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Author Topic: (KSP LP) Bay12 Space Program: Conical Difficulties  (Read 72170 times)

GreatWyrmGold

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Re: (KSP LP) Bay12 Space Program: Over A Megameter
« Reply #180 on: March 01, 2014, 10:53:44 pm »

I am no longer tired enough to think that 1101-1018=-17, Bay12 works, and I have free time, so let's get this party started.

927 kilometers apart. 828 kilometers exact. Six hours, a day, passes. 722 klicks. 609. 491. 369. 244. I burn a bit at periapsis to reduce the apoapsis, hopefully letting us get a closer final encounter distance with Jeb. 145 klicks. Nine hours, two days and a night back at KSSC. 46 kilometers, probably as close as we'll get. Next one's a bit over 55, so I'm correct. Manley suggests burning some to decrease the distance, but I'm a bit fuzzy on how all that would work so...let's just rendezvous.

Our relative velocity is about 151 m/s and dropping fast. I reduce our relative velocities to about 23 m/s, turn towards Jeb (a bit over 43 kilometers away), and burn to a velocity of exactly 47 meters per second. I spin around, watching Jeb and hoping things are working out. I have a very eccentric orbit, apoapsis around 126 kilometers and periapsis (thankfully most of the orbit away) at 34 kilometers. Once we rendezvous, even if we run out of fuel (not impossible), we should end up falling back to Kerbin.

I watch the distant dot slowly approach.


Pretty picture, ain't it?

35...34.9...35, time to get better acceleration. I get the distance going back down and wait. At 34.5, it hits another trough. I get another nice, long burn at Jeb, then wait. Another trough at 33.9. Hell. I get another burn.

The sun's rising, Jeb's getting closer, and things are looking up.


I could get Jeb tonight. I really could.

And I can think of several people who are glad about this.

...Taking a while though, isn't it?

Aw, crap.


And I fall into atmosphere. Thankfully, with a periapsis under 54 kilometers, it's unlikely that we'll come out of the atmosphere before we decay into a landing. Jeb tries jetting towards us, but that never works.

We fire the rockets retrograde to accelerate our landing (important for reasons that should eventually become clear, since you can only control one "craft" at once). This actually brings us closer to Jeb; our closest approach is right at 10 kilometers.

The parachutes deploy, throwing the craft off-balance.


Archibald, having run through the Space Tea supply hours ago, realizing that the landing legs are not going to cushion his landing in the slightest.

Why he is concerned. Note the lack of nice, soft water.

...Better.

Um.


We get some data from the highlands.


Whoo.

Some strange news comes back...



No. No. NO! Not again! It's so close. Just twenty-four fucking kilometers. So close.


Maybe I should read up on those transfer orbits...

I'm not just sitting by, watching my salvation fall away again. I can't.

We're still drifting together, but some nice EVA propellant will just help matters. But then I lose control
(the camera view's going wonky and won't let me point Jeb where he needs to go) and have to change tactics...but it works.


Dammit KSP, why do you make EVA so tough?

We drift closer and closer. We dip just below 21 klicks of separation...then we start drifting apart. I can't point myself at the spacecraft anymore...


He never even saw his "savior" ship.

I guess it's time to just wait and...


Oh.

...or not.
Well then. Death or safety is coming in an eighth of an hour.
Hopefully safety.

The rescue rocket fires its rockets, separates the lander, gets within ten klicks of me. I want to try jetting over but...can't. Well, maybe I'll be able to use the EVAP to slow my fall? Probably not, but still...I'm not going to use my jetpack until then, no matter how much I spin.

I drift downwards to about 39 kilometers before rising again, momentum defeating air resistance for now. The sun sets as I spin around Kerbin, covering vast distances. Will this be my final night? Will I ever again see the light of day?
Well, at this rate I'm probably going to orbit another time first, but hey who knows?
I need to watch the night sky. It may be the last I see of such beauty...


Well, not from this picture in specific I guess.

I reach space again.


Technically.

A few more minutes spent in the heavens before crashing back to Kerbin.


A sunrise...my last?

I can see the Space Science Center and its flags...will I ever see it again?

And so I fall.


I fall back into the atmosphere, watching the world whirl past. I'm over the ocean now; I hope that's where I land. Better chance of me surviving, and if I die at least there'll be legends about me for decades. If I must die, I'd rather be the kerbonaut that mysteriously disappeared than the one who splatted into someone's hut or something.


"Where is the Lost Kerbonaut? Learn the truth! Tonight at four."

Munrise. Perhaps the last rise I'll see. All ahead is falling.


Poetic.

Thirty thousand kilometers, and two unpleasant facts are becoming increasingly obvious.


One: I'm over land, and won't land on water. Two: I'm heating up, and might not land at all.

What do the people below me see?


Well, it's probably awesome, whatever it is.

And getting awesomer, it seems.


I slow, remarkably still alive. I look around, see where I'll land.


...Looks...friendly...

