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[Criptfeind]

That zombie doesn't exist. It's a error on the map Tiruin I believe.

[4maskwolf]

I think that's all action declarations.

[Criptfeind]

Although shadow, you might wanta stay where you are instead of moving south. It might not matter, but it might. I don't think you are really in a lot of danger if you do, but it could save flame.

[4maskwolf]

^{Also farmers are OP and people nerfed ranged units.}

Actually, this is kinda true.

Spoiler: massive unnecessary analysis (click to show/hide)

Average lv. 1 damages:
Pitchfork armed regular farmer: 9
Pitchfork armed troll thug: 12
Bow armed lurker hunter: 6
Blast armed modder acolyte: 6
Of these classes, a regular farmer OHKO's anyone who isn't a regular farmer on 75% chance, a troll thug OHKO's a modder acolyte on a 93.75% chance and kills anyone else on a 56.25% chance. A lurker hunter can kill a modded acolyte on a 56.25% chance. And a modder acolyte cannot kill anyone.

These calculations are changed somewhat by armor (a regular farmer can only one-round an armored character if they are a modded acolyte, and a troll thug is reduced to the 56.25% chance of kill an any armored character except a regular farmer, whom they can't kill, and the lurker hunter cannot one-round an armored character). However, assuming the characters are not wealthy, the only above characters who could have any armor are the two characters who have the highest average and potential damages. While the lurker hunter can gain a small evasion bonus in certain terrain, this is only effective in one type of terrain. Additionally, while the spell casting ability of the modder acolyte is nothing to sneeze at, the fact that they can be one-rounded by any unit nullifies their ability to increase in level quickly. If the game had remained a strictly team-on-team game, the only characters with any real chance of leveling up to high levels would have been the melee classes.

I'm not asking for changes, I'm basically talking to myself. If anyone sees any holes in my analysis, feel free to point them out.
Edit: herp derp I can't math.

[4maskwolf]

Spoiler: more unnecessary analysis (click to show/hide)

However, in the calculations above, there was one character not taken into account: the pitchfork-armed modder acolyte with blessing. This character can inflict 7.5 damage on average and a maximum of 10 damage. With a higher damage output than the blast character, this would seem like a good thing, but this forces an 8hp character into melee combat where anyone can one-round him/her. Even a bow with blessing (impossible with starting gold) does less average damage (and the same max) as blast, making blast the most effective weapon for modder acolytes. However, it takes at least two rounds to kill any character with blast, making them useless in any 1 v 1 confrontation.

A pitchfork armed lurker hunter has the exact same max and average damage as the bow, but hits maximum damage more often, thus eliminating the entire point behind wielding a bow and the two attacks. In fact, the terrain itself often conspires to make things more difficult. Mountains, for instance, force lurker hunters and modder acolytes into melee, nullifying their "advantage". Forests give bonuses against ranged attacks, making it more efficient to attack in melee with a pitchfork. As forests are likely to be somewhat common, this makes it more efficient to run a melee level one lurker hunter than a ranged one.

[ShadowHammer]

Your points are mostly good, but they ignore the advantage of range, which, historically, has been fairly important. Other than that, though, it is sound analysis.

[4maskwolf]

Your points are mostly good, but they ignore the advantage of range, which, historically, has been fairly important. Other than that, though, it is sound analysis.

This Isn't the battle of Agincourt, this is a game where range can be easily nullified or at least limited due to only being able to attack from one tile in between units.

Also, modify your action.

[ShadowHammer]

Action modified.

Your points are mostly good, but they ignore the advantage of range, which, historically, has been fairly important. Other than that, though, it is sound analysis.

This Isn't the battle of Agincourt, this is a game where range can be easily nullified or at least limited due to only being able to attack from one tile in between units.

The range advantage may be limited, but it can't be completely disregarded.
Especially when combined with Lurker Hunter bonuses, it allows for, under certain circumstances, the ability to attack without fear of retaliation. It also allows you to kill squishy support units that are hiding behind defensive formations. Additionally, it enables you to attack without becoming engaged, which is very tactically advantageous.

[4maskwolf]

Yeah. The only thing that makes them useful is the engagement rules, it seems.

[GlyphGryph]

Except, as you can see in actual combat, one of the biggest benefits of the lurker hunters and to a lesser extent the acolytes, is their ability to focus fire, reliably finish off damaged enemies (even if they are hiding behind another enemy or blocked by the friendly unit that injured them), and to attack from safety even when they are injured, so long as they have allies.

Front-line warriors are obviously the best units for the front line. In a straight 1v1, yes, they *should* win. That's the point of the role. But this isn't a 1v1 game. Look at the odds for 2 farmers vs. a farmer and a lurker hunter - you might be surprised at how the numbers change.

