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Poll

Duke Knight's Momentum is up for revision? Which version of the skill would you prefer?

Current one, unchanged.
+4 AS and +5 DMG when moving 4 spaces or more.
+2 AS and +3 DMG on Player Phase, with additional +2 AS and +2 DMG when moving 4 spaces or more.
+1 AS and +1.5 DMG for each space moved up to 4 spaces.
Current one but AS bonus is converted to DR from the end of the Player Phase until the next one.
I don't know but I want to see the results.

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Author Topic: The Fire Emblem on Forums Hub! 10 Years of FEF!  (Read 305281 times)

freeformschooler

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Re: The Fire Emblem on Forums Hub: ART CONTEST HERE!
« Reply #1965 on: August 30, 2014, 01:16:37 pm »

Also people dont like sidearms for Archers v:
* Tiruin shoots Solymr with her bowgun.
We can now attack in melee! :D

Well, you can counterattack in melee.

...Which kind of subverts the point of having bows be ranged only, I think. But then again, the Archer doesn't have much else going on for them in terms of class skills.

Archers could already counterattack in melee. They just had to use a crossbow.

Of course, they can't counter with their sidearm if they just used a Recurve or Longbow the turn before being struck.
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Sirus

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Re: The Fire Emblem on Forums Hub: ART CONTEST HERE!
« Reply #1966 on: August 30, 2014, 01:20:27 pm »

Also people dont like sidearms for Archers v:
* Tiruin shoots Solymr with her bowgun.
We can now attack in melee! :D

Well, you can counterattack in melee.

...Which kind of subverts the point of having bows be ranged only, I think. But then again, the Archer doesn't have much else going on for them in terms of class skills.

Archers could already counterattack in melee. They just had to use a crossbow.

Of course, they can't counter with their sidearm if they just used a Recurve or Longbow the turn before being struck.
Actually, they can if my reading is correct.

Quote
If they are attacked in melee while equipped with a Bow (except for a Crossbow), they can choose to counter attack with the Sidearm.
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Star Wars: Age of Rebellion OOC Thread

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Solymr

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Re: The Fire Emblem on Forums Hub: ART CONTEST HERE!
« Reply #1967 on: August 30, 2014, 01:39:01 pm »

Anyone here play Space Empires/Master Of Orion?

Cause there has been talk about a game based on those and maybe people are interested :v
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freeformschooler

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Re: The Fire Emblem on Forums Hub: ART CONTEST HERE!
« Reply #1968 on: August 30, 2014, 01:54:59 pm »

Actually, they can if my reading is correct.

Quote
If they are attacked in melee while equipped with a Bow (except for a Crossbow), they can choose to counter attack with the Sidearm.

Now that's just silly.
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Sirus

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Re: The Fire Emblem on Forums Hub: ART CONTEST HERE!
« Reply #1969 on: August 30, 2014, 02:00:54 pm »

Actually, they can if my reading is correct.

Quote
If they are attacked in melee while equipped with a Bow (except for a Crossbow), they can choose to counter attack with the Sidearm.

Now that's just silly.
Which is why it seems that many people do not approve of that rule :v

Anyone here play Space Empires/Master Of Orion?

Cause there has been talk about a game based on those and maybe people are interested :v
Space Empires IV casual player here o7
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And lo! Sirus did drive his mighty party truck unto Vegas, and it was good.

Star Wars: Age of Rebellion OOC Thread

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Solymr

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Re: The Fire Emblem on Forums Hub: ART CONTEST HERE!
« Reply #1970 on: September 01, 2014, 01:59:28 pm »

New poll by Haspen's request. He should post the full tileset here :V

Also a question for anyone who cares: how would you make a Space Empires/Masters of Orion/space 4x and FEF hybrid game?
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Haspen

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Re: The Fire Emblem on Forums Hub: ART CONTEST HERE!
« Reply #1971 on: September 01, 2014, 02:07:54 pm »

sendspace link to tileset if someone haven't yet seen maps made with it (I find that hard to believe :v)

It's also the newest update of my tileset so GM's using it should grab eet v:
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Solymr

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Re: The Fire Emblem on Forums Hub: ART CONTEST HERE!
« Reply #1972 on: September 01, 2014, 03:10:55 pm »

I see a "other" vote but no post in the thread  ???
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Haspen

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Re: The Fire Emblem on Forums Hub: ART CONTEST HERE!
« Reply #1973 on: September 01, 2014, 03:11:32 pm »

Maybe he/she/it is still writting, give'em time :P
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Truly, we have the most uniquely talented spy network in all existence.
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Please tell me the Royal Physician didn't go to the same college as the Spymaster.

CecilHoshino

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Re: The Fire Emblem on Forums Hub: ART CONTEST HERE!
« Reply #1974 on: September 01, 2014, 08:19:15 pm »

Given the massive pushback against it, allow me to justify/contextualize/defend the Sidearm skill for the Archers.