When do I start firing the propellant? Each hundredth of a unit takes, what, a second or two to go through? I had...338*1.5...about five hundred seconds of fuel. I got a hundred or two hundred meters a second, so probably five kilometers. Which I've passed. Shit, I hope it isn't too late.
Recounting...probably two hundredths per second. Which means a hundred sixty seconds with three and a quarter units, or a bit over two kilometers. Oops. Well, not far to fall to correct my "mistake".

Well, the ground's coming up pretty--

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SOLDIER First

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Re: (KSP LP) Bay12 Space Program: Over At Last
« Reply #181 on: March 01, 2014, 11:00:22 pm »

*SLAMS FIST THROUGH WALL*
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Aseaheru

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Re: (KSP LP) Bay12 Space Program: Over At Last
« Reply #182 on: March 01, 2014, 11:01:37 pm »

Give it a month. He will return.

Anyways, lets head for minimus.
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Aklyon

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Re: (KSP LP) Bay12 Space Program: Over At Last
« Reply #183 on: March 01, 2014, 11:03:58 pm »

Well, he'll rise out of his junkyard eventually.
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GreatWyrmGold

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Re: (KSP LP) Bay12 Space Program: Over At Last
« Reply #184 on: March 01, 2014, 11:06:38 pm »

Anyways, lets head for minimus.
Why Minmus and not Mun? Seems like that would be tougher. Just curious.
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WillowLuman

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Re: (KSP LP) Bay12 Space Program: Over At Last
« Reply #185 on: March 01, 2014, 11:38:45 pm »

Fun fact: no matter the fall height, sometimes hitting the ground head-first causes the hapless Kerbonaut to bounce instead of die.

Also, did you see his face during this fall? I bet he was beaming.
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Re: (KSP LP) Bay12 Space Program: Over At Last
« Reply #186 on: March 02, 2014, 12:58:55 am »

Anyways, lets head for minimus.
Why Minmus and not Mun? Seems like that would be tougher. Just curious.

Minmus requires less fuel all around. It's trivial the burn you need to push a Mun intercept into a Minmus intercept. There's about as much science on Minmus. Landing requires very little fuel. If you can get docking ports and the science lab you could mess with rendezvous in a safer fashion. There's no atmosphere to catch you.

Let's aim for a Minmus mission or two. Perhaps two single seaters maybe half a day apart. They'll meet up in orbit around Minmus for a chat about where they want to land. They can each pick their favorite flat spot.

Craft 1: Liftoff and orbit Kerbin. Make a maneuver mode and set you sights on Minmus. Make another maneuver node about halfway along that trajectory to tweak it so you intercept Minmus.
Craft 2: Liftoff and orbit Kerbin. See where craft 1 is and if possible make and execute a maneuver to intercept Minmus before craft 1 gets into Minmus SOI. Adjust the intercept halfway there if needed.
Craft 1: Put into stable orbit around Minmus.
Craft 2: Follow in Craft 1's footsteps. Put into stable orbit.
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GreatWyrmGold

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Re: (KSP LP) Bay12 Space Program: Over At Last
« Reply #187 on: March 02, 2014, 09:15:41 am »

Fun fact: no matter the fall height, sometimes hitting the ground head-first causes the hapless Kerbonaut to bounce instead of die.
Oh, now you tell me this.

Quote
Also, did you see his face during this fall? I bet he was beaming.
He always does that.

Let's aim for a Minmus mission or two. Perhaps two single seaters maybe half a day apart. They'll meet up in orbit around Minmus for a chat about where they want to land. They can each pick their favorite flat spot.
Craft 1: Liftoff and orbit Kerbin. Make a maneuver mode and set you sights on Minmus. Make another maneuver node about halfway along that trajectory to tweak it so you intercept Minmus.
Craft 2: Liftoff and orbit Kerbin. See where craft 1 is and if possible make and execute a maneuver to intercept Minmus before craft 1 gets into Minmus SOI. Adjust the intercept halfway there if needed.
Craft 1: Put into stable orbit around Minmus.
Craft 2: Follow in Craft 1's footsteps. Put into stable orbit.
Plan noted. Now to figure out how to design a Minmusshot.
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BFEL

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Re: (KSP LP) Bay12 Space Program: Over At Last
« Reply #188 on: March 02, 2014, 11:19:05 am »

I recommend researching Aerodynamics as soon as possible.
Using jet engines as a first stage is practically cheating its so efficient.
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GreatWyrmGold

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Re: (KSP LP) Bay12 Space Program: Over At Last
« Reply #189 on: March 02, 2014, 12:39:34 pm »

Our of our six kerbonauts, one is dead, two are ghosts, one is still recovering from various fractures, one is dealing with rocket fuel toxicity, and one is currently going through tea withdrawal. This gives our Councilors time to think about what they want to do.

The answer: Go to Minmus with sciencecraft.

First, we design the pod which will be landing on Kerbin.


...if everything goes according to plan.

Second, we add a rocket for getting from Minmus to Kerbin.


Third, we get a new prototype after someone launched this one into the sky.

After some discussion of the feasibility of landing legs, a compromise is reached on the next stage, intended to get the craft from Kerbin orbit to the Minmus surface, and also gather some science.


This angle brought to you by: My inability to zoom.
P.S. I added some struts to make it less breaky after this photo was taken.


