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[Urist McScoopbeard]

If I may, I would like to chime in on why I think this game is having the problems that it has. The concept of the game is excellent, but personally I think this was the wrong model to use to execute said concept, mechanics aside, it takes forever to do anything. I know thats part of the game, and that its meant to played over a long period of time, but in short there's a whole lot of nothing! Now, I partake in liberal RPing, but in both Battlemaster and the brief stint in which I sampled this game i gotta say there's just too much time, really, where i sit there bored. Furthermore, I personally think it sucks a lot of the fun out of being a feudal lord, Although in both Battlemastwr and MaF there's some forms of customization, it really lacks the necessary tools to make your little realm uniquely yours. More importantly though, on the whole I think it lacks the capacity for creating such memorable moments and stories which usually drag many of us back to a sitting of DF, or Dominions, or Distant Worlds, etc. etc.

Don't get me wrong, I don't want to hold MaF to those games' very different standards, but I DO want to point out that in my eyes it lacks the ability to be as exciting, and as rewarding as those games.

Thoughts?

[MoLAoS]

If I may, I would like to chime in on why I think this game is having the problems that it has. The concept of the game is excellent, but personally I think this was the wrong model to use to execute said concept, mechanics aside, it takes forever to do anything. I know thats part of the game, and that its meant to played over a long period of time, but in short there's a whole lot of nothing! Now, I partake in liberal RPing, but in both Battlemaster and the brief stint in which I sampled this game i gotta say there's just too much time, really, where i sit there bored. Furthermore, I personally think it sucks a lot of the fun out of being a feudal lord, Although in both Battlemastwr and MaF there's some forms of customization, it really lacks the necessary tools to make your little realm uniquely yours. More importantly though, on the whole I think it lacks the capacity for creating such memorable moments and stories which usually drag many of us back to a sitting of DF, or Dominions, or Distant Worlds, etc. etc.

Don't get me wrong, I don't want to hold MaF to those games' very different standards, but I DO want to point out that in my eyes it lacks the ability to be as exciting, and as rewarding as those games.

Thoughts?

The point is that you have to create those experiences with the other players. But when you have people who don't understand RP they behave the way they are supposed to. Hence Tom complaining about the behavior of Rathgar. Because the refused to follow the rules of good RP. This may have been a problem caused by having too many game mechanics involved causing pubbies to misunderstand the goals of the game.

I think Tom wanted to have a game where a whole crap load of people played together like you would with your friends at the lego table of afterschool or around the D&D table. Players have a responsibility to create the story. But he didn't make that clear enough to players.

I'm not sure why Tom thought and open signup for a serious roleplay game was a good idea. Regular internet people are just ignorant of how shit works.

[Mookzen]

The fact that the game does near nothing to help players generate content is one of the biggest flaws, but it's just that, a flaw and it can and actually is being addressed, slowly sure but it is. Also, as to the slow nature of the game, yes certainly for avid gamers there's not enough stuff to actively engage with, but that's just the game and again the amount of stuff to do can increase. Would I say that the game in it's current state is to a large degree riding on future promises, yes certainly !

[PanH]

The point is that you have to create those experiences with the other players. But when you have people who don't understand RP they behave the way they are supposed to. Hence Tom complaining about the behavior of Rathgar. Because the refused to follow the rules of good RP. This may have been a problem caused by having too many game mechanics involved causing pubbies to misunderstand the goals of the game.

That's not really what happened. A lot of it had more to do with how Rathgar was seen than what it was doing, and even Tom said it.

[Sergarr]

Might & Fealty is an entirely player-driven, persistent world where history is being made, not just replayed.

A roleplaying game, a strategy game, a political and negotiations game.

A simulation of a medieval / low-fantasy world not in the sense of realistic physics, but in the sense of having humans with human motivations and personal ambitions as the driving forces.

There is no predetermined storyline or victory condition. In fact, there is no victory in the sense that it ends the game, the whole game is designed to last forever and remain playable for many years. That does not mean re-play, it means one continuous history of the world. History created, written and interpreted by players.

Why does those types of games always turn into shitty drama generators?

[Gervassen]

Would I say that the game in it's current state is to a large degree riding on future promises, yes certainly !

