Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[penguinofhonor]

.

[Bohandas]

Large insects are only a thing if you go 100's of kilometers away from civilization and camp out in the rainforest. That's like 2000 kilometers away from where I live and doesn't affect me. The most dangerous thing within 1000KM of me is a koala.

A spider hasn't killed anyone in Australia since the 1970's.

There is no "video game tax", and the refusal to have an R18 rating for games effectively means that children can buy GTA5 here as a kid's game (you can get GTA5 and it's M15 here). So actually, games classification are more lax here, not more strict.

What about the weird and oddly specific restrictions on pornography then? I heard that due to a poorly worded law it was illegal in Austrailia for pornography to feature any woman with non-enormous breasts because otherwise under that particular law it would for some reason be considered tantamount to child pornography; and as a result people who don't like obviously fake breasts are shit out of luck if they're trying to buy porn in Austrailia.

EDIT:
IIRC I believe there was also another incident regarding the same law in which a judge was forced to rule that cartoon characters were legally people. That's even crazier than the Citizens United vs FEC ruling here in the United States.

[Leafsnail]

Are you seriously praising Australia because their police shot a guy dead and weren't fired?
Just because the coroner (the coroner??) "reprimanded" them for *inciting* the guy?

I... I think I'm out.  Good luck, have fun.

Even for a parting shot this is pretty lame.

[SalmonGod]

If you want a much more clear-cut case of an officer being fired for trying to do the right thing, look up Regina Tasca. 

She was first responder to a call for help from a parent whose son was behaving erratically, and wanted help getting him to a hospital.  This person was not armed, and IIRC was not making threats or behaving aggressively.  Just acting troubled and uncooperative.  So Regina is the first officer to arrive, begins talking with the guy, and is having success calming him down.  Two more officers arrive.  One immediately charges and tackles the kid to the ground, and holds him down while the other officer begins punching him in the head.  Regina tries to intervene and stop the unnecessary violence, and is quickly fired for it, under the pretense that she is "psychologically unfit" to be a police officer.

How these cops, which tend to be huge guys, can so completely fail to immobilize tiny people without shocking them and beating them, is beyond me. And shit, the vest is meant for bullets but I guarantee you it would take the edge off most body blows. I'm not a cop. I'm just some guy. But I guarantee you I could immobilize most people smaller than me without doing as much harm to them as these cops seem so intent on doing.

Somebody who actually has combat training should be able to do a lot better.

Seriously.  I did wrestling for 4 years.  I've taken down and immobilized people of a very large range of sizes, athletic ability, and training levels thousands of times, including people with military combat training.  I've also put that stuff to use in real situations a couple times, including catching somebody's wrist when they tried to stab me with a knife in the midst of a hysterical emotional outburst. 

At least when dealing with an unarmed person, I can say with at least some authority that there is absolutely no excuse for multiple trained adults being unable to subdue someone without serious injury or the use of weapons.  The very idea is absurd to me.  But it's not something I try to challenge much, because people are all "YOU JUST DON'T KNOW" and I'm a type who would much rather argue the principle of the matter - that the very concept of what it means to be a police officer is to face dangerous situations and accept personal risk in order to protect a community.  An officer who harms others for the sake of protecting only themselves against an unverified threat or simply to make their jobs easier is more of a danger to the community than anything else, and we would be better off without them.  All they are at that point is another threat to ordinary citizens.


On a lighter note - here's some Saturday Night Live

Spoiler: This one cuts deep... (click to show/hide)

[Bohandas]

You know, if the protesters are being antagonized by the police, shouldn't they be directing their riots towards police property, picketing at police stations, and doing their best to protest against the police, a la India? Even though it's clear I don't exactly think highly of the current US police force, the defensive shouldn't be forcefully dragging third parties into what is essence their conflict against them, and I doubt that these sort of stunts exactly endear them to the public.

Yeah, they're definitely getting off message. If they really feel they must resort to violence then they should lynch Darren Wilson and that crooked prosecutor instead of harsssing innocent people.

Yeah. They

[Rolan7]

Are you seriously praising Australia because their police shot a guy dead and weren't fired?
Just because the coroner (the coroner??) "reprimanded" them for *inciting* the guy?

I... I think I'm out.  Good luck, have fun.

Even for a parting shot this is pretty lame.

And calling me names as I try to leave the discussion is cool, right?  Why address the point when you can hop on the bandwagon, particularly when I implied I wouldn't reply?

