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Current one, unchanged.

+4 AS and +5 DMG when moving 4 spaces or more.

+2 AS and +3 DMG on Player Phase, with additional +2 AS and +2 DMG when moving 4 spaces or more.

+1 AS and +1.5 DMG for each space moved up to 4 spaces.

Current one but AS bonus is converted to DR from the end of the Player Phase until the next one.

I don't know but I want to see the results.

[Solymr]

Crusader's was extending challenge to more enemies per battle/a whole class.
Shadow sword's was that he gets effective damage vs a challenged enemy.

[Furtuka]

If we go with challenge, I still think it would be good to consider giving it a recharge time instead of a once per battle thing. A single enemy per battle is kinda...

[Xanmyral]

Enemy type (not just militia man a, all militia men), no effective damage, rather we copy paste the bonuses of sneak attack. Still once per battle?

[Gamerboy4life]

Enemy type (not just militia man a, all militia men), no effective damage, rather we copy paste the bonuses of sneak attack. Still once per battle?

Sounds more reasonable.


But I still like the Fencer's teleportation ability between pillars - if you extended it towards tree tiles as well, it would probably be a viable skill.

[Rolepgeek]

If we're going around changing the terrain related classes purely for the sake of them not being terrain related anymore, will we be changing Pirate and Bandit and their promotions as well? All of the axe users, you may have noticed, are terrain related. And just because a class's skills won't always be useful doesn't mean it's not balanced; take a look at Spies or Thieves. There won't always be maps with things that need lockpicked, and there will only rarely be maps with fog of war. Should we change them too?

Changing things to be balanced is well and good and all, but if something's not broken, don't fix it. Most of the class skills aren't things you expect to be using all the time, like Hold the Line, or Leaf on the Wind, or Cloudwalking, etc. I understand wanting to make the class more useful in a greater variety of situations, but...

[Xanmyral]

I still prefer not changing the class too much, I like the teleportation, but it seems more people want the challenge variant. The idea of teleporting past walls to pillar tiles there was one of the main reasons I wanted to be a fencer.

[Solymr]

If we're going around changing the terrain related classes purely for the sake of them not being terrain related anymore, will we be changing Pirate and Bandit and their promotions as well? All of the axe users, you may have noticed, are terrain related. And just because a class's skills won't always be useful doesn't mean it's not balanced; take a look at Spies or Thieves. There won't always be maps with things that need lockpicked, and there will only rarely be maps with fog of war. Should we change them too?

Changing things to be balanced is well and good and all, but if something's not broken, don't fix it. Most of the class skills aren't things you expect to be using all the time, like Hold the Line, or Leaf on the Wind, or Cloudwalking, etc. I understand wanting to make the class more useful in a greater variety of situations, but...

Thing about pirates/bandits is that their terrains aren't walkable by any other class, so that gives them new pathways to be used without being flying. Fighters might get the ability to teleport between forests/pillars tho :V

Even though not every map has pickable stuff, when the time comes you'll sure as hell want to do it. And no GM that I know of uses fog of war so spies would need a change too. So far people only use them because assassin. And nobody cares about master spy.

[scapheap]

And no GM that I know of uses fog of war so spies would need a change too.

*Scapheap briefly stops, before turning back to map 4*

Still, spies need something as well as vision.

[Blade Master Model 42]

Fencers shouldn't be allowed to phase through walls anyway, that's junk.

Also, I suggested giving bandits and pirates a more utilitarian ability by allowing them to double all obstacles, not just supply trains.
.
And spies do need something better. How about bonus damage if they started  their turn on any defensive terrain?

[Gamerboy4life]

Fencers shouldn't be allowed to phase through walls anyway, that's junk.

Also, I suggested giving bandits and pirates a more utilitarian ability by allowing them to double all obstacles, not just supply trains.
.
And spies do need something better. How about bonus damage if they started  their turn on any defensive terrain?

Can't spies, er, disguise themselves as an enemy soldier?

[Solymr]

That's master spies and nobody uses it.

[SeriousConcentrate]

Nobody uses it because it's only there for the GM to troll you.

[Powder Miner]

i'd use it if i played a master spy

[Gamerboy4life]

Master spies just need a full on invisibility skill. Only works if the character is moving, if they attack/do an action, then the invisibility is dispelled.

[Solymr]

Invisibility does seem nice. TF2 spy anyone? :V