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Author Topic: WH40K discussion thread: from Tyran's heart I stab at thee.  (Read 1031755 times)

Duuvian

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Re: WH40K discussion thread: from Tyran's heart I stab at thee.
« Reply #12330 on: December 24, 2023, 12:34:05 am »

Is.. is that a fetish for some people? I had no idea. It's not for me, I just thought it was a weird story that could happen in 40k. From what I've read in official 40k fiction that was actually pretty tame imo. I thought it was appropriately disgusting for a nurgle daemon and for the Imperium setting, and while I admit I laughed at the concept of the idea for introducing a boss fight like that as well as thinking of how the sororitas would figure out to use the aging plot device. However you know what, you are right, it was a bad idea, though I assure you it was in no way related to imposing fetishes on others.

EDIT: I made it less angry of a response after I re-read it, I overreacted by feeling like it was an accusation the first time I saw it.
« Last Edit: December 24, 2023, 03:02:44 am by Duuvian »
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Loud Whispers

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Frumple

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Re: WH40K discussion thread: from Tyran's heart I stab at thee.
« Reply #12332 on: December 24, 2023, 08:17:19 am »

Is.. is that a fetish for some people? I had no idea.
Now you know, and knowing is half the battle!

... but yeah, something riding a sperm and crawling its way out of an egg is, like. I haven't seen that exact hentai, but I've tripped over stuff that's really friggin' close to it. It 100% is a fetish, or close enough to one it's entirely possible it'd wig someone out.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: WH40K discussion thread: from Tyran's heart I stab at thee.
« Reply #12333 on: December 27, 2023, 08:02:45 am »

Quote from: black crusade p.313
Most potent of all the Space Marine Chapters are the Grey Knights and the Deathwatch. The former combats those dedicated to the Ruinous Powers, while the latter comprises the most skilled alien hunters in the Imperium. In a galaxy of corruption and betrayal, it stands as a startling testament that no Grey Knight has ever turned from his duty to tread the path of glory. It goes without saying that were this to happen, the Dark Gods would find a servant nearly as mighty as Warmaster Horus himself.
Nearly as mighty as Horus? I know it'd be bad but would one GK turning to chaos really be that bad?

scriver

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Re: WH40K discussion thread: from Tyran's heart I stab at thee.
« Reply #12334 on: December 27, 2023, 09:35:05 am »

Quote from: black crusade p.313
Most potent of all the Space Marine Chapters are the Grey Knights and the Deathwatch. The former combats those dedicated to the Ruinous Powers, while the latter comprises the most skilled alien hunters in the Imperium. In a galaxy of corruption and betrayal, it stands as a startling testament that no Grey Knight has ever turned from his duty to tread the path of glory. It goes without saying that were this to happen, the Dark Gods would find a servant nearly as mighty as Warmaster Horus himself.
Nearly as mighty as Horus? I know it'd be bad but would one GK turning to chaos really be that bad?

Doubting the might of the author's favourites Emperor's chosen? That's getting awfully close to heresy, soldier!
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Grim Portent

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Re: WH40K discussion thread: from Tyran's heart I stab at thee.
« Reply #12335 on: December 27, 2023, 09:40:20 am »

Quote from: black crusade p.313
Most potent of all the Space Marine Chapters are the Grey Knights and the Deathwatch. The former combats those dedicated to the Ruinous Powers, while the latter comprises the most skilled alien hunters in the Imperium. In a galaxy of corruption and betrayal, it stands as a startling testament that no Grey Knight has ever turned from his duty to tread the path of glory. It goes without saying that were this to happen, the Dark Gods would find a servant nearly as mighty as Warmaster Horus himself.
Nearly as mighty as Horus? I know it'd be bad but would one GK turning to chaos really be that bad?

Maybe, a lot of what made Horus so powerful was the amount of power the Chaos Gods were able to pour into him without him exploding, though it did erode his sense of self and ultimately make him worse at leading his forces. A grey knight could through willpower and warding combined survive a massive power boost from Chaos, possibly more than Abaddon can, and Abaddon has a lot of Chaos power ups.

