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[smakemupagus]

Welcome back

[vonsch]

Been playing an Orc fort again and noticed there is no unpack option for crates of gold bars in the trade building. Everything else I have bought unpacks fine. May not be specific to Orcs though. I haven't had a chance to check any other races.

This is the last (final?) release of Masterwork for 34. Haven't tinkered with the current version of DF to date.  (MASTERWORK-DF☼ 34.11 - V.6.2 )

[-Nihil-]

What can I do to help update Orc Fort? Would it be helpful if I ported v34 orcs in to v40? Are there features that are going to be removed or polished in a certain way? What if I wrote the entities for those new domestic animals that we were discussing earlier?

Is there any document of the plans for the reborn orcs?

Edit: I know that the raiding and retaliation will need to be reworked with the new army system but that can wait.

More edits: I decided to go ahead and implement those additional creatures in v34 for myself at least. I can easily adjust them for v40 when the time comes. I might try and balance the rest of the animals a bit too. I have the arctic foxes, stag moose, caribou, and grouse implemented so far.

[smakemupagus]

My plan is actually to rewrite from the ground up, because that is the only way that i will really understand the changes in Masterwork and in DFHack (and to a lesser extent the changes in core DF, although those are fairly well documented), and take the opportunity to refine things along the way. 

A straight port from 34 would be helpful especially if folks are itching to play, but that's a pretty big task, so it's up to you. 

There's no plan document except in my head, but we can probably come up with projects one at a time.

* The new domestic animals would indeed be a really efficient way to help.  (do you have graphics for them too, or willing to tackle that?)

* I don't know that it is possible to do retaliation for raids at all any more, it's not just a matter of reworking it.  if anyone knows otherwise please advise.

Been playing an Orc fort again and noticed there is no unpack option for crates of gold bars in the trade building. Everything else I have bought unpacks fine. May not be specific to Orcs though. I haven't had a chance to check any other races.

This is the last (final?) release of Masterwork for 34. Haven't tinkered with the current version of DF to date.  (MASTERWORK-DF☼ 34.11 - V.6.2 )

Confirmed; it is Orc specific.  Replace

    [PERMITTED_REACTION:CRATE_STEEL]
    [PERMITTED_REACTION:CRATE_COPPER]
    [PERMITTED_REACTION:CRATE_BRONZE]
    [PERMITTED_REACTION:CRATE_IRON]

with

[PERMITTED_REACTION:CRATE_MITHRIL]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:CRATE_STEEL]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:CRATE_GOLD]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:CRATE_BRONZE]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:CRATE_COPPER]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:CRATE_IRON]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:CRATE_ZINC]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:CRATE_BRASS]
[PERMITTED_REACTION:CRATE_NICKEL]

in entity, requires new world. 

[-Nihil-]

I found some graphics in the critters.png that fit for them all. I am always impressed by the amount of graphics that are included but not used.

If you want I can try and clean up the rest of the animal entries and make them as consistent as possible. Then I could port those to v40.

[smakemupagus]

I found some graphics in the critters.png that fit for them all. I am always impressed by the amount of graphics that are included but not used.

If you want I can try and clean up the rest of the animal entries and make them as consistent as possible. Then I could port those to v40.

Sure, that sounds great!  Please make Mumaks especially and the big ruminantes (auroch, carabou, moose) actually take a fair bit of pasture space, not crazy so they're hard to keep alive, but so that you actually have to put aside a couple hundred tiles of grazeland if you want to keep a herd of the big guys.  Thanks! 

[-Nihil-]

I found some graphics in the critters.png that fit for them all. I am always impressed by the amount of graphics that are included but not used.

If you want I can try and clean up the rest of the animal entries and make them as consistent as possible. Then I could port those to v40.

Sure, that sounds great!  Please make Mumaks especially and the big ruminantes (auroch, carabou, moose) actually take a fair bit of pasture space, not crazy so they're hard to keep alive, but so that you actually have to put aside a couple hundred tiles of grazeland if you want to keep a herd of the big guys.  Thanks!

Definitely, I will try and balance the animals in a realistic way. As it is right now Mumaks require 1/10 the pasture as vanilla cows do. Of course, in vanilla elephants die because they can not graze fast enough... so I will tweak the values and figure out what makes sense.

Also, how do you feel about squigs?

[smakemupagus]

Definitely, I will try and balance the animals in a realistic way. As it is right now Mumaks require 1/10 the pasture as vanilla cows do. Of course, in vanilla elephants die because they can not graze fast enough... so I will tweak the values and figure out what makes sense.

Also, how do you feel about squigs?

Yep, well, that's a Masterwork universe thing.  All grazers required very little space in the old version of Masterwork, so I couldn't balance to vanilla entirely.  Anyway vanilla 0.34 was kind of ridiculous in that regard, elephants not being able to feed themselves etc.  Anyway I trust your judgement, sounds like we're pretty much on the same page.

I like squigs in general, but you can please make them do live births instead of eggs.  Keep them pretty cheap, and people who don't like squigs will have your new animals for other options for vermin control and different ranching options.

[-Nihil-]

Yep, well, that's a Masterwork universe thing.  All grazers required very little space in the old version of Masterwork, so I couldn't balance to vanilla entirely.  Anyway vanilla 0.34 was kind of ridiculous in that regard, elephants not being able to feed themselves etc.  Anyway I trust your judgement, sounds like we're pretty much on the same page.

I like squigs in general, but you can please make them do live births instead of eggs.  Keep them pretty cheap, and people who don't like squigs will have your new animals for other options for vermin control and different ranching options.

Done with the dire wolves for now, working on the squigs. They now give life birth which makes sense considering you can milk them. I kept the littersize the same as the egg clutch size.

What colour are these squigs exactly?

[smakemupagus]

Earthy shades of green.  Moss green and some nearby colors.  Optionally mix in a few reddish browns.

[-Nihil-]

Sounds good, did you want the birth ratio to remain as it is? Breeding 17%, eating 34%, wooly 17%, growler 17%, terrier 17%. Litter size is 1-6 so that means for every two litters there should be about 1 of each and 2 eating squigs.

[smakemupagus]

Yeah the current ratios have worked OK for me, and with live births it should be a bit easier to manage anyway.

[-Nihil-]

What would you think about renaming the Arctic Condors to Teratorns? I think it sounds cooler and more mythic. The concern is that people may not initially know what it is, but to be fair most of this game is a mystery if you are not constantly searching wikis and manuals stuff.

[smakemupagus]

Well, as you might guess they are in fact teratorns.  Or, I mean at least they are inspired by the creatures that in our world would be called teratorns -- most of the core orcish animals are loosely based on Pleistocene creatures (teratorn, mammoth primigenius, bos primigenius, smilodon, canus dirus). 

I could be talked into it maybe, but I decided against it since no other creatures in Dwarf Fortress world go by their classical taxinomic name.  No greek or latin language in DF after all.

[-Nihil-]

I just dont get a very orcish feeling from the name "Arctic Condor". Either way its not too important. I might rename them for myself in my own games but I will leave their name as it is for now.

I am mostly finished with the changes to the v34 animals. Grazing values have been adjusted inbetween what they were in masterwork and vanilla. Based on the wiki I got a minimum pasture size that should feed them without fail.

Mumak: 10x10 each
Auroch: 5x5 each
Stag Moose: 4x4 each
Caribour: 3x3 each

Just need to make sure the Mumaks dont trample the ground too much to be fed by that size of pasture...