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Author Topic: 30 Days of Modding - Day 30 - Done!  (Read 70979 times)

Splint

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Re: 30 Days of Modding - Day 26 - Testing and Tutorials
« Reply #525 on: August 04, 2014, 03:49:49 pm »

In the manuals, since they aren't exactly a secret, can they include what shown symptom goes with what disease in the combat reports? I had to dig into the raws to figure out a caravan had meningitis.

Meph

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Re: 30 Days of Modding - Day 26 - Testing and Tutorials
« Reply #526 on: August 04, 2014, 04:00:18 pm »

In the manuals, since they aren't exactly a secret, can they include what shown symptom goes with what disease in the combat reports? I had to dig into the raws to figure out a caravan had meningitis.
If they go to a hospital the doc can actually diagnose them with meningitis. Why is that important? All medicine works on all diseases. Or did you want to know if its a disease that spreads?
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Splint

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Re: 30 Days of Modding - Day 26 - Testing and Tutorials
« Reply #527 on: August 04, 2014, 05:07:42 pm »

If they go to a hospital the doc can actually diagnose them with meningitis. Why is that important? All medicine works on all diseases. Or did you want to know if its a disease that spreads?
I wouldn't have even suggested it if the reports gave me any clue at all what the disease was other than Urist McSicky doesn't have color in his face and looks like he'd been staring at a computer screen too long. For example genetic diseases are easy to spot or their reports make it clear what the disease is. When I went to the manual about the contagious ones, they were absolutely no help other than how they kill your dorfs and how fast they can spread, which for a nonsecret FUN source I found odd.

The main issue is early on the effects aren't severe enough to be any help either. Any pain effects they can ignore with even average willpower. Another way to go is make the early nonfatal symptoms more debilitating in some way; temporary sight loss for example, based on blind dwarves habitually complaining about their eyes, setting in after a few days (time enough to potentially infect more people and still pose a possible problem at normal or faster gamespeeds before seeing a doctor) would be a good way to force anyone with a contagious disease to go to the damn hospital to figure out what horrible thing they have contracted in a timely manner. Of course having a shitty diagnostician can make this problem worse when they don't get done quick and get infected too.

Also I'd like to also suggest anything that can result in a "cerebral infarction" instead just be a fatal stroke. The spam of them regaining and losing consciousness is irritating and can potentially disrupt trade completely and not in the usual "they fuck off and won't work with you this season" way (it's why I disable high blood pressure, and had I known meningitis could cause something similar would have made it fatal as well.)

I would be willing to forgo the disease obviousness for less annoying meningitis and blood pressure, but ultimately it's your show and your choice. I simply provided what I would consider helpful. Others may agree or disagree, I just wanted to make the suggestion and why i suggested them.

Meph

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Re: 30 Days of Modding - Day 26 - Testing and Tutorials
« Reply #528 on: August 04, 2014, 06:45:33 pm »

Splint, I am not sure if you know, but the diseases have been written by Halfling, not by me. I know about as much about them as anyone else who opened the raws. They actually turned out not as I expected, thats why they are disabled by default... one day I have to sit down and write a better system...
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Splint

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Re: 30 Days of Modding - Day 26 - Testing and Tutorials
« Reply #529 on: August 04, 2014, 06:52:39 pm »

I'm sure I did and forgot. I just felt the need to point out that the logs/manual are zero help when dealing with the contagious stuff for the first time or as a refresher and the problem with anything that doesn't cause a fatal brain thing.

Pwnzerfaust

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Re: 30 Days of Modding - Day 26 - Testing and Tutorials
« Reply #530 on: August 04, 2014, 08:32:15 pm »

Your work orders. Your humans ignore refuse that is outside.

Derp, of course. Thanks!
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Flare

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Re: 30 Days of Modding - Day 25 - FINAL HUMAN RELEASE and GAME SPEED!
« Reply #531 on: August 05, 2014, 06:55:25 am »

So... drinks and plants produce too much money you say?

I don't think they produce too much money compared to other methods. In effect having tried out the other methods of making money, making alcohol is one of the more labor and time intensive means of making gold. Take mining for example, one guy with one pick can mine out 10 rocks for you and 500 gold coins at a moment's notice. A barrel full of alcohol requires a farmer, someone to make barrels, a brewer, and time to let the crop grow (1 whole season). Currently, I'm embarked in a serene area so there's feather wood growing everywhere. 2 of these logs net the same amount as 2 barrels of alcohol, and with the instagrow that the elven merchant can do it is immensely lucrative.

