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Current one, unchanged.

+4 AS and +5 DMG when moving 4 spaces or more.

+2 AS and +3 DMG on Player Phase, with additional +2 AS and +2 DMG when moving 4 spaces or more.

+1 AS and +1.5 DMG for each space moved up to 4 spaces.

Current one but AS bonus is converted to DR from the end of the Player Phase until the next one.

I don't know but I want to see the results.

[Blade Master Model 42]

Oh. Well the pigeonholing complaint was directly related to Tiruin's proposal, rather than yours.

[Tiruin]

._.; Being talked about in that kinda wording makes me feel...strange.

On that point, I should've specified by saying 'bow' that I did not mean crossbow, because I'm not thinking along the context of FEF terms but realistic terms. >~< (Since FEF categorizes that under 'bow' and...yeah.)

[Blade Master Model 42]

._.; Being talked about in that kinda wording makes me feel...strange.

On that point, I should've specified by saying 'bow' that I did not mean crossbow, because I'm not thinking along the context of FEF terms but realistic terms. >~< (Since FEF categorizes that under 'bow' and...yeah.)

But Tiruin, aside from the nomad class weapon, only crossbows can fire at range 1.

[GiglameshDespair]

To be honest, I'm not a fan of pigeonholing class abilities, as it kind of nudges the player to only use one subcat. The saint would probably still be good enough with their transfer strength ability, in my opinion.

Something to keep in mind, though, solymr - if you give more range to recurve bows or more accuracy to longbows, what difference is left between the subcats? If you just make recurves "longbows but better" or vice versa there's even less reason to ever use the alternative.

A longbow is still going to outrange most things. That's kind of the point. There's nothing stopping you adding enemy snipers, either, if you really want to be able to counter. But there's also other methods. Enemies with pass. Flanking the group. Aforementioned siege magic.

[Solymr]

In that case, what about giving +1 range to longbows and giving recurve some crit bonus or something to make the role of each weapon clearer, longbows: outrange u, recurve: kill u.

[Tiruin]

._.; Being talked about in that kinda wording makes me feel...strange.

On that point, I should've specified by saying 'bow' that I did not mean crossbow, because I'm not thinking along the context of FEF terms but realistic terms. >~< (Since FEF categorizes that under 'bow' and...yeah.)

But Tiruin, aside from the nomad class weapon, only crossbows can fire at range 1.

Aren't Recurve bows designed to have RNG of 1-2, and are a category (just like crossbows) in itself? o_O
...I didn't think about the RNG 2/2-3 bows though But I'm feeling like it should be aligned with the mechanics of the archer class tree itself, or at least highlight something on your goal there.

In my ongoing quest to find us an archer skill that everyone can agree is useful, thematic, and appropriate for the class level

If you mean 'upon reaching Archer' (and not Trainee/its 3rd class), other than being the only unit able to use ballistae and have an effective vs flyers, I'm thinking something along...
+ to damage if an archer's STR is higher than opponents DEF? o_O Going to hurt mages and other low DEF classes but I'm unsure now x_x It feels balanced as it is (in my inexperienced opinion).

[GiglameshDespair]

._.; Being talked about in that kinda wording makes me feel...strange.

On that point, I should've specified by saying 'bow' that I did not mean crossbow, because I'm not thinking along the context of FEF terms but realistic terms. >~< (Since FEF categorizes that under 'bow' and...yeah.)

But Tiruin, aside from the nomad class weapon, only crossbows can fire at range 1.

Aren't Recurve bows designed to have RNG of 1-2, and are a category (just like crossbows) in itself? o_O
...I didn't think about the RNG 2/2-3 bows though But I'm feeling like it should be aligned with the mechanics of the archer class tree itself, or at least highlight something on your goal there.

Crossbows are 1-2
Recurves are 2
Longbows are 2-3

[Blade Master Model 42]

._.; Being talked about in that kinda wording makes me feel...strange.

