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[Frumple]

Hopefully it doesn't and we actually see some positive change, yeah. Won't be holding my breath, but it'd be good to see. Given a great deal of the country's attitude towards perceived criminals, though... m'doubtful. Actually being armed undermines a great deal of potential popular support. Not that there's spectacular amounts even when the victim is unarmed, most of the time

[SalmonGod]

I've seen at least three other cases of police refusing to offer help to a dying person and refusing to allow others to help.  These are just off the top of my head.

One

Two (What this doesn't show and which is hard to dig up now, but I clearly remember:  The other veterans present tried to help Nick, but police forced them away and insisted that no one could touch him and that he would not be moved until he regained consciousness and asked for help himself.  Of course, when he did, they responded by throwing him in a van for several hours.  A horse had just stomped on his head.  That could have easily been fatal and the severity of the wound needed to be check.)

And... I can't find the third one.  I swear I posted the story on these boards 2-3 years ago, but I can't find it now.  What I recall is a family called for help with their son, who was behaving angry and confused.  I think he may have had a history of depression or other mental illness.  An officer showed up and ordered to kid to surrender to arrest.  He didn't comply, so he shot the kid with a taser.  He still didn't comply (the police story was that he then attacked the officer, but the family witnesses claim he only stood there and balled his fists), so he then shot the kid with his gun.  He then refused to allow the family near their son and refused to call for medical help for hours afterwards, essentially forcing the family to helplessly watch him die in front of them.  The father then claims to have discovered later via FOIA request that it's department policy to refuse medical aid to someone that has been fatally wounded by an officer, basically because it causes less trouble for them that way.  I can't easily find this one on google either, because searching for similar cases where parents calling for help with a mentally ill child resulted in killing of that child brings up dozens of cases in 2014 alone.

[MonkeyHead]

See, this is exactly why the US police have such a shit reputation. OK, discharge a firearm with the concept of the greater good in mind, but then for fucks sake bring in medical attention so justice can be seen to be done and to avoid things looking like a summary execution - Judge Dredd style. For years I suspect public opinion has been "So what - he pulled a gun on the cops..." but now greater connectivity over the internet and greater freedom of information via social networking is allowing issues like these to see the light, and rightfully people are not happy.

[DG]

Guys keep pulling out guns and the police keep shooting them first. It seems US cops are as talented with their guns as they are terrified of the public. And it seems the recklessness of the suspects is only matched by their ineptitude with guns.

[smeeprocket]

I'll just put this here...

http://www.tmz.com/2014/12/23/michael-brown-song-video-dead-police-parody-leroy-brown/

[wobbly]

I'm not really informed on these kind of things, so I'm wondering... What's the situation like in Australia?

In terms of racism or guns? There's certainly problems, but it's rare for someone to pull a gun on the police or vice versa. Certainly happens, but far less common then the US. Not sure if your Australian yourself or not but if you are have a look next time you see a cop. You'll find some of them are carrying, some of them not. You also find procedure is quite different. Police are more likely to respond in numbers to a trouble spot & the attitudes are a lot less gung-ho. I actually watched a low speed car chase the other day, thing was pretty funny. The guy must of only been doing about 50 km/hr & the police were just following him as he looped round the block. Guy has to stop eventually right?

[smeeprocket]

A Conservative Australian leader and some of his party took one for the team and outlawed a number of firearms iirc. Helped a lot with gun deaths.

[SalmonGod]

I actually watched a low speed car chase the other day, thing was pretty funny. The guy must of only been doing about 50 km/hr & the police were just following him as he looped round the block. Guy has to stop eventually right?

This is where I take issue with so much police behavior in the U.S..  They could resolve so many of these situations without anyone getting hurt if they'd approach them with some strategy and patience.  But they always seem to want to jump in head first and make things as dangerous as they can possibly be for everyone, including themselves.

There's another incident making the internet rounds recently where an officer walked into a situation and literally said "We don't have time for this" before shooting a restrained teenager dead, right in front of his parents.

And I'm sure many people would reason that this must be some symptom of an under-staffing problem.  Too few police dealing with too many problems, and don't feel like they can take a patient approach to each one.  But that doesn't make any sense, because isn't there a crap load of stuff that needs to be done following any fatality in a police encounter?  Scene has to be blocked off and manned for hours, followed by many more hours of paperwork and meetings with investigators/supervisors and likely time in court?  How can they have time for all that?

[smeeprocket]

yea that kid was schizophrenic and having an episode. I'm sure nothing came of it. The police don't protect us, they murder us.

[SalmonGod]

The shit may finally be approaching the fan.

Police are retaliating against the recent vigilante murders by arresting people for expressing violent sentiments towards police online.

So we have an intensifying wave of vigilantism directed at police, and police responding by witch hunt.  I'll be surprised if 2015 doesn't see a lot more violence between citizens and police, and probably more rioting.

[Xantalos]

'We don't have time for this?' The hell is this even.

The shit may finally be approaching the fan.

Police are retaliating against the recent vigilante murders by arresting people for expressing violent sentiments towards police online.

So we have an intensifying wave of vigilantism directed at police, and police responding by witch hunt.  I'll be surprised if 2015 doesn't see a lot more violence between citizens and police, and probably more rioting.

I feel suddenly more concerned that my friend got her passport renewed recently.

[Glowcat]

The shit may finally be approaching the fan.

Police are retaliating against the recent vigilante murders by arresting people for expressing violent sentiments towards police online.

So we have an intensifying wave of vigilantism directed at police, and police responding by witch hunt.  I'll be surprised if 2015 doesn't see a lot more violence between citizens and police, and probably more rioting.

Suddenly I'm reminded by how police almost never seriously act upon online threats against specific individuals, now going gungho on general anti-police sentiments. The way similar laws are applied differently based on who is effected is a funny thing.

[SalmonGod]

The shit may finally be approaching the fan.

Police are retaliating against the recent vigilante murders by arresting people for expressing violent sentiments towards police online.

So we have an intensifying wave of vigilantism directed at police, and police responding by witch hunt.  I'll be surprised if 2015 doesn't see a lot more violence between citizens and police, and probably more rioting.

Suddenly I'm reminded by how police almost never seriously act upon online threats against specific individuals, now going gungho on general anti-police sentiments. The way similar laws are applied differently based on who is effected is a funny thing.

The thing that strikes me most about it is how so many of these officers involved in wrongful death cases have histories of abusing their power or expressing violent sentiments towards the demographic they end up killing before the event.  They could prevent just as many deaths, if not more, by taking that stuff seriously.  But it's quite plain that they only care about the lives of their own.

[Strife26]

Guys keep pulling out guns and the police keep shooting them first. It seems US cops are as talented with their guns as they are terrified of the public. And it seems the recklessness of the suspects is only matched by their ineptitude with guns.

US Cops are actually really really bad at shooting things as a general rule.

Like terrifyingly bad.

[MonkeyHead]

Guys keep pulling out guns and the police keep shooting them first. It seems US cops are as talented with their guns as they are terrified of the public. And it seems the recklessness of the suspects is only matched by their ineptitude with guns.

US Cops are actually really really bad at shooting things as a general rule.

Like terrifyingly bad.

One worries just how many body bags would be needed over there if they were actually skilled marksmen armed with something other than generally pistols.