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Author Topic: What do you need for a first-time embark site?  (Read 1508 times)

Zarnium

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What do you need for a first-time embark site?
« on: June 21, 2014, 09:19:23 pm »

I keep trying to find good embark sites with the parameters recommended by the wiki, but I get very few sites or none at all on each world I generate, even after loosening the parameters a bit. Exactly what are the bare minimum qualities needed in an embark site for a first-time game?

Also, I keep running into "wet" material that the dwarves won't dig through. How can I avoid this?
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Panando

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Re: What do you need for a first-time embark site?
« Reply #1 on: June 21, 2014, 09:35:51 pm »

Look for an embark with tree coverage and no aquifer (the wet tiles are aquifer). I personally find it easier to use flatter sites, the kind which are found on valley floors, embarking on steep slopes makes for a surface which isn't very easy to get an overview of and it's not easy to dig large rooms in the soil layer, there is an "elevation" map view (press tab to find it) which shows how sharply the elevations change. But in practise it just means looking for forested valleys without aquifers (generally meaning, nearer the mountains). It can be a good idea to include a brook/stream for fresh water.
The shallow/deep metals thing isn't very trustworthy (because it also includes non-smeltable vein stones), if you want to be somewhat assured of having metals just crank up the the metal frequency in world generation.

In this version savagery doesn't really matter but you do want to avoid the evil (purple) biomes, they can be nasty.
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arbarbonif

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Re: What do you need for a first-time embark site?
« Reply #2 on: June 21, 2014, 09:39:04 pm »

The wet thing means that the tile is next to water, either a water feature or an aquifer.  Aquifers are tiles that generate infinite amounts of water (and can thus flood forts quite easily).  You can tunnel under lakes and rivers, the message just warns you, you can re-designate it and they will dig (and probably either flood the place or complain that the next square is also wet).

For your first fort I would suggest finding a place without an aquifer, with trees, and as much metal as you can find.  You can tweak the options when you generate a world to get more metal and such.
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ancistrus

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Re: What do you need for a first-time embark site?
« Reply #3 on: June 21, 2014, 09:40:12 pm »

I am not sure what the wiki says about the subject. The wet alert you are getting is most likely due to aquifers. Look for an area near a mountain, aquifers are almost never there.
Besides that, your area should have a decent number of trees, the keywords here are woodland or heavily forested.
Also make sure your area is not sinister/haunted/terrifying.

Apart from these three things, nothing matters much. Later, you will have your own preferences, but the first time is just to learn basics and you don't need anything special for those.
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fortydayweekend

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Re: What do you need for a first-time embark site?
« Reply #4 on: June 21, 2014, 10:27:17 pm »

A river/stream/brook in the embark can also help, as it means your dwarves won't die of thirst if you run out of booze.
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Zarnium

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Re: What do you need for a first-time embark site?
« Reply #5 on: June 21, 2014, 11:05:47 pm »

See, I made sure there wasn't an aquifer in my sites before I picked them, but I still ran into wet materials both times I tried to start digging. I guess there were underground lakes or something.
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ancistrus

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Re: What do you need for a first-time embark site?
« Reply #6 on: June 21, 2014, 11:21:12 pm »

^Possible, unlikely. You don't get damp stone alerts if you dig into an underground lake from above.
Sorry to ask this but are you certain you understand how pre-embark screen works? Have you examined every biome that your starting site is a part of? (use the F1,F2...keys)
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Zarnium

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Re: What do you need for a first-time embark site?
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2014, 12:06:20 am »

I thought I got the basics; you have three zoom levels of the map, and you move your embark site on the section on the left with the umkh keys, and the text on the right shows what qualities the embark site has. I haven't picked sites that it says have aquifers.

I'm also having trouble finding a place to build a fortress that has underground dirt so you can have an underground farm.

I actually played the game a bit a long time ago on a pre-made save file, but I've never tried to pick an embark site before.
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fortydayweekend

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Re: What do you need for a first-time embark site?
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2014, 12:24:45 am »

Are you using DFHack? The "prospect all" command gives you a full rundown of estimated soil, rock, ores and gems. So you can pick a site that has what you want - sand, clay, soil, iron, gold, flux etc.

It doesn't reveal aquifers but as ancistrus said, when you're on the "biome" view (the default view) hit F1/F2/F3 etc to see the different biomes.

