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[LordBaal]

No, they grow and feed from sentient beings (humans included but not the only ones) feelings and/or souls. But regardless of from who or what they grow from, they do so on another dimension that we call the warp and use as short cut to travel faster than light. They are extra-dimensional beings. For they to be on this dimension they need a host (human or otherwise) or really specific conditions (reality fucked up beyond recognition due warp riffs or the like).

[LordBaal]

DELETE.

[Grim Portent]

Whether the gods are really gods or not is largely a matter of semantics. They aren't gods in the Abrahamic deity sense, but they tick all the boxes to be gods according to many polytheistic faiths. The thing is that in many polytheistic systems there's no intrinsic quality that makes something a god other than being powerful, though most associate the gods with a specific aspect of reality or society, so even if the gods are just powerful aliens from another reality they'd still be 'gods'.

[LordBaal]

That seems to be the most adequate answer.

[Tack]

Yeah, I like it.
I mean, the fact that they:
1. Are all-powerful.
2. Gain power from belief.
3. Grant gifts to those who appeal to them.

Do make them tick all the boxes.

[Kot]

1. Are all-powerful.

They aren't.

2. Gain power from belief.

They don't gain power from belief, apparently, even if Emperor thought so, they gain power from emotions (and souls). The believers just tend to do stuff to make those emotions feel stronger on both themselves (You do not want to see Slannesh cocaine-cult whorehouses) and other people (RIP AND TEAR YOUR GUTS), and their rituals may or may not involve feeding someones soul to them directly so it doesn't get lost in Warp (which basically mean it will get fragmented and some warp beings will eat it and so on).

3. Grant gifts to those who appeal to them.

That's tricky. They might as well fuck you up beyond recognition because they have a weird sense of humour, but I guess this box is indeed ticked.

The Chaos Gods in essence are very damn powerful Chaos beings, which can or can be not recognized as actual Gods depending on what boxes they must tick for you. So yeap, as Grim said it, it's a matter of semantics. I personally don't like calling them Gods because I still have very Christian recognition of that word (though, tbh, I don't like that God too, so...), but hey, it's for the ease of communication.

[Andres]

well the emperor stole magic from chaos to create them, right? so i wouldn't be surprised if their souls got eaten by chaos

No, that's just some lies the Chaos gods made up. The thing about Chaos gods is that they straight up lie through their teeth to get what they want, they're not limited to uncomfortable truths and technical truths.

They don't gain power from belief, apparently, even if Emperor thought so, they gain power from emotions (and souls).

They do get power from belief, possibly more than they do from emotions. The Emperor wanted to starve the Chaos gods of belief not to destroy them, but to weaken them. They would've still been around due to emotions and they still would've been strong, but they wouldn't have been as strong as they are now and would've been much more manageable.

[Rolepgeek]

I find it somewhat ironic to see Andrew trying to correct Kot here, on a matter with ties to the Emperor. Should be interesting to see how it turns out.

So what's the bay12 consensus as to whether Gork and Mork are real in the same way the Chaos Gods are?

[sprinkled chariot]

Emperors plan to bring peace and prosperity in galaxy could pretty much ruin life for khorne and nurgle.
However, in Wealthy society with enough food and even some leisure time people start enjoying themself, so hello pleasure prince! Also you guess, who benefits from all the change and focus on knowledge gathering.
Is there even a way of weakening all chaos gods except awakening necrons?

[Teneb]

So what's the bay12 consensus as to whether Gork and Mork are real in the same way the Chaos Gods are?

Gork and Mork are not only real, but tag-teamed on Khorne.

Remember: greenskins make stuff real through belief + their passive pyschic power. There are uncountable greenskins in the universe, and they all believe in Gork and Mork. Just like red 'unz go fastah, Gork and Mork are not only real but also really strong.

Is there even a way of weakening all chaos gods except awakening necrons?

Aside from turning everyone into blanks? I guess not.

Someone correct me if I am wrong, but daemons are immortal in 40k, right? Not like in fantasy where they can could be perma-killed. RIP

[Egan_BW]

Emperors plan to bring peace and prosperity in galaxy could pretty much ruin life for khorne and nurgle.
However, in Wealthy society with enough food and even some leisure time people start enjoying themself, so hello pleasure prince! Also you guess, who benefits from all the change and focus on knowledge gathering.
Is there even a way of weakening all chaos gods except awakening necrons?

