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[LordBucket]

Feminism is still very much necessary.

Continuing to push a pendulum towards its rest state right up to the very moment it reaches it rarely results in a pendulum at rest.

[alexandertnt]

It is when there are people pushing the other way.

[EnigmaticHat]

Pendulum would imply human history has been a cycle between male dominated and female dominated.

[GavJ]

Feminism is still very much necessary.

Continuing to push a pendulum towards its rest state right up to the very moment it reaches it rarely results in a pendulum at rest.

This robot disagrees:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6vr1x6KDaY

[Jelle]

Feminism is still very much necessary.

Continuing to push a pendulum towards its rest state right up to the very moment it reaches it rarely results in a pendulum at rest.

Absolutely agree. People are kinda bipolar like that, always pushing for one extreme in reaction to another.

As for my opinion on feminism. I'm all for gender equality, feminism...not so much.

Pendulum would imply human history has been a cycle between male dominated and female dominated.

There have, however, been plenty of cultural shifts that fit the description. Just look at all the cultural movement in history (e.g enlightenment -> romanticism).

[alexandertnt]

Throughout this thread people have framed feminism is "extreme" and just as frequently failed to explain why.

[LordBucket]

Throughout this thread people have framed feminism is "extreme" and just as frequently failed to explain why.

Attempting to do so leads to 'No True Scotsman.'

[Neonivek]

Throughout this thread people have framed feminism is "extreme" and just as frequently failed to explain why.

Attempting to do so leads to 'No True Scotsman.'

Plus as with most things.. how many times have you saw something really distasteful and your first instinct is to bookmark it for prosperity?

[alexandertnt]

Throughout this thread people have framed feminism is "extreme" and just as frequently failed to explain why.

Attempting to do so leads to 'No True Scotsman.'

the advocacy of women's rights on the ground of the equality of the sexes

So anyone promoting the superiority of women/inferiority of men is quite literally not a Scotsman.

[Neonivek]

This is one of the few times I'd disagree with google's definition.

Well to admit there are always multiple definitions... and that definition has no room for "feminist theory".

[alexandertnt]

Here is the one from Wikipedia:

Feminism is a collection of movements and ideologies aimed at defining, establishing, and defending a state of equal political, economic, cultural, and social rights for women

[Jelle]

I'd define feminism as a movement for the empowerment of women. This definition encompasses both positive (gender equality) and possibly negative change (overempowerement, strife).

[alexandertnt]

Your definition doesn't seem to be a very widely accepted one.

Ultimately you could define it however you wanted, I suppose. It is just a word, but all that will do is make your arguments harder to understand.

[Neonivek]

It would be interesting though to see someone argue that a female supremacy group aren't feminist.

Then again... I always could go back far enough... but then again the definition never said "All women" so going back to when women hated other women who weren't their brand of woman... doesn't affect that definition.

[Rolepgeek]

Anyway, any more examples of extreme feminism?

Anita Sarkeesian? Rebecca Watson?

Thats your benchmark for extreme? No wonder you see so many extremist feminists

Yeah, pretty much. Everyone's an extremist until proven otherwise.

I'm sure you're just trolling at this point, because it's nigh impossible to 'disprove' extremism, but prove you aren't an extremist. After all, you view Anita as being extremist; that must mean you are, since you haven't disproven your own extremism yet, and by your logic, that means you are an extremist.

Also, LordBucket; the analogy is not, properly, a pendulum. It is a spring-coiled tube. There is innate resistance to equality from sources outside of the specific battleground, and there are people pushing down. To get it high enough, we have to push back.

So long as you acknowledge that the person you are speaking to is the expert.

Except if the reason they're wrong is because they haven't done as much research on the topic as me, then they AREN'T the expert... so that would just be lying.
Similarly, acknowledging that somebody is a woman before making a claim that doesn't require you to be a woman to make, is misleading/almost like a kind of lying as well, by implying that it matters when it doesn't.

Research =/= experience. Statistics are not the same as individuals, and it goes both ways; for the same reason you can't use anecdotal evidence, you can't say 'well this study shows only 3% of women actually get abused by blahblahblah so you probably weren't actually hurt'. Besides which, what gives you reason to suspect that you've done more research than they, when the issue strikes much closer to home with them and thus they have more reason to so research than you?

at least one man will probably try to assume he knows what's best for them there womenfolk getting those tiny persons stuck inside their vagina-whatzits.

I don't know exactly which arguments you're talking about, but stereotypically, arguments against abortion rarely are about the well-being of women. They tend to be about the well-being of the fetus. And being a woman doesn't really give you any better insight into the perspective/needs of a fetus than men have. We were ALL fetuses, and NONE of us remember it, so arguments made from that perspective are fairly sex-neutral and I don't see why men would have much reason to defer on the issue to womens' experience.
[/quote]
Don't wanna get into a separate debate about this so I'll just say: it's a woman's body carrying that fetus, and her reproductive system that has to bear the strain of it. She's the one for whom it will affect her life for a long-ass time, if the dad ain't around. Don't give me 'child-support' bullshit either, you know it's not the same.