In the Fire Emblem games, Archers tend to be the most maligned of classes, moreso than Knights and Priests, because their strengths were overwhelmingly outweighed by their faults: they were locked to 2 Range, whereas most enemies were locked at 1. This already poses a problem, because the Archer would only get off one, maybe two shots before it was the enemy's turn, and they would focus melee onto the Archer who can't counter attack, while sending their own ranged guys against your melee troops, also to avoid counter attack. As well, Magic, by virtue of its 1-2 range and the fact that most enemies have mediocre at best resistance, often proved the be the much superior weapon since it allowed them to attack on the enemy's turn. And by virtue of how Archers and Mages tend to be statted in the games, they're both about as squishy in melee, no harm, no foul. And, after FE6, Hit Rates were so naturally high anyway except against, like, Swordmasters, that hyper specialization in Skill was fairly useless, except for games where Snipers got a natural crit rate boost. Not to mention Lances and Axes tended to have a ranged option that served just as well (except in FE11 and 12, where the Javelin and Hand Axe were nerfed to shit) and could still work in melee, and some of the best Bow users tended not to be Archers at all, but those who used Bows as a subweapon. Or Rangers/Nomads, who had bows AND swords AND horses. The one strength Archers had was their weapon was effective against Flyers, but that comes up shockingly rarely, and you still have the range issue.

But Archers are so important to the atmosphere and feel of the setting, they need to be included. So I had to make them more appealing/forgiving to counteract with. For starters was the Defense preferred stat, allowing them to better survive in case the player makes a mistake and gets caught in melee. As far as specialties go, though, the Ballistician specialty was just as situational and restrictive as any of the Terrain based effects. Perhaps even moreso. And there was still the "absolutely helpless during the enemy's turn" issue. So I turned to another strategy game, the Heroes of Might and Magic series.

This is a sprite sheet for one of the archery units in the second game. Because position is so key in that game, protecting archers was often an integral part of any army composition. Still, in case an enemy did cross the entire field to attack the archers, the archers in question could counter-attack in melee, albeit with reduced damage. And that was what I went for with the Sidearm special; give Archers a chance to fight back and contribute during the enemy phase where they really suffer, while still maintaining their identity as ranged fighters. It's also why the Crossbow made a comeback, but is not required to be specialized in.

As for the Effective Damage and the numbers associated, well, that's a lot of numbers to crunch in a vacuum, so, I apologize if I overestimate the effectiveness of some weapons and subcategories, and underestimate others.
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Parsely

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Re: The Fire Emblem on Forums Hub: ART CONTEST HERE!
« Reply #1975 on: September 01, 2014, 09:01:33 pm »

I think it's a good idea.
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Tiruin

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Re: The Fire Emblem on Forums Hub: ART CONTEST HERE!
« Reply #1976 on: September 01, 2014, 09:07:52 pm »

I kind of felt the same way about mages whilst playing the FE series--archers were nigh underpowered compared to them unless they could make off with speedier shots or more hits (DEF/RES comparison aside). Ballistae were rare to the player, but common to the enemy. That aside...

Could the 'sidearm' feature be put in use for ALL bows? With the Archer class having reduced penalties to using it compared to the generality? Pushing an idea out front here. :P
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Swordstar

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Re: The Fire Emblem on Forums Hub: ART CONTEST HERE!
« Reply #1977 on: September 01, 2014, 09:15:48 pm »

Could the 'sidearm' feature be put in use for ALL bows? With the Archer class having reduced penalties to using it compared to the generality? Pushing an idea out front here. :P

Eh, most bow users have a weapon besides bows. Only ones that don't are nomads, who have horses and the ability to get the heck out of there, plus can eventually get swords.
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Xanmyral

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Re: The Fire Emblem on Forums Hub: ART CONTEST HERE!
« Reply #1978 on: September 01, 2014, 09:30:26 pm »

-snip-

I personally find no issue with the sidearm usage, its a rather under-appreciated weapon subcategory, and the defacto odd duckling of the melee trinity due to being the forth in swords. I can't comment on how maligned the class is however, due to lack of experience beyond the handbook, but I can believe it.

Blade Master Model 42

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Re: The Fire Emblem on Forums Hub: ART CONTEST HERE!
« Reply #1979 on: September 01, 2014, 11:27:00 pm »

...I've always liked Archer classes, and usually don't have a problem with melee getting up in their business, since a), I tend to set up my formation such that my melee fighters would need to be killed for it to work, and b), the best archers tend to have good speed for dodging anyhow.

It does bother me that magic classes tend toward being so much better than physical units, but I don't think we've had too much trouble with that in FEF, Call Magic aside.
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