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Author Topic: Beginner's Mafia XLVIII: In a Galaxy Far Far Away (Scum Victory)  (Read 46551 times)

BlitzDungeoneer

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Re: Beginner's Mafia XLVIII: In a Galaxy Far Far Away (Signups closed)
« Reply #240 on: July 19, 2014, 01:53:34 pm »

Scripten: I'm vaguely familiar with him, so I kinda know his posting style. Not much else, really. Here's a question for you;
Which role do you think I have?
Ah, here it is.
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Swordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordswordsword

yobbo

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Re: Beginner's Mafia XLVIII: In a Galaxy Far Far Away Day 2
« Reply #241 on: July 19, 2014, 06:34:09 pm »

So on waking up i think i'm gonna unvote Blitz

and agree with the vote on Deathsword the lurking scum whose scumbuddy could be any of Blitz, Scripten and Illgeo.
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Scripten

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Re: Beginner's Mafia XLVIII: In a Galaxy Far Far Away Day 2
« Reply #242 on: July 19, 2014, 06:36:59 pm »

BlitzDungeoneer: Interesting. Was it not only you who said that this question was a suspicious one? In fact, the criticisms that were leveled at you were in regard to the way you answered questions, and that hasn't really changed despite several of us explaining very clearly what we meant. Illgeo said you were rolefishing, but that's the only instance I've found all game. Am I wrong? I'm more convinced that you are scum because of this inconsistency.

Anailater: Can you please extrapolate on what you mean by Deathsword avoiding questions? He has been lurking, and I am suspicious of him due to the weird interplay between him and BlitzDungeoneer, but your sudden change in vote seems out of the blue. In fact, I'm getting really suspicious that you're suddenly bursting in here to try and start a bandwagon on Deathsword. Just because I'm suspicious of him doesn't mean that I'm going to ignore you, buddy.

Yobbo: You've been saying that I look scummy because I am too clear and do not seem to confront people. Does it make sense for me to become defensive? There's no game-related reason for me to worry too much about being lynched. If I die, I still win if the town does, so I'm going to continue probing into other players as much as possible. Of course, I don't want to die, but the point of the game is to play to your win condition, so the more I can scumhunt, the better.

I'm keeping my vote, but this will be very ripe tomorrow after any flips we might get.
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anailater

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Re: Beginner's Mafia XLVIII: In a Galaxy Far Far Away Day 2
« Reply #243 on: July 19, 2014, 06:44:19 pm »

Scripten: This is hardly a flip change, I pointed out with my reads that he and blitz were the ones that were giving me weird feelings and to be honest I feel like that was mainly because if everone else's feelings towards blitz, my suspicions towards him are based on the fact that he is A) big answering questions B) Not posting here at all C) Not scum hunting
Combine this with my personal view if the lack if true content in his posts and it makes him look like the most likely target in my eyes, with blitz a close second.
PFP
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Scripten

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Re: Beginner's Mafia XLVIII: In a Galaxy Far Far Away Day 2
« Reply #244 on: July 19, 2014, 06:54:03 pm »

Yobbo: Are you serious? Anailater posts an all-caps vote on a player you don't even believe to be most scummy and you follow right along with him? Along with pointing the FoS at everyone except for TWO players, one of whom is yourself? And this is after this where you say that Blitz stays on the radar tomorrow if we don't lynch him today. Do you realize how scummy that looks?

If you think I'm the most scummy, then vote me or keep your vote where it will mean something. If we have a tie then we have a no-lynch night and risk losing a power role without even a chance of a scum lynch.

Anailater: Where did you say this? You said that you forgot about him and that he was "just another player" in this post. I'm getting massive scum vibes from you for this, because those are things I said when I mentioned suspecting Deathsword. Since you're suddenly parroting them and yobbo is just voting along with you without a second thought, I'm seeing you both as being much scummier than Deathsword was. Blitz may be most scummy, but you two are reeking of being a blatant scumteam.
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Scripten

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Re: Beginner's Mafia XLVIII: In a Galaxy Far Far Away Day 2
« Reply #245 on: July 19, 2014, 07:14:16 pm »

Oh, and one more thing...