I guess you could kill all the lifeforms that feed them. Kill all humans, eldar, probably orks, and leave only the tau to inherit the universe.

[Xantalos]

I've seen various warp beings explained like such:

Chaos Gods: [concept]
Racial Gods (ie Isha, Khaine, Asuryan): [concept] as expressed through [story], which is relevant to the way [race] experiences [concept]
Daemons and chaos champions going for daemonhood: performs [action] to promote and propogate [concept]
Gork and Mork: [concept] of the Orks.

[Kot]

Removing all sentient (Tau actually also do count, but to a much lesser extent) beings from the Galaxy is the only way to be sure. Basically sole reason why Alpha Legion was on Horus side is because Cabal told them that, if God-Emperor wins it the Chaos will win in the end, and if the Horus wins, then all sentient beings will get wiped out at one point or other, and Chaos will basically self-destruct.
Though apparently Alpharius and Omegon (one of them is in Alpha Legion, which tends to work against Chaos itself too, the other one is hinted to be the first Grand Master of Grey Knights, and we all know how they roll) choose the third option, eternal stalemate, which was not predicted by Cabal and basically noone else.


As for the belief, the Emperor thought that it is making them stronger but he also realized that emotions make them stronger, so yep, he indeed wanted to weaken them. Chaos is a reflection of all human beliefs and emotions, which is why Chaos gods tend to actually resemble the way they are portrayed by humans. Practically you are kind of right, because the desire for them to exist also makes them stronger, but the knowledge and even belief they exist doesn't do shit.

[Rolepgeek]

So what's the bay12 consensus as to whether Gork and Mork are real in the same way the Chaos Gods are?

Gork and Mork are not only real, but tag-teamed on Khorne.

Remember: greenskins make stuff real through belief + their passive pyschic power. There are uncountable greenskins in the universe, and they all believe in Gork and Mork. Just like red 'unz go fastah, Gork and Mork are not only real but also really strong.

They do, but that's where my question comes from. Their stuff only really works like that in their vicinity. So are Gork and Mork real independent of large Ork WAAAGHs and able to act throughout the Warp? They never really get mentioned in Warp-stuff, so I'm wondering if they're basically gestalt entities that exist in various styles and fashions around Orks, and get more powerful the more Orks conglomerate in a given place (New Imperial Inquisitorial plan; Orks can be dealt with more easily than Chaos can, or at least more reliably, so direct Ork WAAAGHs to Daemon Worlds, Gork and Mork beat the bloody spikey boyz down so theyz can be the boss o' dis 'ere planet now, and then Imperium comes in and clears that out once the WAAAGH moves on)

Removing all sentient (Tau actually also do count, but to a much lesser extent) beings from the Galaxy is the only way to be sure. Basically sole reason why Alpha Legion was on Horus side is because Cabal told them that, if God-Emperor wins it the Chaos will win in the end, and if the Horus wins, then all sentient beings will get wiped out at one point or other, and Chaos will basically self-destruct.
Though apparently Alpharius and Omegon (one of them is in Alpha Legion, which tends to work against Chaos itself too, the other one is hinted to be the first Grand Master of Grey Knights, and we all know how they roll) choose the third option, eternal stalemate, which was not predicted by Cabal and basically noone else.


As for the belief, the Emperor thought that it is making them stronger but he also realized that emotions make them stronger, so yep, he indeed wanted to weaken them. Chaos is a reflection of all human beliefs and emotions, which is why Chaos gods tend to actually resemble the way they are portrayed by humans. Practically you are kind of right, because the desire for them to exist also makes them stronger, but the knowledge and even belief they exist doesn't do shit.

Yeah, but if you took out the largest powerfully psychic race in the galaxy (humans; their numbers make up for their level of psychic strength, but they have a very intimate connection to Chaos from what I know of the lore, even if it's not directly pointed out), then Chaos(as in, Chaos Gods, mostly, since Warp entities would still exist to some extent) wouldn't have enough to feed on to sustain itself, is what I remember, relating to the Cabal. Although I thought the current state (where Emperor did, in fact, win, but it led to this stalemate and slow deterioration that gives Chaos such juicy emotions to eat) was the scenario that led to Chaos winning.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

As I recall it the Cabal said that the system shock of going all in on humanity only to have Horus start a self-destructive crusade would result in the Warp becoming untangled and return to being the Realm of Souls.