On that point, I should've specified by saying 'bow' that I did not mean crossbow, because I'm not thinking along the context of FEF terms but realistic terms. >~< (Since FEF categorizes that under 'bow' and...yeah.)

But Tiruin, aside from the nomad class weapon, only crossbows can fire at range 1.

Aren't Recurve bows designed to have RNG of 1-2, and are a category (just like crossbows) in itself? o_O
...I didn't think about the RNG 2/2-3 bows though But I'm feeling like it should be aligned with the mechanics of the archer class tree itself, or at least highlight something on your goal there.

In my ongoing quest to find us an archer skill that everyone can agree is useful, thematic, and appropriate for the class level

If you mean 'upon reaching Archer' (and not Trainee/its 3rd class), other than being the only unit able to use ballistae and have an effective vs flyers, I'm thinking something along...
+ to damage if an archer's STR is higher than opponents DEF? o_O Going to hurt mages and other low DEF classes but I'm unsure now x_x It feels balanced as it is (in my inexperienced opinion).

Archers are not even close to being the only unit to be effective vs fliers. Nomads, Bow Spies and anyone with a wind tome can boast the same.

The problem with touting Ballistae exclusivity for the Archer is that we almost never see ballistae available for use by PCs.

I'm going to try some things to rectify that in VRFEF, but we'll see how that works.

[Tiruin]

._.; Being talked about in that kinda wording makes me feel...strange.

On that point, I should've specified by saying 'bow' that I did not mean crossbow, because I'm not thinking along the context of FEF terms but realistic terms. >~< (Since FEF categorizes that under 'bow' and...yeah.)

But Tiruin, aside from the nomad class weapon, only crossbows can fire at range 1.

Aren't Recurve bows designed to have RNG of 1-2, and are a category (just like crossbows) in itself? o_O
...I didn't think about the RNG 2/2-3 bows though But I'm feeling like it should be aligned with the mechanics of the archer class tree itself, or at least highlight something on your goal there.

Crossbows are 1-2
Recurves are 2
Longbows are 2-3

Oh.

...Can we have a poll on the general idea towards archers like the polls before? :v I'm going for emphasis for Archers using bows (as in they get a unique skill that affects bow categories they use, so that while any other class can use those categories--archers can do it...better?)

[freeformschooler]

Something to keep in mind, though, solymr - if you give more range to recurve bows or more accuracy to longbows, what difference is left between the subcats? If you just make recurves "longbows but better" or vice versa there's even less reason to ever use the alternative.

Echoing this. Class abilities are more fun if they enhance strengths (Charlotte) rather than mitigate weaknesses (Efa).

[Haspen]

My idea on this:

(16:18:13) Hatkitty: it was 'enemies of the Archer gain maximum of 5 Evasion bonus from all terrain.'

And obligatory mention of my FEF things:

(16:20:36) Hatkitty: Solymr: my snipers had +1 max.range in FEF1; guaranteed 85% hit in FEF2 to 5.

[GiglameshDespair]

Archers do have ballistician, though that's a very situational thing. It'd be improved if there were just more ballistae around, I guess?

They could have something like:
Lucky arrow: Once per map, can choose to autohit

Archers are already pretty good, with potentially being able to attack 1, 2, or 3 range and effective damage vs fliers. They don't necessarily need a massively potent class skill.

[Solymr]

In that case, what about giving +1 range to longbows and giving recurve some crit bonus or something to make the role of each weapon clearer, longbows: outrange u, recurve: kill u.

Alternatively, IIRC Sure Shot in FE8 was a separate roll, like great shield, that ensured a hit and only depended on the sniper.

Also any bow user is able to do what archers do but with something else. Nomads have improved canto, spies have different stuff depending on the GM :V

[SeriousConcentrate]

Wrong thread.

[Haspen]

kj1225:

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Characters.FireEmblemOnForums

You will reverse the vandalisms you have done to the Characters page of FEFtropes, or we will be talking wholly lot differently.

Thank you.