Anailater: You haven't said what you mean by Deathsword avoiding questions. Do you merely mean that he's lurking or is there something more substantial?
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anailater

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Re: Beginner's Mafia XLVIII: In a Galaxy Far Far Away Day 2
« Reply #246 on: July 19, 2014, 08:33:08 pm »

Scripten: Firstly, why are you blowing up over this? I followed my thoughts on that post outside of posts, in my mind, where I usually think and I came to the conclusion that if I were scum I would try to stay as unassuming as possible, as DeathSword was doing, even you agreed he was doing it! So I'm not voting despite what I said I'm voting because of what I said.

As for avoiding questions, I have asked him several since the extension, and he has responded to none of them, despite the suspicion I've placed on him, to me that sounds like him trying to avoid a last minute vote turn around, which is what's happening.

Also can you explain something to me why is it that when Yobbo first changes his vote you don't get all angry and defensive, but once I explain myself you do?
PFP
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yobbo

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Re: Beginner's Mafia XLVIII: In a Galaxy Far Far Away Day 2
« Reply #247 on: July 19, 2014, 08:36:24 pm »

Yobbo: Are you serious? Anailater posts an all-caps vote on a player you don't even believe to be most scummy and you follow right along with him? Along with pointing the FoS at everyone except for TWO players, one of whom is yourself? And this is after this where you say that Blitz stays on the radar tomorrow if we don't lynch him today. Do you realize how scummy that looks?

If you think I'm the most scummy, then vote me or keep your vote where it will mean something. If we have a tie then we have a no-lynch night and risk losing a power role without even a chance of a scum lynch.
Yeah, i realize how scummy it looks. But as far as not believing Deathsword to be scummy that isn't the case at all.

This is the way I saw things last night:

Illgeo: Scum?
Scripten: Scum!?
Deathsword: Scum?
Blitz: ?????????

Frostmoon / anailater: probably not scum

Right now this hasn't changed much. Illgeo has actually shown up and responded, which is at least something, but doesn't really change how i feel about him.

Why i'm not voting you, i have some reasons for that. I don't want to get onto your case until tomorrow. (assuming i live that long, but i don't think i'd be the best target to nightkill.) I do have more reasons for suspecting you now than i did when i originally pressed you over what i now mostly think is just your cautious style.

Why i'm voting Deathsword, i agree with everything that was said by Frostmoon and anailater (both the players i think are by far most likely town) about his posts feeling like they're in the background, staying just off the radar. I also find the point i asked him about that he hasn't shown up to answer (why's he not voting Blitz today?) really fishy. It seems to point to a Blitz-Deathsword scumteam, where he would've unvoted Blitz yesterday if it looked like Blitz was actually in any danger, and then today didn't want to seem like he was just dropping the case, but quietly didn't vote.

Why i'm not voting Blitz: i realized i was expecting that he would come up town.

Which leads me back to why i'm voting Deathsword.

I thought about what things would look like if Blitz came up town. And I decided that it would be just as i put my suspicions above. Deathsword/Illgeo/Scripten two out of three of them scum. Out of those combinations I thought the most likely were Scripten/Deathsword and Illgeo/Deathsword. Probably just because I don't think you and Illgeo would both vote Blitz (the only votes at that time) if you were a scumteam.

In all cases Deathsword was the other scum.

I can still change my vote, and will certainly do so if it looks like there's going to be a tie. Or if Deathsword posts and is really convincingly not scum. But right now, i believe that lynching Deathsword is a better choice than lynching Blitz.

And as for being convinced by anailater's all-caps accusation, no. I've been having doubts about this for a while now.

