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Until I figure out how to un-close it, at least.

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So yeah.

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Total Members Voted: 0

Voting closed: May 01, 2014, 02:06:40 pm

[Knit tie]

And I am the guy who is trying to keep things civil...

[Sheb]

I don't know if you're trolling or simply misunderstanding me.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

BTW, guys, can you explain me why Pro-Russians put a huge Russian flag on the burnt building? What does that mean? Why they express their mourning in that way?

The only logical explanations I have  - they put that flag there because they believe that this guys died for Russia.

[Mictlantecuhtli]

I'm just wondering how the two are comparable, honestly. I guess Odessans should've just let the terrorists barricade themselves in and shoot down helicopters and toss molotovs around without inhibition, knowing how well the east looks right now.. Just saying, there's not really much of a comparison.

Berkut members weren't outright murdered because you assumed it, the demonstrators weren't out to just murder the opposition.

The Russian nationals/provacateurs in this situation were there simply for that. The original attack by the groups was on a pro-Ukranian unity/anti-putin demonstration.. and they didn't have as much luck as other places, obviously.

I find this a bit baffling since it's relatively obvious who was the aggressor in Odessa. You can't attack a non-KGB-suppressed city and expect free reign, no matter what Putin and the coterie claim.

[Sheb]

Well, nowhere did it show that the pro-Russians were Russians nationals, and nowhere did it shows they were out to kill the pro-Ukrainians. As far as I can tell, the pro-Ukrainian demonstration, while peaceful, had a core of hardened fighter to protect it. Those fighter ended up rioting with the pro-Russians. At the end a lot of people die. Those are the only fact we're sure off.

[Sinistar]

Sheb (on topic of Ukraine's government legitimacy): Ah, I see, must have forgotten or just missed that. That leaves me with question how democratic the 2010 constitution was but that doesn't matter right now.

Also, the stream only has audio right now, at least for me. Everything sounds quite calm though, either the procession stopped or they are covering happening in some other part of the city - sounds like various speakers are giving speeches to the crowd. "Odessa is Ukraina" is what I understood.

Fake edit: stream is down again.

[Sergarr]

fyi Mict the KGB does not exist for 20+ years. You have a grudge against USSR, aren't you?

[Knit tie]

Listen, why can't we just agree that that incident was a fight between two opposing sides where, in what amounted to warfare, some people died, and then move on to other productive topics? Until more facts surface about who was doing what there, let's just let it go for a bit. Ukrainians fought, Russians fought, molotovs were thrown, Ukrainians won. It is perfectly possible that both sides are innocent, or that they re both guilty. Speculating on that issue will bring nothing productive right now.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

fyi Mict the KGB does not exist for 20+ years. You have a grudge against USSR, aren't you?

If I'll change my name I'll not cease to exist...

[Sergarr]

Listen, why can't we just agree that that incident was a fight between two opposing sides where, in what amounted to warfare, some people died, and then move on to other productive topics? Until more facts surface about who was doing what there, let's just let it go for a bit. Ukrainians fought, Russians fought, molotovs were thrown, Ukrainians won. It is perfectly possible that both sides are innocent, or that they re both guilty. Speculating on that issue will bring nothing productive right now.

Well I'm sure we'll have a lot of different topics to discuss after the 9th of May.

[scrdest]

He's fascist because he thinks that there are people who deserve to be burned alive and lynched by the raging crowd.

...that's not what 'fascist' means, you know?

If you are using a word so that it's perfectly fungible with 'doubleplusungood' or 'very very naughty', you're just cheapening the meaning of the word.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Spoiler: I'll just leave it here (click to show/hide)

[Knit tie]

In a funny twist of fate, there is some evidence that Putin may be gay himself.

Thay boy he kissed in the belly was a sensation for a while, IIRC.

[Sergarr]

That's not gay, it's pedophilia, IIRC?

[Knit tie]

Probably.

Which, unlike homosexuality, actually deserves reprimanding.