Or just pick a site at the base of a mountain range, almost guaranteed to have no aquifer.
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sal880612m

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Re: What do you need for a first-time embark site?
« Reply #9 on: June 22, 2014, 02:38:23 am »

See, I made sure there wasn't an aquifer in my sites before I picked them, but I still ran into wet materials both times I tried to start digging. I guess there were underground lakes or something.

Any tile directly under a water tile will generate a damp stone message like an aquifer. So if you try to dig under a pond you will get that message, but I think you are safe to dig those tiles anyway. You simply need to redesignate the tiles for digging.

Are you using DFHack? The "prospect all" command gives you a full rundown of estimated soil, rock, ores and gems. So you can pick a site that has what you want - sand, clay, soil, iron, gold, flux etc.

It doesn't reveal aquifers but as ancistrus said, when you're on the "biome" view (the default view) hit F1/F2/F3 etc to see the different biomes.

Prospect all won't give information on aquifers during embark selection but once you have embarked it will.
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Ai Shizuka

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Re: What do you need for a first-time embark site?
« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2014, 03:25:36 am »

You also have to consider your surroundings when embarking.
Avoid the three evil types (sinister, haunted, terrifying) in your first few games.
I personally wouldn't start on the boring biomes (serene, calm, mirthful, wilderness), but I'd strongly consider an 'untamed wilds' biome.

You don't risk getting demolished in the first month, but you can still have interesting creatures to get a feel for combat without venturing into the caverns.
A small squad with basic equipment is enough to deal with most surface creatures.
It's good early training for your militia and the giant animals are an excellent source of food and bones.
In doubt, if something looks too nasty for your soldiers, ignore it. Surface creatures wander off the map on their own after a while.
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Melting Sky

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Re: What do you need for a first-time embark site?
« Reply #11 on: June 22, 2014, 04:26:54 am »

Check for the embark's neighboring civilizations. You probably want a spot where you can trade with the humans and elves and if its your first fort then you might want to avoid setting up next to a necromancer tower.

It's also nice to have a wood source so look for an embark with some tree bearing biomes in it. As others have mentioned steams and rivers are desirable.
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Panando

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Re: What do you need for a first-time embark site?
« Reply #12 on: June 22, 2014, 05:01:03 am »

In my experience the aquifer thing is not entirely reliable. Since I 90% of the time embark deliberately on aquifers, I know that it often generates false-positives (or there might only be a little bit of the map with aquifer). This is especially the case on maps with elevation changes, and with clay, but sometimes the map just doesn't have an aquifer - might be when the stone layer starts too close to the surface.

I also believe it generates false negatives, some places which say no aquifer just look suspect - but I don't have enough experience embarking on no-aquifer sites to know for sure.

But still, as a rule, highland areas don't have aquifers, and lowland areas do.
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ancistrus

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Re: What do you need for a first-time embark site?
« Reply #13 on: June 22, 2014, 07:48:49 am »

A site that is said to have no aquifer can have an aquifer only if it borders tiles that do have aquifer. In that case, however, the aquifer will only appear at the edge od your map, in small amounts.
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Dunamisdeos

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Re: What do you need for a first-time embark site?
« Reply #14 on: June 22, 2014, 10:04:42 am »

Ok so I'm bad at explanations, but I have fun with MS Paint. Hit da spoiler below.

I think you are either...

digging at point A) Directly down into an aquifer. Now, the thing to remember is that map features are decided by biome. If you have embarked on the border between two areas (say, if a grassland and a mountain are both on your embark site), You will have the features of both on your map. It will only ever show one area on your embark screen (the one that you are directly centered on in the leftmost zoom). Thus it is possible to get things like iron, no iron, flux, coal and aquifers in different parts of your map.

Now, in your current situation, you may say "Wow that blows". But this ALSO means you can embark right on the edge of an area with, say iron and no flux, and then the area next to it could have flux and no iron. It can be very useful.

or..

B) You may have made it either past an aquifer by accident, or you may have coincidentally dug down into the first cavern layer without realizing it. This is unlikely, but possible.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Also, there's usually 3 cavern layers, but I wasn't paying attention. Don't judge the caverns, judge the adorable little covered wagon dwarves.
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