The ability for Modder Acolytes to heal allies, or to boost their damage (which allows farmers to keep their 75% kill chance against even armored enemies), is also not to be ignored. They are support units - it is not expected they would ever win in a fight against the warrior role. (Though they might at higher levels) And the longer they live, the more opportunities they have to purchase interesting spells and the more versatile they can become.

[4maskwolf]

I wasn't saying they were worthless, I was saying the game is a tad unbalanced when it comes to lurker hunters specifically. Modder acolytes are powerful, yes, but a single lurker hunter can end them even if they are behind a line of fighters.

[Criptfeind]

I think perhaps this map is particularly bad for ranged units, seeing as the two most important bits of terrain both make them worse, I'll be interested to see how things go in future games, if there are any, where people are a little more aware of how things work and the game has a little bit less fuckery.

*Cough*

So how about dat update?

*Cough*

[GlyphGryph]

Apologies for the delayed update! I spent the weekend very, very ill, and was only fully recovered yesterday.

Actions:
Nirur: Shoot the zambie, then retreat off the map.
You hit with the first arrow, miss with the second. (33, 85)
You proceed to move off the edge of the map, leaving the game.
Flame: Disengage to the south, pray to whatever god is the head of the religion here.
Shadow: shoot zombie 17 in the face. Engage all adjacent enemies.
You hit with both attacks! The zombie is badly wounded! (66, 60)
Cript: Attack Tiruin. If Tiruin dies move one NE to be next to and engaged with Tarcius.
You stab once, then twice. Both attacks strike true. Both attacks sink deep. Tiruin is killed. (23,15)
Cript gains a level! Cript has obtained Level 3!
Tiruin has been killed! Tiruin becomes a corpse!

Adwarf Gerald's team acts first.


(click to enlarge)
Basic Income: 3 Gold Per Round - Income per claimed thread: 3 Gold Per Round
Locations of Note (Explorable):
Temple to Armok: Swirly bit in the middle.
The Burnt Forest: Purple tree in middle of woods.

Goal: Survive

Spoiler: Tile Details (click to show/hide)

Fortress Tiles: +25% defense.	Water tiles: Two light shades are shallow water, +2 mp to move out of that hex. Darker shade is deep water, impassable for all current characters. -10% evasion.	Forest: +25% defense versus ranged attacks.
Swamp: +1mp to move out of.	Mountain: +25% defense versus melee. +2mp to move into. Counts as two hexes for purposes of ranged attacks, meaning they can't be fired over and the shooter must be adjacent to fire into them (but not out of them, which still works fine)	Everything else is field, or the equivalent thereof.

Forces:
Team Dwarf: Controls 1 Threads, 6 gold
Team Flame: Controls 2 Threads, 14 gold

Spoiler: Team Dwarf (click to show/hide)

	Commander Adwarf - 2 followers Scrappy, Disciplined Regular Farmer of the !!DWARVES!! 16hp - 0xp - 0 gold - 1 resist Pitchfork, Leather Attacks: Fork - Melee, 12-1, 75% Special: Recovers a point of health automatically each turn. Special: Units under your command gain a 15% boost to experience gained. DEAD		Gerald, the Wealthy, Clever, Respected Strategist of the !!DWARVES!! 19/19 hp - 7/20xp - 17 gold - 2 resist Pitchfork, Bow, Scale Attacks: Fork - Melee, 13-1, 75% Bow - Ranged, 5-1, 75% Special: Leadership. You may designate any number of adjacent units with the same allegiance to receive a 25% bonus to attack damage. Leadership bonuses that effect the same aspect of a character do not stack, but the largest bonus is used instead.
	Worldmaster, Wealthy, Clever Loreweaver of the !!DWARVES!! 10 hp - 4/20xp - 26 gold - 1 resist Spellslots: 1 Battle, 3 Cast, 1 Passive Club, Leather Blast, Regeneration, Heal Attacks: Club - Melee, 3-1, 75% Blast - Ranged, 6-1, 100% Special: Enchantments and Curses have their effectiveness increased, exact details depending on the spell. Special: You gain an additional AP that can only be spent on Cast spells. Special: Once per turn, sacrifice a move point to regain 2 health.		darkpaladin - Bulky, Healthy Stalwart Peacekeeper of the !!DWARVES!! Pitchfork, Leather 30 hp - 1/20xp - 0 gold - 1 resist Equipment Slots: 2 Melee, 1 Ranged, 1 Shield, 1 Armor Special: Guard. You may use an action point to have all damage (or damage from a set number of attacks) Attacks: Fork - Melee, 15-1, 75%

Spoiler: Team Flame (click to show/hide)

Commander Flame - 2 Follower The Scholarly, Clever Lurker Hunter d'GM 7/12hp - 0/8xp - 5 gold - 0 resistance Bow and Dagger Attacks: Dagger - 4-1, 75% Bow - `4-2, 75% Special: Your units gain an additional point of experience every time they use a spell, and you may purchase spells even if you are not an acolyte. If you are an acolyte, the cost of spells is reduced by half for you, and you may teach a spell you know to any one other acolyte at the beginning of each battle in which you command. Special: +10% evasion in forests. Special: Experience costs reduced by 20%. Only 8 experience required to next level.

