COMPILATION OF READSPart 2Players Who Have Given ReadsIn Chronological OrderNQTJimToonymanFlabortPersusZombie UristJackJiokuyIncomplete ReadsKing "Everyone else hovers around null" ToasterTheWetSheepOttofarPlayers Yet To Give ReadsTiruin, or her replacement
Imperial Guardsman
Initial Follow UpJim, Do you really think so many people are null/neutral?
Toaster,
Sheep,
Ottofar, what do you think about the players you didn't mention?
(I'm at work atm, so pretty tight for time here and there's a lot to look at here, so will get back to more people as soon as poss. Also, there are some patterns in the reads that I want to explore ASAP.)
Meph, vote count please! Also,
extend.
AnswersToasterWhat value do you expect from aggregate suspicion?
In one of the BMs (the wizard-themed one), by collating people's suspicions I noticed there was one player the majority of people had suspected throughout the game, but not all at the same time so he's slipped through. Sure enough, I resolved an end-of-day tie against him and he was scum. It's not the only tool or by any stretch the most useful, but it's a potentially useful thing to check.
FlabortNQT What do you think of Persus, 4mask, and Jim? If there were more than one third party, which one is most likely for there to be?
OK sure. Persus is pursuing IG which could mean one of the following: Persus is scum and is after a safe target (possible but unlikely when mislynching town is preferable), Persus is town and genuinely disbelieves IG's claim (possible, but if so somewhat overestimates IG), Persus is a third party who's wincon is tied up with defeating IG (like, Persus is secretly a cultist survivor that's out to stop IG or what-have-you. Possible, but a bit of a leap). Right now, I think it's slightly more likely Persus isn't scum, but the reasons I have for this are less compelling the more I think about them. Especially as scum often tend to pick one case and then just doggedly stick with it...
Wolf I'm reading as slightly town now. He's a bit bristly but I don't read defensiveness as scummy. Usually town want to avoid being mislynched too. Sheep, his replacement, has come in with a fresh case which is promising. I want to see more of Sheep before passing a fuller judgement. If he's town, hopefully he'll still be with us tomorrow.
Jim's getting a lot of flak right now— I don't think Flabort was the best target for him to have picked and he's not made any other case the whole day. Now he's getting mad because he's lynch candidate and the cases against him aren't strongly made. I think there are both better and worse people to lynch today than Jim.
Meph creates the set-ups using a computer script (he gets a bunch of random draws and picks the one he likes best, tweaking it a bit), as such there could be any kind of third party here. We'll have a better idea on Day 2, I daresay.
ZU Glad to see you posting some substance!
NQT: [1] Lots of IIOA, [2]asking for lots of information without really doing anything with it. [3]Called Tiruin out for lurking way too early because he was too excited. I don't really understand why he being excited would lead him to call out a lurker.[4] Asked about an IG lynch and 4mask lynch even though they were at that time very unlikely to be lynched claiming that everyone needs to be responsible for a mislynch. He said he was asking early because
...if no one had done anything else at that time he would have died and I wanted people's opinions on this.
Its super unlikely that there would have been no activity at all after that it makes no sense for him to be worried about him being lynched.
[5]I also disagree with his reasoning that everyone needs the blame for a mislynch. The people voting for the target are obviously responsible, but often if you aren't voting for the person and you have a legitimate case on someone else sometimes it just happens that more people agree with the other case.
1.
You seem to be using IIOA incorrectly: I've not speculated on the set-up at all. 2. As I've stated when asking for it, the information will be of most use in future days after flips. But as intended, I've got some initial analysis of everyone's reads in this post with more to follow. 3. I was just in an enthusiastic moment and hadn't really registered that it was still very early on in the game (as I'd posted more than most people at that stage, the game felt like it was quite developed at that time). 4. I've seen games dry up in activity towards the end of a day loads of times, and there was every indication at that time that one of them would be lynched and I wanted to know what people felt about it. As you'll see in a second, I'm about to do the same for the current lynch target. 5. But if you believe the person who is going to be lynched isn't scum and you don't try to prevent that lynch, then you're partly responsible for the mislynch. Scum like to keep their hands clean of mislynches, letting town do the dirty work and claiming innocence: it takes every player to make a mislynch happen.
Jack*notquitethere: (revoting for clarity at a glance) Spent quite some time sitting back and trying to keep attention on whoever was getting attention, while giving as little as possible in the way of his thoughts. Defense, when confronted on this, has been a mix of generally competent, but weak, attempts to create doubt, coupled with desperate attempts to make facts seem to back his narrative (see, for instance, the astounding attempt to spin the fact that he was defending himself into proof that he wasn't holding himself to a lower standard of openness than he said everyone should be held to). Moderate scum lean.
It seems we've reached an impasse here: I've tried to explain as clearly as I can where I was coming from, how I'd intended to give my reflections (and have now since done so) but wanted to make sure everyone else had given theirs. I did hold people to a higher standard of openness than myself
at the time, because I knew I'd be posting lots of good content after I'd had the chance of a more thorough read through. I can see why you might not have liked this then, but given that I've delivered on everything I promised, I don't really see what you still have to complain about.
If that were my intention, why would I go about consistently bringing up the need for reads and reflections from others?
notquitethere: To explain why you were trying to focus as much attention as you could on those who were already under attack. To look like an active, helpful player.
Do I only
look like an active and helpful player? I'm more active than you and by asking others for reads I've ensured it's happened. Pretty helpful, wouldn't you say?
Also, by pressing everyone and pursuing a number of cases throughout the day (rather than tunneling one person), I've drawn more flak on myself. How is my play consistent with trying to avoid attention?
I think you hoped nobody would notice your behaviour, including your lack of thoughts, but had some vague idea of how to explain your actions in case you were noticed. Standard on-the-fly mafia behaviour: no detailed plans, some room for error, you know. Playing like actual people play, not like the I'm Too Good A Scum Player To Do That argument assumes scum players play (I don't much like that argument, but I see it all too often).
So you're accusing me of playing like... a player. Every single player in this game could concievably be scum, I fail to see how my actions as you've described them make it more likely that I am scum than any other player here. Invent a story to explain my behaviour through a scum lens isn't a case.
Your idea of a good explanation was likely an explanation that would fit with your known tendency towards heterodox play, a tendency you recently awkwardly shoehorned into one of your arguments in defense against Toaster ("I almost always play in ways people disagree with: am I scum in every game?"). (You really wanted people to remember that, didn't you?)
Or, you know, I do have a strong tendency for heterodox play and I'm used to drawing suspicion for bogus things in every game I play?
In sum, I'm seeing a lot of rationalising an existing prejudice. You've decided I'm scum and now you're squeezing everything to confirm that bias.