This is probably the only mod where I actually embark with special industies in mind and shape my town accordingly. Not many other mods make it viable where I dig a giant freaking hole in the middle of the map and make it the only thing that I do. Kinda wish the humans have the drilling rig from the gnomes as well as some way to monetize magma more directly than through obsidian though, the human enterprising spirit just screams for an oil industry parody. In fact, I'm going to add that in and see how it goes.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2014, 07:26:19 am by Flare »
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slay_mithos

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Re: 30 Days of Modding - Day 26 - Testing and Tutorials
« Reply #532 on: August 05, 2014, 10:52:06 am »

@Flare: You might be on to something that could benefit other races too (dwarves for example).

With the magma well not really living up to its cost (aka where is my infinite lava, I spent 1-2 blood of Armok for not even enough lava for my forges), having someone trade lava barrels of some sort (that can be safely transported unloaded into a trench), heavy but don't melt the transporter...

If it can be added to caravans too, all the better for the mod as a whole, no?
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Meph

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Re: 30 Days of Modding - Day 26 - Testing and Tutorials
« Reply #533 on: August 05, 2014, 06:40:33 pm »

Dev Log - Day 28

Some human changes, got Smakes Orc update which I will merge in, got Boltguns Succubus update which I will merge in...

More work on the manual done.

Gave Warlock militia captians (the ghoul and skeleton commanders) number:as_needed, which means you can have as many as you like, not just one. It was requested several times, and while I personally disagree with it, I bow to public opinion. :P

Tomorrow I merge the raws I have for the different races and proofread the manual.
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Meph

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Re: 30 Days of Modding - Day 28 - minor adjustements
« Reply #534 on: August 06, 2014, 09:46:44 am »

Some more raw fixes for humans.

 - Added diamonds, sapphires, emeralds and rubies as high-value gems to the merchant stall.
 - Converted Ore Merchant from copper/silver/gold to gold only. (I missed that one, it was in reaction_human, not reaction_trading.)
 - Fixed some profession naming errors.
 - Added skill help titles and more info to reaction names, like gold prices.
 - Brick splitting block only accepts non-economic rocks now.
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::: ☼Meph Tileset☼☼Map Tileset☼- 32x graphic sets with TWBT :::
::: ☼MASTERWORK DF☼ - A comprehensive mod pack now on Patreon - 250.000+ downloads and counting :::
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vonsch

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Re: 30 Days of Modding - Day 28 - minor adjustements
« Reply #535 on: August 06, 2014, 11:18:33 am »

So no more bricking peat! :)

Balance thing... fish is really easy gold. Especially once you have a legendary fisherman. I need two food merchants just to keep up, and that's with two novice cleaners cleaning as much as they can too. But even at the start if I embark with a fisherman 5 I can easily get a guild or two up in the first season. I know it won't be the same with food, due to the wait on crops (or the more limited and chancy foraging payoff.) And meat hunting (or farming) has its own delays and downsides. Fishing seems a gold pump as it stands. Woodchopping might be good early, but the downside is deforestation and a wait for regrowth.

You do need water (unless we're talking fish farming, which I am not!), but unless you're doing desert or glacier embarks, water is pretty common. I am currently fishing the same pond for two years with no sign of fish running out. Have a river and lake (and more ponds) if the fish do get wiped out in the pond. But at this rate it will be moot. I have 6 guilds developed and 90k more coins just sitting until I have room to do more industry. I'm playing half speed, so far, and just hit spring of third year.

Maybe bump it from 30 to 50 fish per 500 gold?  Too much higher and it might mean a lot of rotting with low skill fishermen though. Though a stockpile and barrels can address that.

Also, is a 1:1 stone exchange intended? I can mine an junk stone and swap it for another junk stone even up.  Nice from OCD types (not me!) but seems there should be some penalty, like with food where you buy at one higher price and sell at a lower one. Stone sell prices maybe can use a tweak too, but so far I haven't sold much. It's also harder to haul, and it means all that dealing with the dark somehow, so maybe that's okay,

Hmm, occurs to me the stone prices could also really help with hauling. :)  Put a merchant down in the mine to buy it close to where it's produced, then another topside at your stonecutter. Reverse that old maxim: Buy low, sell high. In this case buy high (up at stonecutter) and sell low (down in the mine.)