It's just too hypocritical for me.  People here are simultaneously saying they can personally tackle anyone smaller than them, so these "huge" American cops should be able to defuse situations through wrestling...  But then some Australian cops *incite* a guy into charging them with a knife, shoot the guy dead, and suddenly Australia is a shining example because the coroner complained.  The *coroner*.  Complained.

The similarities and differences with the Ferguson case are obvious, too.

[Leafsnail]

If you didn't want anyone to reply to it and you didn't want to defend it yourself then why post it at all?  If you want to stop talking about something then just stop posting, don't try and throw in some arrogant parting shot that implies you're better than everyone else, particularly when it's as dishonest and selectively read as the one you made.

Firstly the focus of Reelya's post (and the focus of praise for the only other person who responded positively to it - note that two people would not, in any case, justify your parting shot against the entire thread) was on the first story, which involved police officers being disciplined for negligence.  That alone is a pretty impressive achievement compared to the US, where police officers can fatally shoot or strangle unarmed black people with no consequences.

The second story is notable because "police officer shoots an armed individual" would not be questioned for one second in the US.  I mean there are plenty of cases where cops have shot unarmed people and it's been ruled that eh, the black person probably did something to deserve it, whatever.  The idea of "incitement" would not even be considered (indeed, you do not consider it at all when attempting to defend Wilson's actions - if this incident happened in the US you'd be jumping to defend the cop).

[SalmonGod]

Small article from an ex-St Louis cop

[Rolan7]

If you didn't want anyone to reply to it and you didn't want to defend it yourself then why post it at all?  If you want to stop talking about something then just stop posting, don't try and throw in some arrogant parting shot that implies you're better than everyone else, particularly when it's as dishonest and selectively read as the one you made.

I was primarily responding to nenjin, who was "Jealous of Australia" in light of these deaths.  It does apply to anyone being hypocritical about it, though.  Nothing in my post suggested I was better than anyone.  You shot at me as I tried to leave, calling my post "lame" without any explanation.  And it's me that's smug and arrogant?

Firstly the focus of Reelya's post (and the focus of praise for the only other person who responded positively to it - note that two people would not, in any case, justify your parting shot against the entire thread) was on the first story, which involved police officers being disciplined for negligence.  That alone is a pretty impressive achievement compared to the US, where police officers can fatally shoot or strangle unarmed black people with no consequences.

"No consequences"...  Whatever.  You didn't back it up, I won't refute it.

In the Australian case, a medical expert opined that the death was avoidable.  Actually reading the article reveals:

"It was primarily Craig Douglas' actions that were patently dangerous and precipitous, and were the principle causal factor,"

So despite the officers provoking the suspect with "gung-ho" behavior, and the death being avoidable if the police had behaved professionally, the coroner definitely places the blame on the dead suspect.  Isn't that a massive no-no, here?

Yes, Nenjin was probably focusing on the case which let him admire Australia.  That doesn't change the fact that there was no outcry here over the other case, despite it being in some ways worse than Ferguson.

The second story is notable because "police officer shoots an armed individual" would not be questioned for one second in the US.  I mean there are plenty of cases where cops have shot unarmed people and it's been ruled that eh, the black person probably did something to deserve it, whatever.  The idea of "incitement" would not even be considered (indeed, you do not consider it at all when attempting to defend Wilson's actions - if this incident happened in the US you'd be jumping to defend the cop).

The unrestrained college student suspect had a knife in the room and was non-compliant, yet people here are assuming he didn't need to be *tased*.  Much less shot.

And incitement is the main charge people are leveling at Wilson!  Brown was justified in punching him and grabbing at his gun because Wilson "pulled up to him rapidly" or "got too close".

You have a point, though, that I am dismissive of Wilson's supposed incitement (and very skeptical).  But I didn't say the Australian cops were at fault for inciting, either.  I'm asking, if inciting made everything Wilson's fault, why aren't people outraged at the Australian cops for doing it?  It seems hypocritical.

[Phmcw]

Because the problem is bigger than the police? Black people in America have been facing these problems for generations, and a huge part of what makes progress so slow is the public's apathy towards it. Yeah, everyone would rather forget about it and get to work on time and fawn over the royal couple. Just get right back to the status quo.

They don't want to adress it because the problem is bigger than race.

We could start to change that by mandating that a special prosecutor be appointed to try excessive force cases. And we need more independent oversight, with teeth. I have little confidence in internal investigations.