The point about worrying about still suspecting Blitz tomorrow is the reason i didn't say or do anything about it.

Yobbo: You've been saying that I look scummy because I am too clear and do not seem to confront people. Does it make sense for me to become defensive? There's no game-related reason for me to worry too much about being lynched. If I die, I still win if the town does, so I'm going to continue probing into other players as much as possible. Of course, I don't want to die, but the point of the game is to play to your win condition, so the more I can scumhunt, the better.
It's not because you're being too clear and not confronting people. I mentioned above that i don't want to press this now. But if you still don't understand why i'm voting Deathsword and not you, i can try to better explain.
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anailater

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Re: Beginner's Mafia XLVIII: In a Galaxy Far Far Away Day 2
« Reply #248 on: July 19, 2014, 08:38:53 pm »

I would also like to point out that Deathsword has not only been online, but has been on the Mafia Subforum and still hasn't posted to answer any of the wuestikns directed at him.
PFP
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yobbo

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Re: Beginner's Mafia XLVIII: In a Galaxy Far Far Away Day 2
« Reply #249 on: July 19, 2014, 09:56:45 pm »

Also can you explain something to me why is it that when Yobbo first changes his vote you don't get all angry and defensive, but once I explain myself you do?
I think his first post after mine was what he was going to say before i posted it, it's timestamped just 2 minutes after i posted. And the second was in response to my post and yours.
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anailater

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Re: Beginner's Mafia XLVIII: In a Galaxy Far Far Away Day 2
« Reply #250 on: July 19, 2014, 09:59:36 pm »

Alright then but why he 13 minute gap between then and his next post? Surely he had already seen it when he was making his last post.
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yobbo

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Re: Beginner's Mafia XLVIII: In a Galaxy Far Far Away Day 2
« Reply #251 on: July 19, 2014, 10:04:11 pm »

It certainly takes me that long to think how to write things out sometimes.

He actually linked specific messages for both of us so i think he was probably looking back at previous posts etc.
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Scripten

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Re: Beginner's Mafia XLVIII: In a Galaxy Far Far Away Day 2
« Reply #252 on: July 19, 2014, 10:45:21 pm »

Why i'm not voting you, i have some reasons for that. I don't want to get onto your case until tomorrow. (assuming i live that long, but i don't think i'd be the best target to nightkill.) I do have more reasons for suspecting you now than i did when i originally pressed you over what i now mostly think is just your cautious style.

I have more to say on this, but if I get stabbed in the night, Yobbo is confirmed scum.
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anailater

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Re: Beginner's Mafia XLVIII: In a Galaxy Far Far Away Day 2
« Reply #253 on: July 19, 2014, 11:28:01 pm »

You do realise by saying that you have painted a target on both of you if he isn't scum, if your night killed people will assume its Yobbo and if Yobbo isn't scum then two Town have died just because your both being petty.
PFP
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Scripten

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Re: Beginner's Mafia XLVIII: In a Galaxy Far Far Away Day 2
« Reply #254 on: July 20, 2014, 01:18:43 am »

Scripten: Firstly, why are you blowing up over this? I followed my thoughts on that post outside of posts, in my mind, where I usually think and I came to the conclusion that if I were scum I would try to stay as unassuming as possible, as DeathSword was doing, even you agreed he was doing it! So I'm not voting despite what I said I'm voting because of what I said.

As for avoiding questions, I have asked him several since the extension, and he has responded to none of them, despite the suspicion I've placed on him, to me that sounds like him trying to avoid a last minute vote turn around, which is what's happening.

