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Author Topic: Do you guys check strength, toughness, patience, etc. when embarking?  (Read 3333 times)

raiker123

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I mean, do you choose the skills to assign a dwarf based on their attributes or just load a profile and go? Does it make much of a difference?
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Pirate Bob

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Re: Do you guys check strength, toughness, patience, etc. when embarking?
« Reply #1 on: August 12, 2014, 12:07:01 pm »

I sometimes make sure that dwarves I assign to be my top military have good strength, toughness, etc, as then when they get to be legendary they max out at a higher level (I believe max in a stat is twice the starting value).  Otherwise I don't think it matters all that much, but I'm not sure.  It would be interesting to take a compare a dwarf who starts with poor stats relevant to weaponsmithing (according to the wiki, agility, creativity, endurance, kinesthetic sense, strength, spatial sense) and another with high starting stats, and see if there is a difference in the rate of obtaining masterwork weapons when they reach legendary status.  Has anyone tried anything like this?  If not, I believe !!SCIENCE!! is needed...  :)

Edit - from the wiki
Quote
attribute_cap = starting_value + max {starting_value, median}
In other words, if the dwarf starts with a below average value in a stat, they can still raise it to above average, but not to extraordinary.  The stat gains seem to generally be quite fast in most cases, so that dwarf with poor stats gets up to above average pretty quick, and it probably doesn't matter.  But, like I said above, it would be interesting if your rate of masterworks is impacted by having "a boundless creative imagination" vs. just "good creativity".  I suspect the change would be small, and that the rarity of having a dwarf who has good or poor stats in *all* the areas relevant to a given skill would make whatever impact there is nearly undetectable.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2014, 12:16:51 pm by Pirate Bob »
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flameaway

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Re: Do you guys check strength, toughness, patience, etc. when embarking?
« Reply #2 on: August 12, 2014, 01:40:07 pm »

I tend to embark with peasants and then let my dwarves gain on the job experience. But I generally hang out in calm environments so that I can build things more easily. Tougher environs will need more skilled migrants. In that situation you are saving training time so maybe personality matching might give an edge.  I'd be interested to hear from folks that mess about in the haunted and terrifying biomes setup how they set up an embark.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2014, 01:45:01 pm by flameaway »
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Re: Do you guys check strength, toughness, patience, etc. when embarking?
« Reply #3 on: August 12, 2014, 02:34:40 pm »

I mainly look at their preferences. I want my dorfs to be happy, so I try to give them jobs they'll enjoy.

A dwarf who likes barrels will be a brewer. A dwarf who likes plump helmets will be a grower (or a brewer, but the brewer is already here). A dwarf who likes cages will be a mechanic.

I also try to preserve certain dwarves for moods. If a dwarf likes zinc and picks, I'll give him a point in Weaponsmith and then fill him up with Woodcutter and Herbalism; but if he likes iron and picks, I'll make him a miner. I don't have much need for an artifact iron pick, but I never smelt zinc, so I can force Mr. Zinc-Pick to make me an artifact steel pick instead.
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Skullsploder

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Re: Do you guys check strength, toughness, patience, etc. when embarking?
« Reply #4 on: August 12, 2014, 02:44:12 pm »

If you want to get an artifact steel pick, all you have to do is find a dwarf with a preference for picks, material preference doesn't matter. When he starts his mood, forbid every metal bar except steel using the stocks menu. He won't touch anything except the steel, even if he has a preference for copper and you have literally thousands of bars of copper lying around his feet.
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greycat

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Re: Do you guys check strength, toughness, patience, etc. when embarking?
« Reply #5 on: August 12, 2014, 03:22:28 pm »

I look at the starting 7 before embark, yes.  Probably not as much as I should, but there's just SO MUCH text, and it's not all ordered or highlighted....

I look for strength first, and avoid putting "very weak" or "unquestionably weak" in any military job, or any job that moves heavy things.  I'll also disable certain hauling labors on those dwarves post-embark, if I remember -- furniture, wood, and vehicles.  They SUCK so profoundly now... even hauling a single log (other than feather wood) is slower for "very weak" dwarves in 0.40, let alone furniture hauling (my god), and don't even try putting armor on them.

I also look for creativity (or lack thereof), and try to put the creative dwarves in jobs that churn out quality-modified things (mason, craftsdwarf, carpenter, mechanic), and the uncreative in non-quality jobs (farmer, butcher, tanner, etc.).

I look for bravery or cowardice, and try to avoid putting cowardly dwarves in the military.  But if a dwarf has exceptional physical stats, loves fighting, etc. I might put them in the military despite a slight cowardly streak, figuring some Discipline will override it.

