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[Knight Otu]

The myth generator is looking quite interesting from what I've gathered from trawling through tweets from the GDC talk.

Spoiler: A short list of tweets to look at (click to show/hide)

https://twitter.com/lizardengland/status/709506449324421120
https://twitter.com/D_M_Gregory/status/709506995636690944
https://twitter.com/kcoats/status/709503963175919616
https://twitter.com/bf_taka/status/709502887982858240
https://twitter.com/tonitonirocca/status/709503761241104384

In short, in the program that Toady used, there are several different elements, color-coded for convenience - among them Great Beings (I'm assuming they're the Chronos-type older gods as opposed to members of pantheons), Individuals (such as Numon the Cosmic Hydra or Lezetion the Raven), "power sources" that permeate the universe, artifacts (apparently so far only two types?), planes and their connections, etc. The first elements that have no direct parent are primordial (there's also celestial, seen in this video). One element I'm not sure what they are (the Didia, the Sikyceus and the Futhete in the example), though they kind of sound like races or maybe pantheons. There also may be side myths of some kind - in the sidebar, there are a few individuals mentioned that aren't in the main text - such as Dukecete the Ibis, listed before Lezetion, and one tweet mentions egg fragments, which aren't seen at all in the screenshots.

The different races have different views, or even realities what happens to their soul after death, and in the mythology generated in the talk, "rare bloodlines" of dwarves have the ability to utilize the force of the Shifting Blood (perhaps because they were formed by it directly?).

(It also looks like the myth got a bit unlucky with a multitude of "spontaneously formed" and such. The preview video had at least one instance of X breathed into existence Y.)

[TheFlame52]

Thanks, guys. And that's why I didn't green it.

NINJAED: That's pretty awesome myth stuff. I can't wait!

[Max™]

I wouldnt say thats weird, more like "consistent"

Mean weird as in halfway across a 129x129 in different directions.

[Random_Dragon]

[MAX_EDGE:1000] no swords until you can pick mats

Now that we CAN pick mats for stone short swords, will we ever get this restriction removed for native copper and native silver? :V

[Inarius]

Some questions about the future development (Myth/artifacts/magic):

They are not suggestion, because i'm not necessarily "asking" for this, but more that I know to have an answer.

Will we ever have adamantine items in non-player fortress mode ? (trading threads, or adamantine socks ? It could be a great incentive to find and trade with deep fortresses in adventure mode !)
If yes, could we see some dwarf fortresses in Legend mode collapsing because they dug too far into adamantine ?
More generally, is the information about the circus and the clowns something people (Dwarves or others) know or not ?

Do people in DF believe in myths or are they just legends and accepted as such ? Are there some people believing, while others don't  ?

Will the myths explain the existence of the circus and the clown (and adamantine, perhaps), too ?

In your plans are Humans, elves and gobelins able to "make" artifacts or is it limited to Dwarves ?
And about magic (I don't know if you have thought about it yet, but still curious), are all intelligent races be able to do magic (human/elves/goblins/dwarves), and the same types of magic (some civilizations, limited to some types, of magic, in relation with things such as where they live or the gods they worship...).
Could other intelligent races perform magic too (dragons ? Some specific titans ? Fire-based creatures ?).
Would some non-intelligent races or "location" could have an affinity with magic without really controlling it (faeries, for example?), or even creatures based on magic ?


Thanks, Toady !

[Shonai_Dweller]

Some questions about the future development (Myth/artifacts/magic):

They are not suggestion, because i'm not necessarily "asking" for this, but more that I know to have an answer.

Will we ever have adamantine items in non-player fortress mode ? (trading threads, or adamantine socks ? It could be a great incentive to find and trade with deep fortresses in adventure mode !)
If yes, could we see some dwarf fortresses in Legend mode collapsing because they dug too far into adamantine ?
More generally, is the information about the circus and the clowns something people (Dwarves or others) know or not ?

Do people in DF believe in myths or are they just legends and accepted as such ? Are there some people believing, while others don't  ?

Will the myths explain the existence of the circus and the clown (and adamantine, perhaps), too ?

In your plans are Humans, elves and gobelins able to "make" artifacts or is it limited to Dwarves ?
And about magic (I don't know if you have thought about it yet, but still curious), are all intelligent races be able to do magic (human/elves/goblins/dwarves), and the same types of magic (some civilizations, limited to some types, of magic, in relation with things such as where they live or the gods they worship...).
Could other intelligent races perform magic too (dragons ? Some specific titans ? Fire-based creatures ?).
Would some non-intelligent races or "location" could have an affinity with magic without really controlling it (faeries, for example?), or even creatures based on magic ?


Thanks, Toady !

Toady can probably provide more in depth answers (and probably did at GDC) but as far as I understand it, the creation of the universe is unique to each world and each races affinity with magic is related directly to that creation process. Clowns and such are also part of the process, so again, could well be unique in each world. In addition each race has their own interpretation of the creation myth.

So, doesn't really answer your questions, but it could be that the only answer is 'it depends what the myth generator comes up with' (plus sliders and such on how 'mythical' you want your world to be).

[Neonivek]

Everyone wants a full explanation of the Myth system in the worlds...

Toady, perhaps you could give a full rundown on the myth system your working on if possible?

Everyone is dying to know and I am sure questions are going to be pouring in (heck I have 50). Though I'd understand if that is either too much information OR if your leaving it as a surprise later. Heck I'd love a copy of that myth generator even if it is just a trial.

Ok I will say... A LOT of eggs in myth creation O-o...

[Manveru Taurënér]

Snip

As far as the magic part goes, check out Cado's Magical Journey. While I of course recommend reading it all, (and the rest of Threetoe's stories, it's an oft-overlooked goldmine of info) at the bottom there's an analysis by Toady and Threetoe shedding some light on how they envision magic to work as well as a little bit about afterlives and other planes, supernatural beings etc.

