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Author Topic: Invasions/sieges?  (Read 1066 times)

Grip

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Invasions/sieges?
« on: June 15, 2014, 01:37:34 pm »

When should I expect my first Goblin attack? It's been two or three years since embark, and I haven't seen a single Gobbo. What biome attributes, if any, determine the frequency of invasions? I'm ready for some Fun.
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sal880612m

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Re: Invasions/sieges?
« Reply #1 on: June 15, 2014, 02:13:16 pm »

If you don't have goblin neighbors at embark you won't get goblin sieges. If you have embarked on an island with no other civs on it you won't get sieges period. If you have done neither of those you should be attacked by goblins based on your produced wealth or you current population, I think the values you need to pass are 100000 created wealth or 80 dwarves. Also your map edges must not be totally blocked off via ice/obsidian/etc or you will not be able to get any visitors as I understand it.
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Grip

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Re: Invasions/sieges?
« Reply #2 on: June 15, 2014, 02:17:46 pm »

If you don't have goblin neighbors at embark you won't get goblin sieges.

I didn't think to check the neighbors pre-embark. Would I be able to accomplish the same thing by checking civilizations, though? If I remember correctly, I only have the Mountainhome listed there.
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sal880612m

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Re: Invasions/sieges?
« Reply #3 on: June 15, 2014, 02:24:26 pm »

it is in one of the other segments you use tab to get to. It is a pretty straightforward list that simply states what races have access to your embark. ie, humans, elves, dwarves, goblins not The Iron Picks or The Glorious Helms. The civ section will only list playable civs so unless you have modded the raws it will only list dwarven civs.
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Grip

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Re: Invasions/sieges?
« Reply #4 on: June 15, 2014, 02:29:01 pm »

Again, I didn't know to check before hitting embark. Other than waiting for a siege that may or may not actually arrive, is there any other way to check neighbors at this stage? Like maybe something in the save data, the raws, or something? 
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sal880612m

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Re: Invasions/sieges?
« Reply #5 on: June 15, 2014, 02:35:47 pm »

I would copy your save, load the copy, abandon the fort, go to re-embark find your fort and use Tab to look at the neighbors.
There is probably a way to get the information from the raws but I suspect the above is much, much easier.

I thought you meant checking civs at embark not after, my bad. As far as I know it will only list civs your fortress has had encounters with so it will be of no use to you.
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"I was chopping off little bits of 'im till he talked, startin' at the toes."
"You probably should have stopped sometime before his eyes."

Grip

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Re: Invasions/sieges?
« Reply #6 on: June 15, 2014, 02:42:07 pm »

Thanks! If any gobbos show up, there will be much !!Fun!! to be had since I only recently got a forge built. And a dwarf decided to throw a party, depriving me of most of my labor force.
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Panando

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Re: Invasions/sieges?
« Reply #7 on: June 15, 2014, 06:20:22 pm »

Typically sieges are based on population and wealth. You generate that kind of wealth through high-level industry, masterwork quality armor and stuff. Even an inexperienced player may generate heaps of wealth if they embark on a volcano with heaps of gold or something and go nuts with the gold items.

Even under the best circumstances sieges can be unpredictable, it helps to embark next to a goblin fortress, or look for a world where your civ is at war with the elves. But if you really want sieges you should install a mod like Fortress Defense (which is also integrated into several popular modpacks), Fortress Defense is quite well balanced and nearly guarantees several sieges per year (but none for the first 3 or 4 seasons), other than adding additional races which siege you, it doesn't mod the gameplay.
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Grip

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Re: Invasions/sieges?
« Reply #8 on: June 15, 2014, 06:26:58 pm »

If my Dwarves don't have to deal with sieges for a while, then I'm not complaining. Like I said, I only just got the forge set up, and I'm trying to figure out why nobody wants to make charcoal/coke in the furnace, even though they have wood burning enabled.
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Panando

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Re: Invasions/sieges?
« Reply #9 on: June 15, 2014, 06:45:44 pm »

I think the siege aspect of the game is inspired by Tolkien's world, where a fortress is sieged based on rumours of it's great wealth and prosperity.
But goblin ambushes can appear much more unpredictably, without a defence strategy an ambush can cause serious damage, but they are deterred very easily. A few traps in the entranceway will probably be enough to make them think twice about coming inside (but they'll slaughter unarmed dwarves they catch outside). In some fortresses gobs will ambush a lot, in others you can go for years and years without them coming.
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Grip

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Re: Invasions/sieges?
« Reply #10 on: June 15, 2014, 07:03:46 pm »

See, that's another thing. Almosy all of my fortress is underground, and both entrances have hatch covers on top of them. The only thing I have above the surface is my trade depot, which is surrounded by a wall, which also contains the hatch covers and a water source zone, plus a pasture zone. The entrance, however, is what worries me. At the moment, I have a three block gap in the wall, with a relatively small pit one z-level deep. On top of that is a retracting bridge, but I can't figure out how to make mechanism, so it's stuck open. How would I make mechanisms, and what could I do to make it more secure?
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sal880612m

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Re: Invasions/sieges?
« Reply #11 on: June 15, 2014, 07:07:30 pm »

Mechanisms are made from stone in a mechanic's workshop. Instead of a retracting bridge you should use a raising bridge, which acts as a wall when it is up. You will need to break your current bridge and rebuild it to change it to raising and pick the direction you want the bridge to raise. It takes 3 mechanisms to be able to raise a bridge, one to build a lever and two to link the bridge to the lever.
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Grip

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Re: Invasions/sieges?
« Reply #12 on: June 15, 2014, 07:36:26 pm »

What about the wall? Should I just keep it one Z level high with fortifications at ground level, or would it be better to add stairs to an elevated ring of fortifications?
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sal880612m

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Re: Invasions/sieges?
« Reply #13 on: June 15, 2014, 07:51:06 pm »

My military skills are less than impressive but I would say it is more important to put a roof over the area than whether the fortifications are even with the ground or one level up.
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"I was chopping off little bits of 'im till he talked, startin' at the toes."
"You probably should have stopped sometime before his eyes."

Panando

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Re: Invasions/sieges?
« Reply #14 on: June 16, 2014, 02:43:33 am »

However note that "bridging off" the entrance is a generally poor strategy. It takes siegers a LONG time to go away by themselves, and during that time they prevent (or kill) immigrants and caravans.

Instead it's usually better to build a trap corridor protecting your fortress. It is well worth figuring out the Civilian Alert, this allows you to order everyone (including pets) into a safe area (i.e. behind the trap corridor), it is very effective, perhaps THE best way to keep civilians alive.

So build a trap corridor, then if danger rears it's ugly head, activate the civilian alert. Enemies should walk into the trap corridor, sustain a few losses, then chicken out and bravely run away. Enemies in DF do not know tactical retreat, they have only two modes: Advance, and run off the map.
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