By saying "future promises" up there, you evidently mean "promises that will be announced in the future" or something. Certainly, you can't possibly mean that the promises have already been articulated and keenly anticipated. When I left, everything announced for the TODO list was geared for the enjoyment of big-time players, like slave-raiding. There's no small game for casual players or new players. That was pointed out in the alpha test by people like Rysan Marquise, and Tom shrugged it off. It remains true. If you aren't a major landholder, the game is banal shit boring for you, and that is the intended design. Like Battlemaster, actually.

Even Battlemaster has a few roaming skeletons and monsters for new players to fight. Here there is no PvE to set macguffins for small-timers to do something. Discussion about it in the alpha test was cut short. Not planned.

But when you have people who don't understand RP they behave the way they are supposed to. Hence Tom complaining about the behavior of Rathgar. Because the refused to follow the rules of good RP.

Hah. Rathgar was the only faction with well-crafted RP. Stories and Customs and Laws. You had a role in a defined cultural setting. You didn't have that anywhere else. You could argue that Rathgar was the only group of actual roleplayers.

[MoLAoS]

The point is that you have to create those experiences with the other players. But when you have people who don't understand RP they behave the way they are supposed to. Hence Tom complaining about the behavior of Rathgar. Because the refused to follow the rules of good RP. This may have been a problem caused by having too many game mechanics involved causing pubbies to misunderstand the goals of the game.

That's not really what happened. A lot of it had more to do with how Rathgar was seen than what it was doing, and even Tom said it.

Disagree. There may have been an issue with people's impression of Rathgar. But there was definitely some poor decision making, whatever the cause, among Rathgar players.

[Mookzen]

Tom went ahead and implemented some new 'dungeons' feature, and keeping it intentionally vague for now. Seems like it's a kind of temporary non-player generated encounter, apparently they don't stay open forever, and new ones can pop up in different places. He says there are at least 5 in the world at the moment and they are invisible on the map, finding them is a game of hot and cold with nobles, starts out with, for example, the noble hearing rumors of a particular cave nearby, so far I don't think anyone has found out what they are exactly. Probably one of the first steps aimed at making the gameplay of landless knights more involving.

[Gervassen]

My question there would be what happens inside the dungeon. Your characters have no equipment or possessions, no stats, no ability to stockpile wealth meaningfully. It really doesn't fit with any existing mechanic.

[Mookzen]

Ok, so some have found the position of currently existing dungeons by way of a crude triangulation in paint, based on the various messages the noble gets about rumors in the area. Seems like these encounters, which seem to be at the moment grouped into 'caves' 'wildernesses' and 'ruins' require at least 3 players to bring a noble to do, afaik no one has yet got a group going for one of these. Certainly the game as it's set up is not suited for traditional RPG gameplay at all, nor would Tom have time to do anything that fancy, curious to see what's this all about in any case. Also, personal wealth was introduced some time ago for nobles, though nothing to spend it on yet, there is talk of bribes, different personal equipment (with stats), hiring mercenaries, unique items and a number of other things.

[Gervassen]

Hmm. Following with interest. Your latest development diary raises so many questions in my mind. For instance, I wonder if one of those hidden dungeons could turn out, in fact, to be Tom's anus; and if so, could Tom himself even manage to find it with a map... aaand a protactor to compute the triangles? This begs further inquiry. Keep us abreast of future developments.

[Mookzen]

Well, the first group is doing a dungeon, the 'Redgorge River Cave'. Apparently, every noble in the party gets HP and chooses actions each turn, and maybe chooses options during dungeon events. One was bitten on the ass by a wild snake I hear, the other plans to fight some wolves. Not sure what will come of this.

Actually, there is another curious mechanic involved, apparently the game says "you can learn new actions through experience, and will receive them when you leave a dungeon.
All actions have a name, description and a number count in the top-right corner, showing how often you can use this action per dungeon before you are exhausted." which seems to imply some kind of new 'action skills' that can be learned, and the default ones listed below have a 'common' tag which seems to point to there being 'uncommon' actions/abilities, whatever that means.

Also, I found my own dungeon just now, exactly in the area predicted by the triangulation, going to get a group going and see what's this all about first hand. For now though, this is what someone else posted:

[Reelya]

If anyone wants to have (another) go with Might and Fealty now is probably the best time. Whoever was current king of Ascalon apparently spat the dummy and disbanded the entire realm and deleted all their characters. I don't know any more than that, but big chunks of the map are completely vacant. There's currently lots of space to set up new stuff or you could join nearby realms and carve out your own barony.

EDIT: now that I posted I'm not sure this is the most recently M&F thread but it's the one that came up in search.