Post-embark, I look for "likes helping others" or "hates helping others".  The former, I turn on all healthcare labors.  The latter, I turn off all healthcare (including recovering wounded, and feeding/watering).
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Panando

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Re: Do you guys check strength, toughness, patience, etc. when embarking?
« Reply #6 on: August 12, 2014, 09:09:35 pm »

I look at attributes for my military. The best military attribute is probably agility - strength only really matters for blunt weapons I believe. Slow to tire is a useful quality because it makes it take longer for a dwarf to pass out from exhaustion - of course slow to tire is useful for all dwarves. Willpower is also a useful quality for military dwarves, because it makes them more resistant to passing out from pain. I'm not sure how much toughness and quick to heal matter, mostly I rely on dwarves not getting injured in the first place.

If a dwarf is 'very agile' I consider him a candidate even if all his other attributes suck. Dwarves who are strong or mighty tend to get issued blunt weapons. Willpower, toughness, and quick to heal only really matter if a dwarf gets injured.

All dwarves with physically good attributes get recruited into the army, meaning the workforce is left with the dregs. The only exception to this is dwarves with very desirable civilian skills, I might let a dwarf who likes steel and battle axes become a weaponsmith if I'm otherwise deprived of weaponsmiths.
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Melting Sky

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Re: Do you guys check strength, toughness, patience, etc. when embarking?
« Reply #7 on: August 12, 2014, 11:11:33 pm »

Yes, I always look at their stats and figure out which roll they can fill best and even customize the rolls to fit the original 7. If they are truly horrible with just a giant sheet of red stats then I will exit the embark and try again. It's pretty much the one exploit I will abuse. I take a personal interest in the lives and sagas of the starting 7 so I try to make sure they are a compelling group.

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int_ua

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Re: Do you guys check strength, toughness, patience, etc. when embarking?
« Reply #8 on: August 13, 2014, 05:00:38 am »

FYI: Latest versions of Dwarf Therapist have a Roles tab that will show you which jobs are the best for every dwarf.
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celem

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Re: Do you guys check strength, toughness, patience, etc. when embarking?
« Reply #9 on: August 13, 2014, 05:54:29 am »

I have only 1 such care at embark.  The miner must be agile as I can find.  The idea being that the major bottleneck in the first season or two when still 7 pop is how quickly the miners get spaces dug.  Assuming that I bring proficient miners anyway, the only way to accelerate them further is to have them be generally fast walkers.

It has also happened on occasion that I pick a noble/medic style embark dwarf with regards to their stats.  (occasionally i take one that is, i always check his stats if i do)
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NullForceOmega

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Re: Do you guys check strength, toughness, patience, etc. when embarking?
« Reply #10 on: August 13, 2014, 06:00:53 am »

I care nothing for physical attributes and likes/dislikes, I am exclusively interested in the soul attributes, if you don't at least like to try new things, you aren't getting anywhere near my forges, if you strive for excellence, you are now a metalworker.  Creativity?  Stone Corps.  Lazy bastard?  Welcome to farming.  Reliable?  Hope you like trees.  Overachiever?  Hi, new administrator.  Sense of duty?  Here are your weapons and armor, get training.
Apparently my style of work distribution is strange tho'.
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Teldin

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Re: Do you guys check strength, toughness, patience, etc. when embarking?
« Reply #11 on: August 13, 2014, 07:06:56 am »

Preferences?! My dwarves work how I want them to work, choices be damned. It's a dwarf's duty to do their job, and do it well. If they don't like it they can take it up with the mayor or punch a cat.
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Re: Do you guys check strength, toughness, patience, etc. when embarking?
« Reply #12 on: August 13, 2014, 10:18:35 am »

If you want to get an artifact steel pick, all you have to do is find a dwarf with a preference for picks, material preference doesn't matter. When he starts his mood, forbid every metal bar except steel using the stocks menu.

That's not true. Material preference matters if you've previously smelted a bar of their preference at the fort, and if you haven't smelted adamantium yet. The material preference order goes as follows:

  • Adamantium if it's ever been smelted on-site (accept no substitutes)
  • Preference metal if it's ever been smelted on-site (accept no substitutes)
  • Preference metal
  • Whatever's available

Trust me. I didn't want to make a platinum battleaxe, but I didn't have a choice.
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ComatosePhoenix

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Re: Do you guys check strength, toughness, patience, etc. when embarking?
« Reply #13 on: August 13, 2014, 10:27:35 am »

I thoroughly dislike micromanaging my dwarfs that much, I might bother to remember the names of the embarking 7 but since the migrant waves are pretty much random I think that attempting to manage the individual attributes of your group is an exercise in futility, or a kind of Eugenics Megaproject that doesn't actually fall into my perspective of fun.
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Uristides

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Re: Do you guys check strength, toughness, patience, etc. when embarking?
« Reply #14 on: August 13, 2014, 10:58:32 am »

I don't like to micromanage my embark much. Unless I'm trying something special, like an evil or  woodless embark I just go with my Profile and don't even look at who gets what job.
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