Even comparably mild gifts made Lorgar from the least combat capable primarch to one of the mightiest warriors among their number. Raising a grey knight to be as powerful as a primarch is not that much bigger a leap.
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Egan_BW

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Re: WH40K discussion thread: from Tyran's heart I stab at thee.
« Reply #12336 on: December 27, 2023, 03:56:58 pm »

Pff, you believe in grey knights? They're a boogyman invented by the CIA Inquisition to intimidate their enemies. You couldn't possibly believe that none of them have gone to chaos, can you? :p
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Re: WH40K discussion thread: from Tyran's heart I stab at thee.
« Reply #12337 on: December 27, 2023, 06:38:30 pm »

Doubting the might of the author's favourites Emperor's chosen? That's getting awfully close to heresy, soldier!
I sometimes wonder if I'm contrarian or if GW really is just stupid because I loved grey knights in 2nd edition when they really did seem like an elite and mysterious tiny force and then hated them when they become meta poster-boys who slaughtered pure sororitas to protect their own purity against blood demons powered by blood by covering themselves in blood they spilled from their own allies

Pff, you believe in grey knights? They're a boogyman invented by the CIA Inquisition to intimidate their enemies. You couldn't possibly believe that none of them have gone to chaos, can you? :p
uh... On second thought maybe some already worship khorne

Maybe, a lot of what made Horus so powerful was the amount of power the Chaos Gods were able to pour into him without him exploding, though it did erode his sense of self and ultimately make him worse at leading his forces. A grey knight could through willpower and warding combined survive a massive power boost from Chaos, possibly more than Abaddon can, and Abaddon has a lot of Chaos power ups.

Even comparably mild gifts made Lorgar from the least combat capable primarch to one of the mightiest warriors among their number. Raising a grey knight to be as powerful as a primarch is not that much bigger a leap.
That does make some kinda sense. GKs already go through a huge process of elimination to sift out all but the most malleable and the sixty-six rituals of detestation and them being chapter 666 is a subtle hint GKs could make sick chaos marines. They are also mind-wiped and personality-wiped so maybe that's another big factor - as far as I can tell one of the major problems of champions of chaos is pumping them full of warp juice, but stopping just short of promoting them to daemon prince / chaos spawn. Because once they're promoted to daemon prince they are stuck in the warp doing warp things. So maybe a GK turned to chaos would be able to get that warp juice like Lorgar or Abaddon without turning into a daemon prince... And I suppose there's also the other factor of GKs already being experienced in the use of warp sorcery, daemon-binding and the ability to use chaos artifacts without being corrupted. So maybe there is a lot of credence to GKs having a high-saturation point for warp juicing.

I then thought "well why wouldn't anyone try to make their own Horus then" and it looks like they did:

A few true Promeans still remained, and as they became aware of what was happening they were horrified. Only a handful had ever read the first teachings of Promeus, or had been recruited by Inquisitors that had seen his works, but they immediately recognised the hand of Moriana in the beliefs of the Horusians.
Now a dwindling factions, spread across the Imperium, the few Promeans that remained did what they could to thwart the efforts of the Horusians, but there was little they could do and by the end of the 34th millennium the Horusians were a dominant part of the Inquisition agenda.

It was a woman named Stalia von Dressen that stood against the tide. She had been inducted to the Inquisition by a man named Lord Phoran, who had in his possession a second generation copy of Promeus' original works. This had been passed from master to apprentice for nearly two and a half thousand years,
and the keepers of the book were all dedicated Promeans.
Inheriting this mantle, von Dressen was still young and idealistic. Warned by her mentor of the threat posed by the Horusians, von Dressen made it her life's work to combat this menace and see the Horusians' power broken.

So yeah maybe it would be surprisingly easy to make a new Horus. All you would need is someone with a body strong enough to withstand warp corruption, psyker potential, a blank mind that is resistant enough to chaos that they cannot be possessed nor swayed to any one god in particular and all of the 4 chaos gods to like what they see. Which is not that impossible on a galactic scale. Inevitable, even

Grim Portent

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Re: WH40K discussion thread: from Tyran's heart I stab at thee.
« Reply #12338 on: December 27, 2023, 06:53:53 pm »

True psychic potential probably isn't even necessary, just the combined fortitude of mind and body to host the power of the Warp. Will is probably the most important part, because it can prevent the gods altering your form in ways you don't want.