I already put my food merchant right next to my hot fishing hole... both of the merchants, that is.

I haven't even looked at the wood merchant yet.  I would think the deforestation and regrowth cycle would control that.

Side note (not a human issue only): tallow entries in stockpile have not been simplified. The list is LONG. And only one we need is "tallow." Same applies to other fat entries. The others aren't an issue since the kitchen can handle them transparently. But unless I allow all the tallow to be cooked, it piles up until I make candles and it's hard to manage unless I scroll through that list (even using search for "tallow") and pick out the one entry for a stockpile with barrels allowed.

Similarly: milk.

Not huge issues, but they do affect playability.

Am enjoying humans a lot. Aside from swamp draining, that is. :)
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Meph

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Re: 30 Days of Modding - Day 28 - minor adjustements
« Reply #536 on: August 06, 2014, 11:41:42 am »

Thanks for the feedback. I sadly cant do much about fishing... but the stone thing is intended, as human need those for constructions and it should be easy to get the right kind, and get rid of the wrong kind.

I am not sure how the tallow and milk entries could be simplified, the leather stockpile was actually a fix by BillyJack. I think adding a tallow-creature and redirecting all creature tallow to that would work. But stuff like that is pretty low on my list. :P

30 fish is really too cheap? That must be a lot of hauling, no?
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::: ☼MASTERWORK DF☼ - A comprehensive mod pack now on Patreon - 250.000+ downloads and counting :::
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vonsch

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Re: 30 Days of Modding - Day 28 - minor adjustements
« Reply #537 on: August 06, 2014, 12:13:09 pm »

The hauling is 4 steps. :)

I finally set it up in workflow, but workflow doesn't handle two jobs producing the same output very well. One ends up suspended and when I check back I have 500 fish and only one merchant actively buying.

I have the same issue with multiple stone cutters making blocks. It's not your problem though. Nothing to do with Humans. See the same thing with ash outputs. among others.

I thought the leather fix was you. Not a big deal, just something that would be nice to see cleaned up. Hmm, maybe the key is to rename "tallow" to "generic tallow" or "pure tallow" so it can be searched for. The problem now is there seems to be no way to specify tallow without any modifier. The search function pulls anything containing "tallow." (Unless I am missing a delimiter trick of some kind.)

I suddenly have the urge to poke around.






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Meph

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Re: 30 Days of Modding - Day 28 - minor adjustements
« Reply #538 on: August 06, 2014, 12:17:47 pm »

if you rename tallow, you get "animal renamed tallow" lists, it wouldnt help. ;) Good luck with the poking, I know its possible, but I'd have to look it up. Look at the top of creature_masterwork.txt for examples.
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::: ☼Meph Tileset☼☼Map Tileset☼- 32x graphic sets with TWBT :::
::: ☼MASTERWORK DF☼ - A comprehensive mod pack now on Patreon - 250.000+ downloads and counting :::
::: WorldBicyclist.com - Follow my bike tours around the world - 148 countries visited :::

smakemupagus

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Re: 30 Days of Modding - Day 28 - minor adjustements
« Reply #539 on: August 06, 2014, 12:38:49 pm »

I've had a series of crashes on load/embark, which I can't isolate.  In my case it stopped crashing when I stopped using Rendermax, i don't know whether this is a coincidence or if perhaps it isn't playing nice with something else.  Sometimes, but not always during the crash, an external window would pop up with an error with a few words about colors.  Sometimes, I could play for a minute but as soon as I changed the zoom level it would go down.

This is on the latest human test version plus my orcfort dev.4.1, crashes occured on all 3 civs that i tried (human, kob, orc)

I doubt errorlog is relevant but here it is just in case;

These I just hotfixed and regen'd.  They're from Fortdef races looking for an item which no longer exists, i guess?  i just commented out that line in entity
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

These errors persist.  The ones about inorganics I don't understand.  The werewolf ones occur when you turn off the ww civ.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

After regenerating a few worlds and finally turning off Rendermax, it works fine and I played for a couple years.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2014, 12:40:59 pm by smakemupagus »
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