Hear hear! That's the most obvious thing I heard all year, and I cannot understand why you don't ask less nicely. Seriously you cannot call your thugs a "police force" as long as you don't have that. Right now, your "police" is not much more than a well armed gang, literally. That's why I said it's more than a race problem : having a gang as a police force is... quite a problem in itself? That the gang in question seems to be a subsidiary of "aryan nation" is just a detail.

If you didn't want anyone to reply to it and you didn't want to defend it yourself then why post it at all?  If you want to stop talking about something then just stop posting, don't try and throw in some arrogant parting shot that implies you're better than everyone else, particularly when it's as dishonest and selectively read as the one you made.

I was primarily responding to nenjin, who was "Jealous of Australia" in light of these deaths.  It does apply to anyone being hypocritical about it, though.  Nothing in my post suggested I was better than anyone.  You shot at me as I tried to leave, calling my post "lame" without any explanation.  And it's me that's smug and arrogant?

Firstly the focus of Reelya's post (and the focus of praise for the only other person who responded positively to it - note that two people would not, in any case, justify your parting shot against the entire thread) was on the first story, which involved police officers being disciplined for negligence.  That alone is a pretty impressive achievement compared to the US, where police officers can fatally shoot or strangle unarmed black people with no consequences.

"No consequences"...  Whatever.  You didn't back it up, I won't refute it.

In the Australian case, a medical expert opined that the death was avoidable.  Actually reading the article reveals:

"It was primarily Craig Douglas' actions that were patently dangerous and precipitous, and were the principle causal factor,"

So despite the officers provoking the suspect with "gung-ho" behavior, and the death being avoidable if the police had behaved professionally, the coroner definitely places the blame on the dead suspect.  Isn't that a massive no-no, here?

Yes, Nenjin was probably focusing on the case which let him admire Australia.  That doesn't change the fact that there was no outcry here over the other case, despite it being in some ways worse than Ferguson.

The second story is notable because "police officer shoots an armed individual" would not be questioned for one second in the US.  I mean there are plenty of cases where cops have shot unarmed people and it's been ruled that eh, the black person probably did something to deserve it, whatever.  The idea of "incitement" would not even be considered (indeed, you do not consider it at all when attempting to defend Wilson's actions - if this incident happened in the US you'd be jumping to defend the cop).

The unrestrained college student suspect had a knife in the room and was non-compliant, yet people here are assuming he didn't need to be *tased*.  Much less shot.

And incitement is the main charge people are leveling at Wilson!  Brown was justified in punching him and grabbing at his gun because Wilson "pulled up to him rapidly" or "got too close".

You have a point, though, that I am dismissive of Wilson's supposed incitement (and very skeptical).  But I didn't say the Australian cops were at fault for inciting, either.  I'm asking, if inciting made everything Wilson's fault, why aren't people outraged at the Australian cops for doing it?  It seems hypocritical.

I agree with Rolan7 there, the cop should have been at least fired for gross incompetence and possibly sued.

Edit : I mean according the expert, his gross incompetence is indirectly resonsible for a loss of life.

[penguinofhonor]

.

[Mictlantecuhtli]

Lol. Of course, the police are always right. This topic is funny.

I agree with Rolan7 there, the cop should have been at least fired for gross incompetence and possibly sued.

Lol.

[Phmcw]

Because the problem is bigger than the police? Black people in America have been facing these problems for generations, and a huge part of what makes progress so slow is the public's apathy towards it. Yeah, everyone would rather forget about it and get to work on time and fawn over the royal couple. Just get right back to the status quo.

They don't want to adress it because the problem is bigger than race.

Yeah, that's totally why people are reacting the same way to these as they always do towards any protest that inconveniences them. Because the American public all agrees with you. That's definitely what's going on here.

The American public? Reacting? You guys don't have public healthcare, or paid holllyday, or affordable superior education, or mass public transit, or a real police fore, or affordable justice, or any kind of government accountability, or ....

The American public is the most apathetic in the whole fucking world. Your governement don't offer your the services given by a third world country's one. And your police force seems worst than Brazil's. Let's not forget the absolutely insane incarceration rate and total laxism of the food and drug administration.

[penguinofhonor]

.

[smjjames]

Maybe we're apathetic because our government sucks? I dunno.

I don't know why we're apathetic really.

Also, personally, I don't care about the royal couple.

As for mass transit, you try setting up a continent wide mass transit system and our cities have mass transit in various forms.