Suitable vessels are incredibly rare, which is why some people try to make them. Cybernetics, training, genetic enhancement, magic, in theory the right combination could make a better Horus, he himself was a magically created genetic super soldier with rigourous training after all. I think all such efforts are inherently doomed to fail though, because the process is inherently one that the gods are going to subvert to their own ends, which usually means turning the subject into a powerful chaos champion or some kind of abomination.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: WH40K discussion thread: from Tyran's heart I stab at thee.
« Reply #12339 on: December 27, 2023, 07:21:29 pm »

In hindsight, I also think it's likely that there have already been loads of chaos champions at or near Horus levels of strength. You get young chaos marines like Emmesh-Aiye dominating and trolling ancient chaos space marines like Typhus, 10,000 years their junior. Loyalist chaplains being turned into the most potent chaos lords like Vorxec Calvarius or human psykers like Moriana surviving 10,000 years of greater demons, chaos space marines, xenos and who knows what else trying to gib them. Dark Magi combining warp tech, dark age tech, AI and sorcery into hellish and esoteric amalgamations. Titan princeps and Navy admirals who have become one with their titans and warships, achieving a kind of ascension that an obliterator would blush at. Then there are the Inquisitorial horusians, who deliberately did mess around with astartes-like procedures and daemonhosts, whilst Fabius Bile actually did make a Horus clone. And despite physically being a Horus, the Horus clone lacked the soul stuff which made Horus Horus and not just a big astartes.

Which implies there is a strong requirement of "you are the chosen one" factor needed in a candidate's soul to become a true chaos god champion - probably the similar sort of person who could become a living saint. Cos after Emps obliterated Horus's soul, Horus clones are clearly not quite Horus. And on that note, maybe there are all these Horus-tier people running around. But only Horus inherited the strength of multiple undivided legions at the same time. All these other mini-Horuses are probably just running around doing their own thing - a bit like the chaos champions who ok boomer'd an iron warriors dreadnought by telling him they actually didn't care about fighting the Imperium at all since they had better things to do with their life
« Last Edit: December 27, 2023, 07:24:15 pm by Loud Whispers »
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Grim Portent

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Re: WH40K discussion thread: from Tyran's heart I stab at thee.
« Reply #12340 on: December 27, 2023, 09:16:00 pm »

Probably. The issue with becoming the new Horus isn't necessarily becoming as powerful as he was in single combat, every Chaos Knight is more or less that powerful, at least in tabletop terms. The problem is gathering an army big enough to threaten the Imperium as a whole. Even Abaddon struggles to do that because keeping chaos warbands working together is like herding xenophobic cats, and his defining trait is being able to play the forces of Chaos against one another to stay in power. Kharn and Lucius are both immortal and phenomenal warriors, both are also assholes who are terrible at actually leading and organising an effective army in the long term, only being able to keep those afflicted with similar madness under their banner.

The X-factor is basically what the RPGs call Fate Points and Infamy, the inherent warping of fate towards a greater destiny than others posess. Such a destiny might still be trivial in the grand scheme of things, but it's there. The ganger turned Inquisitorial-mook PC has a destiny, even if it's to cover a retreat with hails of automatic pistol fire that ends with them bleeding out in an alleyway from the stump of a leg, or fall to their death after a parachute fails to open during a drop into a hostile environment. IIRC Black Crusade advises that named champions like Kharn or Abaddon have infamy of well over the normal max of 100, with every 10 or so roughly equalling a Fate Point from the other systems, so they can reroll a lot and survive dozens of scenes in which they should normally die. They always escape, clutch a win in a desperate scenario, or otherwise snatch at the very least a draw in the face of defeat. Kharn and Lucius just outright come back from the dead. I think Abaddon was suggested to have about 200, so you need to defeat him about 20 times in a campaign to kill him.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: WH40K discussion thread: from Tyran's heart I stab at thee.
« Reply #12341 on: December 28, 2023, 08:20:08 am »

Even Abaddon struggles to do that because keeping chaos warbands working together is like herding xenophobic cats, and his defining trait is being able to play the forces of Chaos against one another to stay in power. Kharn and Lucius are both immortal and phenomenal warriors, both are also assholes who are terrible at actually leading and organising an effective army in the long term, only being able to keep those afflicted with similar madness under their banner.
One of the reasons why I like the holy binary of Word Bearers and Alpha Legion. Word Bearers know how to build big coalitions of chaos marines, cultists, daemons, and they know not to get high off your own supply. Alpha Legion are the same, but big coalitions of chaos marines, xenos and agents instead