And finally, some solid rocket boosters were added, hopefully getting the massive craft into orbit.


Totally structurally sound.

Big rocket, though.


Bob was sent up, having recovered pretty well. Bill is expected to recover soon, so the second Minmushot will include him.
So, our rocket launches.


Indeed, we are ready. Probably.

Our target:

That's pretty far away.

And inclined.

Well? Let's get started.

"Wait, there's a return plan, right guys? ...Guys?"


I try turning a bit but discover that the first stage has pretty much zero maneuverability. We lean a few degrees southwest, helpless to do anything about it.


"Um, what do you mean, 'helpless'?"

The next stage, beginning its flight close to six kilometers above Kerbin, is much more maneuverable, and we begin the turn to--


"WAIT! Did you not say this stage was supposed to get from orbit to Minmus?"

Well, yes, but we've got plenty of fuel.


"That is what you said about the SciMax 5."

Shut up. You'll be fine.


"Fine like Jeb?"

...

If I'm reading the navball right, Minmus is right about rising.


"..."

I've been told that's the ideal time to launch for them.


We start dragging that apoapsis up...


We have a long way to go.

Huh.


We run out of fuel in our minmus lander stage at 30 kilometers, with an apoapsis a bit over 64 kilometers. I'm sure the return-to-kerbin stage would be able to get to orbit, but that's not our goal today.
So, we chuck the lander bits...


...seem to collide with the last stage because I briefly forget that's not how the lander was built...

...and plot an atypical maneuver node to see if we can't at least get some nice polar science from this.


Just in time.

Or not.


About 15 seconds after the maneuver node I set, I managed to lock onto it, which made the ETB recalculate to a bit over a minute.


We might not hit the poles...

...but it's been a pretty trip along the way.


We eventually run out of fuel...


Here we are. The lander. Preparing to land on Kerbin not five minutes into the flight. I think we can call this one a failure.

We're not even getting to the poles!

And the last rocket isn't exactly fully detached.


That did the trick.

Although I feel kinda sad...I wonder why.
"Breaking news: Kerbal Science Center drops an empty rocket onto fisherbal's boat! More at three.
Oops.


KSSC staff are taking bets as to if Bob is going to land in the ocean, land on the land, explode, or get to orbit. Poor interns who chose that last option...

Water wins, although the "explode" team is still holding out on their payments.

...Okay, this is just stirring up controversy.


Well, that's a plus.


Back to the drawing board. We're adding a stage of several gimballing liquid fuel rockets, as well as massively increasing the number of solid rocket boosters. Nine total.


Adding struts to the boosters.

The Munshot II looks majestic...


Well, it's all subjective.

...and one can only imagine what wonders will happen when we launch it. Later. First, science. And lunch.



It said it was more valuable at the time...

We can research advanced rocketry and flight control; OR one of advanced construction, aerodynamics, fuel systems, landing, or space exploration; or save up for advanced electronics, advanced exploration, or precision engineering.
Bill suggests that we go for the first option because flight control sounds safe. Bob is interested in aerodynamics, which promises to make sciencing distant corners of Kerbin easier. Archibald thinks the big rockets of advanced construction sound good. The director notes that space exploration gives us extra science tools, as well as Mobility Enhancers (which will help us with creating landers).

The sooner we reach a science consensus, the sooner I can update. And now for lunch.

Oh look, a ninja vote.
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Aseaheru

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Re: (KSP LP) Bay12 Space Program: Ninja Voters: A New Demographic?
« Reply #190 on: March 02, 2014, 02:30:27 pm »

What science can we get right now?
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GreatWyrmGold

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Re: (KSP LP) Bay12 Space Program: Ninja Voters: A New Demographic?
« Reply #191 on: March 02, 2014, 02:42:34 pm »

Science as in science points, or as in technology?

In the first case: A lot.
In the second: ...Did I not say in the end of the update?
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monkey

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Re: (KSP LP) Bay12 Space Program: Ninja Voters: A New Demographic?
« Reply #192 on: March 02, 2014, 02:44:32 pm »

Before landing I suggest you try the easier mission of flying by Mun/Minmus, you can get 300+ science from each.
Bring 2 science jrs+2 goo cans, perform the experimients in hight orbit and space near Mun/Minmus, also dont forget the crew and eva reports.
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Aseaheru

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Re: (KSP LP) Bay12 Space Program: Ninja Voters: A New Demographic?
« Reply #193 on: March 02, 2014, 02:49:05 pm »

Science as in science points, or as in technology?

In the first case: A lot.
In the second: ...Did I not say in the end of the update?

Did you?

Hmm, seems you did.

Space exploration then?
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GreatWyrmGold

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Re: (KSP LP) Bay12 Space Program: Ninja Voters: A New Demographic?
« Reply #194 on: March 02, 2014, 02:58:37 pm »

Before landing I suggest you try the easier mission of flying by Mun/Minmus, you can get 300+ science from each.
Bring 2 science jrs+2 goo cans, perform the experimients in hight orbit and space near Mun/Minmus, also dont forget the crew and eva reports.
One annoying thing is symmetrical linking of mystery goo. But I can do that if folks think it's a good idea.
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