	Cript, Sharp, Quick Reliable Soldier of the Cutebolds 19hp - 22/20xp - 4 gold - 1 resist Pitchfork, Leather Attacks: Fork - melee, 12-2, 85% Special: 1 more mp per turn Special: +4 melee damage, +1 melee attack		Arahael the Watcher, Sneaky, Sharp Forum Guide of The Wildlands 16 hp - 9/17xp - 0 gold - 0 resist Bow, Dagger Attacks: Dagger - Melee, 5-1, 85% Bow - Ranged, 5-2, 85% Special: +10% evasion in forests and underground. Special: Does not engage automatically. Can disengage for 2mp OR 1ap. Special: (Pathfinder) All terrain has a movement cost of 1 for you. Special: +1 melee damage, +1 ranged damage, +1 ranged attacks

Spoiler: Scattered Units (click to show/hide)

Wolfy, Husk of Armok 20/20hp - 0/20xp - 0 gold - 0 resist - 4mp - 1ap Ragged Cloth Attacks: Hollow Touch - Melee Magical 3-1, 75%. This attack is not a spell. Targets hit by this attack, even if it does no damage, have their MP, AP, and Damage reduced to half (rounded up) until the end of their next turn, as well as losing 2 points of experience. When experience is drained in this way, every point of experience drained recovers two points of health for this unit. Special: Soul Furnace - This unit may sacrifice a point of experience to heal two points of hp. This action costs 1mp. Special: Undead - This unit is immune to poison, and can move through deep water. Special: This unit takes half damage from all physical sources.

Minions:
Zambie(Lv0): HP: 14, Resistance: 0, Attacks: Melee 4-1, 50%, MP: 2, 8xp to level
1 HP: 14/14hp, 2/8xp
4 HP: 10/14hp, 1/8xp
10 HP: 14/14hp, 0/8xp
16 HP: 14/14hp 2/8xp
17 HP: 4/14hp, 2/8xp

Abnimation (lv2): 2mp, 1ap, 34hp, 16-1 melee 75%, 100% resist poison.
Unstoppable: Terrain costs for this unit are never more than 2 so long as terrain is passable. It cannot be slowed or stunned.
Regeneration: This unit recovers 4 health per turn.
Devouring: This unit devours units that it kills. Each such devoured unit adds +4hp/mhp, and +1 melee damage.
1. HP: 34/34, --xp
2. HP: 34/34, --xp

Skeltons(lv1): Resistant to fire and cold damage and debuffs (including poison), but dexterous enough to wield basic weaponry. Have bonuses to evasion, increased mobility, and additional damage dealing. Wield a basic bone sword and a bone bow.
4mp, 1ap, 16hp, 20xp, 5-2 melee 75%, 8-1 ranged 75%,
Nothing But Bones: 50% resist fire, 75% resist cold, immune to poison and drain. +15% evasion on all terrain.
Breathless: This unit can move through deep water and all water terrain at a cost of no more than 2mp per step.

Bad Memory(lv0): HP: 8, Resistance (75% vs. Physical), Attacks: Magical Melee 1-1, 100%, MP: 6, 8xp to level
Special: Every successful attack by the Bad Memory increases it's damage by 1.
Special: Bad Memories heal 1 damage at the beginning of its turn.
 
Bad Memory 2: 8/8hp, 3/8xp: Attacks: Magical Melee 4-1, 100%
Bad Memory 3: 6/8hp, 1/8xp: Attacks: Magical Melee 2-1, 100%

The hearbeat is quiet now, but the temple seems to hum with anticipation as well. Lightning flashes in the clouds gathered above it.

[4maskwolf]

As my old commander has threatened me with destruction, move one tile south and four tiles southeast, leaving the map.
Also, wait, doesn't Cript get to level up?

[Tiruin]

I think perhaps this map is particularly bad for ranged units, seeing as the two most important bits of terrain both make them worse, I'll be interested to see how things go in future games, if there are any, where people are a little more aware of how things work and the game has a little bit less fuckery.

*Cough*

So how about dat update?

*Cough*

Yes.
._.
Now I'll stay as my old level until next map. Blarghgh

Edit:

If you die, your character is gone for good you must create a new character.

Thrice damnit.

...
Create same character format [as in same token], but with Sharp as the starting quirk.. Lurker Hunter, but may I ask what each terrain does first before picking?