The X-factor is basically what the RPGs call Fate Points and Infamy, the inherent warping of fate towards a greater destiny than others posess. Such a destiny might still be trivial in the grand scheme of things, but it's there. The ganger turned Inquisitorial-mook PC has a destiny, even if it's to cover a retreat with hails of automatic pistol fire that ends with them bleeding out in an alleyway from the stump of a leg, or fall to their death after a parachute fails to open during a drop into a hostile environment.
Interestingly infamy is presented slightly differently to fate points. Infamy represents the favour of the warp, but may also just represent the grit and resourcefulness that has kept a heretic alive all this time (as by process of elimination, those who aren't don't last long). It can be won or lost through things that affect reputation in the eyes of men, or gods. Fate points however are definitively the nebulous concept of someone marked for "something." Voidborn people are objectively luckier, and burning fate points permanently wounds greater tzeentch demons if you do it nearby to them, in a way that losing infamy points doesn't affect them. And the chaos 4 love to corrupt people with fate points who are favoured by the fates, but whatever the fates are, even the architect of fate doesn't have any control over it. The Emperor protects? Or maybe the fates are even older. Three old hags sitting in the warp weaving a tapestry

IIRC Black Crusade advises that named champions like Kharn or Abaddon have infamy of well over the normal max of 100, with every 10 or so roughly equalling a Fate Point from the other systems, so they can reroll a lot and survive dozens of scenes in which they should normally die.
0 - lowly servant beneath contempt
1-5 - gangers, mercenaries or thugs
6-9 - gang leader or merc sergeant
10-19 - 10-19 Crime Lord of a Small City, ruthless Mercenary Captain.
20-29 - Commander of a Cruiser-class vessel, Seer who is “right” most of the time, Daemonhost, minor warband leader. [this is where most Inquisitorial acolytes are]
30-39 - General of an army, Master of a hive.
40-49 - Commander of a grand cruiser, conqueror of a world, strong warband leader.
50-59 - Commander of a flotilla, Greater Daemon.
60-75 - Mighty warband leader, commander of a Fleet. [this is around the maximum potential for an Inquisitorial retinue member]
76-90 - Enslaver of multiple worlds.
91-100 - Sorcerer who can destroy a world on a whim, a powerful Daemon Prince.
101-129 - An ancient and powerful Greater Daemon who has the favour of its diety.
130-139 - Supreme Commander of a Black Crusade into Imperial space.
140-149 - A powerful and near-immortal agent of a Dark God such as Kharne the Betrayer.
150+ - Abbadon the Despoiler

It's amusing seeing the hierarchy of greater demons vs daemonhosts vs daemon princes

They always escape, clutch a win in a desperate scenario, or otherwise snatch at the very least a draw in the face of defeat. Kharn and Lucius just outright come back from the dead. I think Abaddon was suggested to have about 200, so you need to defeat him about 20 times in a campaign to kill him.
I think the things that also make Kharn and Lucius immortal (both in game terms and in lore) is they can't die as long as they gain the favour of their gods. So for someone like Kharn, if they were a player character they would get infamy every time they charge across an open battlefield against overwhelming odds. Which Kharn probably does a lot. So even if they got gibbed by a stray artillery round Khorne would just contrive some way to keep him going. It does also amusingly make sense that if you wanted to kill a powerful chaos champion, you'd probably be better off attacking their pride and making them lose infamy by attacking their credibility or making them look weak. Cos eventually their minions and the gods will lose interest in them

Egan_BW

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Re: WH40K discussion thread: from Tyran's heart I stab at thee.
« Reply #12342 on: December 28, 2023, 04:02:55 pm »

I wonder in what way has Abbadon not already made himself appear weak. :p
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Loud Whispers

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Re: WH40K discussion thread: from Tyran's heart I stab at thee.
« Reply #12343 on: December 29, 2023, 02:08:02 pm »

I wonder in what way has Abbadon not already made himself appear weak. :p
Failing upwards is a skill Tzeentch prizes in his servants

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Re: WH40K discussion thread: from Tyran's heart I stab at thee.
« Reply #12344 on: January 02, 2024, 10:10:21 am »

I've got an idea for one of the main villains in my DH campaign. In the end the players should come up against triple heresy - an arch-heretic, a tech-heretic and a radical inquisitor. Originally I thought of an NPC, Magos Alechemys Divinatus Octus. But I just had a neat idea for developing the Magos, since they'll likely be the next target once (if?) they deal with the arch-heretic first.