[Untrustedlife]

Snip

As far as the magic part goes, check out Cado's Magical Journey. While I of course recommend reading it all, (and the rest of Threetoe's stories, it's an oft-overlooked goldmine of info) at the bottom there's an analysis by Toady and Threetoe shedding some light on how they envision magic to work as well as a little bit about afterlives and other planes, supernatural beings etc.

I reccomend you guys read that aswell.

[Max™]

A lot of the effects in that story can be replicated to various extents with dfhack and modding, launch for telekinesis, spd 9.9 for the time-slowing, the healing with a recuperation jacking ability which could now have increasing side-effects with use, advfort can let you "open" a wall, my artifact crit/onepunch script does the "force your fist through the future" effect well.

No way to replicate something like the tracking interface to see magic threads/ley lines with any sense yet, but that does make me wonder.

Will being able to change the colors/tile/etc for track indicators end up in the raws? The yellow/green is easy to see but in some areas it makes it hard to see where you're even at, much less where you're trying to track towards. I love being able to follow people/creatures and whatnot, gives a nice adventurous feel to track them across mountains and streams and get the "you have located a lair" announcement pop up, but it's annoying when I hit a big crossroads and the entire visible region of ground is obscured with a sea of bright green/yellow.

[TheFlame52]

Will there ever be randomly-generated relationships between gods? How about personalities for them? I want my dwarves' pantheons to be as colorful as the Greeks'!

[Random_Dragon]

Will there ever be randomly-generated relationships between gods? How about personalities for them? I want my dwarves' pantheons to be as colorful as the Greeks'!

Urist McLena, Queen cancels mandate slade mugs: interrupted by swan.

[Urlance Woolsbane]

Will there ever be randomly-generated relationships between gods? How about personalities for them? I want my dwarves' pantheons to be as colorful as the Greeks'!

Urist McLena, Queen cancels mandate slade mugs: interrupted by swan.

Urist McPrincess cancels kill bull, cannot find path.

[Putnam]

A lot of the effects in that story can be replicated to various extents with dfhack and modding, launch for telekinesis, spd 9.9 for the time-slowing, the healing with a recuperation jacking ability which could now have increasing side-effects with use, advfort can let you "open" a wall, my artifact crit/onepunch script does the "force your fist through the future" effect well.

As I see it, having to manually implement it and require the player to do things to get access to it means it might as well not be done at all. That's why I'm so obsessed with systems like Fortbent's classes or Sparking's ki, those don't require player input, they use a lot of hackery to make conditions happen (the former through Roses' class stuff, the latter through a bunch of stuff I wrote myself)

[Knight Otu]

Will there ever be randomly-generated relationships between gods? How about personalities for them? I want my dwarves' pantheons to be as colorful as the Greeks'!

Relations are definitely part of the myth generator. I think it has at least been hinted that personalities and such are part of it as well, to better flesh out the Temple Building starting scenarios.

In relation to religion ,is any sort mythology generation (god X father of god Y, genealogy tree, relationships between gods like in most mythology or things like this) an idea you are working on, or will gods remain independant from each other ?

We've been toying around with a test generator and have quite a bit lined up now for the world gen artifact releases which will follow the tavern releases.  All sorts of new stuff should make it in.

Will we ever have adamantine items in non-player fortress mode ? (trading threads, or adamantine socks ? It could be a great incentive to find and trade with deep fortresses in adventure mode !)
If yes, could we see some dwarf fortresses in Legend mode collapsing because they dug too far into adamantine ?

I recall a post by Toady where he stated that Dug-too-deep events for worldgen forts almost happened during one release. Ah, here. As such, it should remain on the table, as far as adamantine and demons exist in the post-myth-generator worlds.

Will the myths explain the existence of the circus and the clown (and adamantine, perhaps), too ?

One of the screenshots above mentions Dorania Demons (along with an individual of those), and the preview video even had two groups named Demons, so I think it's safe to say yes here.

In your plans are Humans, elves and gobelins able to "make" artifacts or is it limited to Dwarves ?
And about magic (I don't know if you have thought about it yet, but still curious), are all intelligent races be able to do magic (human/elves/goblins/dwarves), and the same types of magic (some civilizations, limited to some types, of magic, in relation with things such as where they live or the gods they worship...).

Artifacts won't be unique to dwarves (though strange moods probably will remain so):

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Rainseeker:   That kind of segues into my question; are there going to be new ways to create artifacts aside from that, such as at the creation of the world or by gods or some other ...
Toady:   Originally we thought of this as kind of a tricky question; just at first when the game was smaller we were like ‘Dwarves ... they make the artifacts’ but I think dwarven artifacts in a sense are special because you made them but really you have to let go of that as being their unique properties; they might have the best artifacts among civilizations, but an artifact is just an important object, and important objects ... you’ve got to pass that around. So whether there are items that have been created by gods, items that have been created by other civilizations – maybe not as prolific as the dwarves, but I think one of Zach’s stories had an elven sword that was put in a stream for a thousand years, that certainly wouldn’t be a common artifact – but you’ve got it there, and the ones that they become attached to and so on, that’s certainly fair game for the other civilizations. And things like, if there’s some kind of evil swamp that isn’t really attached to gods at all, it’s just this evil swamp, it might have a beating heart beneath it that’s some kind of object, and you might have to dig that out to make the undead dear go away, and the undead alligators ...

Magic ability will depend on the creation myths, really. In the screenshots I linked in my earlier post, there's a magic style that's apparently unique to dwarves, but there's no way to know if in that world, there would be other magic styles open to other races and places.