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[Evaris]

Sure that works, but they would be bringing these items. Thats what I meant with weapon-wielding animals. ^^

I think Ents make a lot more sense.

I'd have to say Ents would be interesting to see, and do make for a better tree-hugging race than elves.  I mean at least you can't criticize Ents for being fanatically tree-hugging as they -are- trees.

[Meph]

Yep. The question I have is: Are ents allies? (of elves and dwarves) or enemies? or not... or do I make elves and ents hostile to dwarves, because both are good and nature loving... I dont know.

Would be weird to see elves fighting with ents.

[Evaris]

I think that it would lead to loyalty cascades for the elves, since if you made ents a plant-type being... wouldn't said elf that attacked the ent be a criminal to other elves? 

[Dirst]

Yep. The question I have is: Are ents allies? (of elves and dwarves) or enemies? or not... or do I make elves and ents hostile to dwarves, because both are good and nature loving... I dont know.

Would be weird to see elves fighting with ents.

If they have similar (or even identical) ethics, they shouldn't end up at war very often.  By putting implied-plant-kill in any butcherable Treant remains, it should thin out the elves' willingness to fight (though not the Treants!).  The only real conflict I foresee is that Treants shouldn't really need to eat at all, and therefore have different ideas on how to treat slain enemies.  Treants require water, though.

There is already a fanciful Treant creature lurking in the vanilla raws, and it shares a tile with several above-ground trees.  Having them visually indistinguishable from trees would be a nice touch (at least until multi-tile trees arrive in about a month).

[Meph]

Ethics can be completely ignored for that matter.

Important are the babysnatcher and thief tags. There are 4 teams, I wanted to make one "Team Nature", which would include Ents. But Elves are in "Team Civilized/Good", together with humans, dwarves and gnomes.

[Dirst]

Ethics can be completely ignored for that matter.

Important are the babysnatcher and thief tags. There are 4 teams, I wanted to make one "Team Nature", which would include Ents. But Elves are in "Team Civilized/Good", together with humans, dwarves and gnomes.

It sounds like the other Team Nature creatures will be tricksters and possibly item thieves.  You could put those tags into the Treant entity, but the mental image of a slow-moving Ent trying to make off with a shield is just hilarious.  At least it wouldn't be unreasonable for a hulking wooden giant to palm an anvil (the way certain small monkeys and birds have been known to do).

Is it possible to overcome Team differences with similar enough ethics?  Maybe they'll never trade, but could they co-exist?

[Meph]

Team Nature:
 - Werewolves (strong, but weakness to silver, can heal/transform, no armor/weapons)
 - Naga (poisonous snake people, amphibious)
 - Elementalmen (natural armor, maybe a few interactions like rock-lobbing, no weapons)
 - Centaur (wooden weapons only, mostly ranged combat, no armor)

Thats my idea at least. Each team has four members:

Team Civilized:
 - Dwarves
 - Gnomes
 - Humans
 - Elves

Team Warmongers (I would be so grateful for a better name)
 - Goblins
 - Orcs
 - Drow
 - ... maybe trolls/ogres/cyclops/minotauri/beastmen (?)

Team Evil
 - Automatons
 - Frost Giants
 - Warlocks
 - Succubi

(Fake Team Skulking - No real civs)
 - Kobolds
 - Shades
 - Nightcreatures

(Fake Team Cavern - No real civs)
 - Ratmen
 - Blind Troglodytes (some form of blind cavern creature)
 - Antmen

Somewhere I also have to fit an insect civ aboveground. Probably Team Nature again, so I have to kick someone else out. And the Antmen from the caverns get replaced by something else, if I do an aboveground insect race. No sense in having two.

Maybe put Elementalmen to the Caverns, replacing the Antmen. Then add Werewolves to the Skulking civs (sending single units to your fort), which leaves 2 spots free in Team Nature: Ents and Insect-race. That might work. That would mean 4 civs in each team, except the caverns.

Is it possible to overcome Team differences with similar enough ethics?  Maybe they'll never trade, but could they co-exist?

No.

[pisskop]

Sure that works, but they would be bringing these items. Thats what I meant with weapon-wielding animals. ^^

I think Ents make a lot more sense.

Not if you add new creatures?  You could make animal man duplicates, right down to the same raws, or give them whatever to explain their sudden organization.

[Meph]

Yes, thats "animal men". Not "animals".

[fucduck]

.

[Meph]

Nice, thanks for the effort. But there can only be 4 teams, you made 5 (giving GOOD another entire team). The Cavern races are "fake" races, they wont trade, you cant play them, and they will appear in random cavern layers. So the Fire Giants might appear in the first cavern, and frog people spawn near the magma lake. I sadly cant control this.

Angels and Eagles would be broken, because FLYER pathfinding is broken for invaders.

[fucduck]

.

[Dirst]

Don't Lava Men spawn near lava and Olm Men near underground lakes? I've never met them myself, but the wiki states so...
Why not use 6 teams?
Civ x Cave (Primitive)
Evil x Good
Nature x Industry

The "teams" are based on groupings that will always be hostile to one another, and the causes of hostility are hard-coded (for now): babysnatcher or not; item thief or not.  So you end up with babysnatchers, item thieves, item thieving babysnatchers, and civilized people.

[IndigoFenix]

Ents, I think, would have to be on the same team as elves.  They could be a latecomer, an actual reason to avoid cutting trees since they would be a much greater threat than elves.

On the other hand, maybe scrap the Ents as a civ and just make them elvish war-beasts instead.

[pisskop]

You know, I could really go for Ents providing the wood for Elves.  Its a good concept.