1. The Magos has undergone what he/she/they terms "the rites of division." They divided their brain into 8 eighths, with each eighth forming the shard of a new whole brain and body, with the rest of their functioning mind replaced by cogitators. They have essentially reduced their human components down to the bare minimum that retains personality and doesn't(?) cross the line into becoming an AI being. This also means that there is a Divinatus Primus, Secundus, Tertius, Quartus, Quintus, Sextus, Septimus and Octus. This gives a lot of spare NPCs to play with, and could be a fun / horrifying discovery for my players, especially since they refuse to get tech use and the amount of havoc a multitude of rogue Magi could get up to is vast.

2. There is potential for one of the Divinatus to disagree with the rest of its order. Like one of them inherited the amygdala and is just a bundle of anxiety and fear which thinks the other Divinati have gone too far in their experiments. Would it oppose the other Magi? Would they imprison this Magos? I imagine they would program some way into themselves to resolve conflicts amongst themselves, e.g. terminating one another is not permitted.

3. In game terms, my players have acted swiftly. They have not wasted any time doing a slow investigation; the moment they realised their Inquisitor boss was missing they started assembling a crusade and kicking doors down. As a result, they may actually be able to find the inquisitor within 3 days of their last recorded message. I'm thinking of a fun final encounter to round off the rescue mission, where the players have to break into one of the Mechanicus' research facilities.
This would be the site of a massive battle, where the Magos first ambushed the Ordo Hereticus inquisitor for straying too close to uncovering the truth. An Ordo Hereticus inquisitor being a paranoid twitchy trigger finger mess that they are, wasn't easy to take down.

My conception for the order of battle:
1. Hereticus Inquisitor goes to meet with the Magos to "discuss" why Mechanicus forces are not assisting against the xenos or helping enforce imperial authority in the hive. Realises quickly that the Magos is compromised, whilst the Magos also realises quickly the Hereticus Inquisitor is not going to compromise. Someone has to die.

2. Magos fails to capture/kill the Inquisitor in a surprise attack, which was already anticipated. Inquisitor's cadre and retinue cause mayhem in the Mechanicus facility, causing sabotage that kills nearly everyone. This being a facility that was the domain of a Magos Alchemys, I like to imagine there are loads of machines and experiments related to the ultimate goal of true transmutation. So lots of machines focusing on changings of state. Tech-warriors armed with exotic xenos/warp based weapons that cause mutations, rapid entropy or tech-priests intent on creating theoretical superdense elements/exotic states of matter. So an easy way to explain why my players don't immediately get gunned down by six hundred elite skitarii armed with exotic weapons is; most of them have been killed in an antimatter annihilation event that has gouged out a considerable amount of the facility, leaving it exposed to the terrible psy-worms and bio-construct gribblies that inhabit the amaranthine wastes.

3. Amidst the chaos, Divinatus Octus and Inquisitor Xavier Mordaunt engaged in battle. Divinatus Octus was slain, and communications cut off from the site after the cascade explosion triggered an EMP blast which wiped out long-range communications with the other Divinati. The Divinati are methodical, however they have their own urgent problem; they are clearing out a buried space hulk and so have only sent a scout force to verify what has happened at the research site. All of their other forces are engaged with taking control of the space hulk and renovating its warp drives & gellar fields. Overtly, the Divinati are allied with the rogue inquisitor Gosvinger, and are helping him take control of the AI-archaeotech ship the Mission of Hope. Covertly, the Divinati are attempting to achieve their own transmutation into an ascended being:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

With their backstory being when they divided themselves into eight pieces, they discovered the eightfold path of chaos. But rather than being "corrupted," the Magos views the warp as something axiomatic and comprehendible, repeating in patterns which they have identified. E.g:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The holy numbers of the four chaos gods forming their own patterns. So whereas Inquisitor Gosvinger is trying to use the archaeotech AI Mission of Hope to help him create a "holy" daemonhost army capable of waging war against daemonkind in the warp (as daemon weapons can permanently kill daemons, not just banish them), the surviving Divinati are trying to make one of their kind (probably Primus) ascend into the thousand armed incarnation of the Omnissiah. The Divinati end-game is to activate the warp drives and escape before the Inquisition or Mechanicus can stop them.

4. Meanwhile at the mechanicus site, if the players arrive fast enough, it'll be a race against time. Some of the Inquisitor's retinue and the inquisitor themself will still be alive, but not for long. Some are injured, there are amaranthine wildlife, injured skitarii and escaped experiment subjects still roaming around too.