Also can you explain something to me why is it that when Yobbo first changes his vote you don't get all angry and defensive, but once I explain myself you do?
PFP

Who's blowing up? I'm calling you out because in this post, you used the following reasons to explain why you were voting for Deathsword:

1: big answering questions
2: Not posting here at all
3: Not scum hunting
[/direct quote]

I'm actually not entirely sure what point 1 means, but I figured you meant that he was not answering questions? Plus, there's a number of things that are bugging me. Firstly, Nerjin voted you before he was killed. He didn't have any information we don't have, but he does know the game well. You didn't put any pressure on him until someone else came up with reasons to do so. Now you're doing the same thing to Deathsword, who is the other IC. The reasons you gave are the exact same as the ones I made against him, but in this post, (quoted above) you frame it as if you came to your decision on your own and I just happened to agree with it.

And don't worry, I'm not angry. :P I'm just putting pressure on you because your actions look scummy. To be honest, I was significantly harsher toward Yobbo.

Speaking of which...

Yobbo: So, let's do a thought experiment where you and anailater are a scumteam. In your first post, you put pressure on anailater with a fairly toothless question. Not a big deal. RVS accounts for that. In your second post, you call out Illgeo for defending anailater. Again, not a big deal. He tried to dissuade you from voting him, and you push back a bit. Still nothing showing any real teeth, but it's passable.

It's here where I start getting suspicious. Okay, you don't agree with him, but for some reason, his responses aren't scummy. So you unvote, but not before bringing up a rule disagreement. That's a pretty safe way to play, which is kind of funny when you accuse me of playing too safely in your next post. After all, the only pressure you were directly involved in was between you and anailater. It almost seems measured, looking back.

The next few posts are pretty much directly toward explaining reasoning and answering a few questions. It's right here where the bandwagon begins. I had my vote on Nerjin from RVS, true, but here's the interesting part about this post. You shut down a question directed at anailater. It's a fairly sneaky tactic, but you managed to get that question out of the way before Nerjin was lynched.

The next post, here, is VERY useful to me. You use the exact same tactic that anailater is using now to bandwagon Deathsword. That is, you say that you came to the same conclusion I did via parallel logic, rather than just trying to follow a townie's lead. You also say this: "I even made sure to make it look like a real vote to add to the pressure." So you never actually put any real pressure on anailater. You just made it look like you had. Good to know.

So, we continue on and anailater is the last person who is not a confirmed townie to vote for Nerjin. Not exactly a strong piece of evidence, but it seems relevant now that the reverse has happened, where anailater starts up a wagon and you hop right on.

Now that I've thoroughly bored everyone with that wall of text, let's fast forward to Day 2. Blitz is on the chopping block because he's been playing super scummy. That's when anailater votes Deathsword out of the blue, you hop right on that boat like it's the last raft off the Titanic, but not so late that you can't try to get other votes off of BlitzDungeoneer and onto Deathsword. Your last post was not very informative.

You:
- Give some vague reads
- Say that you have dirt on me that you aren't willing to share until tomorrow (why?)
- Justify voting for your second scum choice

Beyond that, the post isn't of much use to us, though I have to question this bit:

"It's not because you're being too clear and not confronting people. I mentioned above that i don't want to press this now. But if you still don't understand why i'm voting Deathsword and not you, i can try to better explain."

Going to disagree here. Press when you have the info, or else I'm going to believe you're blowing hot air. There's no reason for townies to hold back evidence from each other, so please, enlighten us?

Okay, that should be about it. One last thing, though:

You do realise by saying that you have painted a target on both of you if he isn't scum, if your night killed people will assume its Yobbo and if Yobbo isn't scum then two Town have died just because your both being petty.
PFP

You're assuming that people will immediately jump to lynch Yobbo the next day without any discussion. Or, likewise, that if he gets stabbed, the same will happen to me. If Yobbo becomes more upfront, then sure, he may end up looking town, but as it stands right now, he's withholding information that, if I'm killed, may never be brought up. I'm making sure that a big deal is made of that, so he can't just get out of the spotlight by saying he's got evidence today to discredit me and try to push a vote on Deathsword, then, "oops," Scripten got stabbed so Yobbo might as well just not bother telling anyone what he was holding back.

Any questions?
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