (not sure this CBP is technically police) patrolling the streets would raise huge red flags among conservatives as a federal invasion of state rights, but these are the days we're in.

(All that said, you are correct that I was being at least somewhat excessive calling it gestapo. Not to say there haven't been plenty of incidents of both state and federal police murdering people, but there hasn't been true 'disappearing' yet here.)

[kaijyuu]

Property damage! The horror!

Obviously property is worth more than life and limb!

[scriver]

Honesty I haven't been keeping up so I'm not sure about the level of violence and repression that's currently being used by police but from where I'm standing the biggest issue with the new developments is the appearance of "federal" unmarked people rather the local state authorities that is doing it. It's definitely the most police state the USA have gone in my life as far as I can remember at least.

[ChairmanPoo]

The state has the right and the duty to enforce order, with lethal force if necessary. Law abiding citizens of the approved hues and social strata have nothing to fear.