Inquisitor Xavier Mordaunt
Saved by his armour's life support systems, force field and general sturdiness, Xavier Mordaunt is being held aloft by the "dead" body of Divinatus Octus (players will later discover that was actually Divinatus Quintus. 4 and 5 are amongst numbers Chaos doesn't really care about. Primus is probably going to be the segment the chaos gods favour the most, Octus the one who is the most ardent believer in the chaos axiom, whilst Quartus is probably the the segment which most opposes this radical tech-heresy. Plus I already have a character called Quintus so may as well get rid of the duplicates).
Xavier "killed" Quartus, however their body doesn't know it yet. Quartus's body remains active with automated defence-protocols online. So this presents a puzzle to the players; how to retrieve their inquisitor without triggering a hostile response from the Magos's body which could get them or their boss killed.

Random stormtrooper dude
One of Mordaunt's retinue. Hard as nails, a rare example of a guardsman who was later sent to stormtrooper school in his middle-ages. Encountered an escaped daemon which slaughtered everyone as quick as a blink. This Schrondinger's daemon is an inert statue when looked upon, but when no one observes it, it reverts to its warpy corporeal murder form. Stolen and studied by the Divinati for how such a warp entity could transmute back and forth between warp and material forms. The stormtrooper is stuck - the daemon's razor-sharp claw is wrapped around his throat and he can't exactly go anywhere or damage it in its statue form. The only way he has survived this long is that his left eye is a fake, glass eye. However, the curse that afflicts this daemon doesn't discriminate against disabilities or prosthetics; a bionic eye, a fake eye, a blind eye, is still an eye as long as the person who has it feels like they're their eyes.

A maltek, evil sinister-looking tech-priest
One of Mordaunt's retinue. Blind, deaf and mute thanks to all the battle damage and radiation messing with their bionics. Has spent the last few days blindly scavenging for parts to do a quick field-fix of themselves. Is using an auspex scanner hooked to their MIU as a quick replacement for their broken organs. Walks around looking like the pale man from Pan's labyrinth, using a chain saw to cut through dead bodies with suitable replacement bionics. Assuming the sinister looking tech-priest doesn't get shot on sight by paranoid players, actually just one of their allies in need of help.

A dying death cult assassin
A mortally wounded death cult assassin, found at the end of a corridor full of dead tech priests and skitarii. Can be saved with some challenging medicae checks or if they can find some chirugeon servitor, but being a death cult assassin and all, does not expect or wish to be saved.

A feral worlder
Hiding in the ceiling by doing hardcore parkour. Knows where the "war chief" is however has been stuck in a great hunt with a many-legged chameleonic predator, that seems to merge with the materials surrounding it. However, it is not actually a chameleon. It really is phasing through materials, like a necron wraith or tomb stalker...

The pilots
Two dead in their aircraft seat, their aircraft heavily damaged and upturned in the sands. Their bodies, already crawling with the local saprotrophs from the amaranthine wastes. Closer, successful inspection will determine they suffered almost no external wounds of any kind, having been killed by some experimental death ray. Inspection of the aircraft's black box reveals their flight was ordinary and they arrived at their destination without trouble, though 93 minutes after landing, experienced extreme accelerations, orientations and a sudden stop.

A dead witch hunter
Found dead in a charred room full of burnt bodies, their heavy flamer inert by their side, with a few large and bulky masses much too strange and large to be human. Miraculously, their body is unburnt. The Emperor (or heat retardent clothing) protects. Players get a free fate point back for witnessing such a glorious miracle.

The three musketeers
10000% annihilated. But players might be able to recover security footage showing the three musketeers causing the cascade annihilation event.

A data-savant hiding in a vault
Managing to seal himself in a vault to avoid dying to the battle and explosions happening outside, the data-savant made a risky call that whatever was imprisoned in the vault was less dangerous than whatever going on outside.

Not sure what the data-savant encounters in the vault yet. I'm thinking a cursed mirror whose reflections may sometimes manifest and emerge to try and force the other "back into the mirror" as both believe themselves to be the original, and the other the doppelganger. Most reflections use what means are available to them to force the other into the mirror. As the data-savant is a weak and feeble sort, they have been saved by their ineffectiveness, as both of them have instead been arguing for days and trying to prove through logic and debate that they are the original and the other should walk into the mirror.

Free space
A loyal retainer who is also speared on Divinatus Quintus's many mechandendrites. However, they did not survive.
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