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Author Topic: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Game Over!)  (Read 91384 times)

4maskwolf

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Re: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Day 2)
« Reply #255 on: February 28, 2014, 09:26:27 pm »

Alright, back to posting.

Unvote NQT, vote Caz.  I don't know what is up with his behavior, but he's been avoiding the questions and generally seems uninterested in the game.  I'm still suspicious of NQT, but with nothing concrete to go on I'll drop it for now.

MOWE: Don't be too hard on yourself, it's just a game.

Now, to questioning:

Tiruin: Do you think that the kill last night was the bad, the confederates, or a mix of both?  Why?
Caz: What is up with your posts recently?  Why do you not want to share the reasoning behind your posts?  This speaks of some amount of secretiveness: a power role?
NQT:
So... could anyone tell me why we shouldn't lynch Caz?
Do you have something more substantial to say, or are you restricting yourself to small posts to avoid attention?  Putting up a post asking others to lynch someone, and only that, without a solid accusation, is scummy, at least in my book.
Deathsword: Once you have your reads, could you tell us if you think that the fact that TDS died over anyone else is relevant and if so, what does it tell us.

Caz

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Re: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Day 2)
« Reply #256 on: February 28, 2014, 10:35:13 pm »

Caz: What is up with your posts recently?  Why do you not want to share the reasoning behind your posts?  This speaks of some amount of secretiveness: a power role?

stuff, and nope. I'll vote NQT for rying to start a brw on me thouh.
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4maskwolf

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Re: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Day 2)
« Reply #257 on: February 28, 2014, 10:41:13 pm »

Caz: What is up with your posts recently?  Why do you not want to share the reasoning behind your posts?  This speaks of some amount of secretiveness: a power role?

stuff, and nope. I'll vote NQT for rying to start a brw on me thouh.
Quick question: how long have you been playing mafia for?

Caz

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Re: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Day 2)
« Reply #258 on: February 28, 2014, 10:43:19 pm »

Caz: What is up with your posts recently?  Why do you not want to share the reasoning behind your posts?  This speaks of some amount of secretiveness: a power role?

stuff, and nope. I'll vote NQT for rying to start a brw on me thouh.
Quick question: how long have you been playing mafia for?


ten thousand years.
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4maskwolf

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Re: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Day 2)
« Reply #259 on: February 28, 2014, 10:44:05 pm »

Caz: What is up with your posts recently?  Why do you not want to share the reasoning behind your posts?  This speaks of some amount of secretiveness: a power role?

stuff, and nope. I'll vote NQT for rying to start a brw on me thouh.
Quick question: how long have you been playing mafia for?


ten thousand years.
It's a serious question, I think I'm onto something.

Caz

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Re: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Day 2)
« Reply #260 on: February 28, 2014, 10:45:53 pm »

Caz: What is up with your posts recently?  Why do you not want to share the reasoning behind your posts?  This speaks of some amount of secretiveness: a power role?

stuff, and nope. I'll vote NQT for rying to start a brw on me thouh.
Quick question: how long have you been playing mafia for?


ten thousand years.
It's a serious question, I think I'm onto something.

I don't remember. How long have you been playing?
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4maskwolf

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Re: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Day 2)
« Reply #261 on: February 28, 2014, 10:46:46 pm »

Caz: What is up with your posts recently?  Why do you not want to share the reasoning behind your posts?  This speaks of some amount of secretiveness: a power role?

stuff, and nope. I'll vote NQT for rying to start a brw on me thouh.
Quick question: how long have you been playing mafia for?


ten thousand years.
It's a serious question, I think I'm onto something.

I don't remember. How long have you been playing?
Not as long as you.  Have you been playing for at least 6 or so months?

Caz

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Re: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Day 2)
« Reply #262 on: February 28, 2014, 10:47:37 pm »

Caz: What is up with your posts recently?  Why do you not want to share the reasoning behind your posts?  This speaks of some amount of secretiveness: a power role?

stuff, and nope. I'll vote NQT for rying to start a brw on me thouh.
Quick question: how long have you been playing mafia for?


ten thousand years.
It's a serious question, I think I'm onto something.

I don't remember. How long have you been playing?
Not as long as you.  Have you been playing for at least 6 or so months?

Dunno. What's your theory?
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4maskwolf

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Re: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Day 2)
« Reply #263 on: February 28, 2014, 10:56:16 pm »

Caz: What is up with your posts recently?  Why do you not want to share the reasoning behind your posts?  This speaks of some amount of secretiveness: a power role?

stuff, and nope. I'll vote NQT for rying to start a brw on me thouh.
Quick question: how long have you been playing mafia for?


ten thousand years.
It's a serious question, I think I'm onto something.

I don't remember. How long have you been playing?
Not as long as you.  Have you been playing for at least 6 or so months?

Dunno. What's your theory?
*sighs*  *checks forum* *finds info he needs*
unvote Caz
NQT You clever bastard you.

Since the game started you have been trying to eliminate the experienced players.  First and only vote D1: Tiruin, who is IC'ing in the current BM and ran the last one.  First night kill: TDS, an active player with several months of experience.  Next target, Caz, another player who's been around for a while.
You like vote analysis so much?  Then why don't you chew on that one for a little while.  And while you're at it, could you explain why you chose Tiruin over ALL OF THE OTHER LURKERS.  SBC contributed even less that day, but you gave him a pass in favor of lynching the more experienced player.  You spent most of the day trying to convince us to lynch lurkers, most of whom had more experience than the active players.

That's why you said on day one that you didn't think that Solymr was scum.  He's not as much of a threat to you, in your opinion, whereas some others might be.  You said how you believed IG to be just a poor town player, and lo and behold, he was scum.  I think that he had your advice on his seemingly suicidal unvote and shorten, which you then PROCEEDED TO DEFEND as "he's probably not scum, guys, he has no self-preservation".

The plaintiff rests his case.

mastahcheese

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Re: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Day 2)
« Reply #264 on: February 28, 2014, 11:47:58 pm »

Well, frick. I was about to consider voting Caz, except for the fact that he always frelling acts like this in every game I've read/played with him, but Wolf makes a pretty compelling point, I hadn't even considered that. I'm really wanting to see your response to that, NQT.

Speaking of NQT,
Cheese
Actually, I'm just going to vote you, Solymr, because your answers to my questions have given me plenty more to suspect about you.
What exactly did you suspect at that time? I'm looking back and your spat with Soly doesn't reflect well on you. Take this, for instance:
And I wouldn't point it out in public if there's a chance that nobody noticed it. Or if someone else makes another mistake.
But, as I pointed out, MOWE had already drawn attention to it. AND (I just noticed this!) IG said that in a 5 person bandwagon, he'd suspect the 3rd, 4th, and 5th. So you made sure to act quickly to get the second spot, right? A day 1 lynch on scum is pretty much guaranteed to give you the trust of others, possibly even through a long time over many days, enough time to win without him!
What are your thoughts on this, Solymr? Because so far, I'm not liking your answers one bit.
Here you're accusing Solymr of conspiring to bus IG. But how did you even know IG was scum at that point?
I didn't know he was scum. The way that Solymr was wording his questions seemed to me like he was pretty convinced that IG was scum, so I went on with my line of questioning under the assumption that he was. Since Solymr never thought to point this out like you have now, it made it look (to me at least) like he wasn't going to argue the point, since it seemed as if he were already sure of the fact.
But after the NK on DarkStar, which made no sense to me, at least from a "Solymr is scum" perspective, I decided that maybe he simply didn't think of it in that light.

I noticed that in your first post full of questions, you asked SuperBlackCat a question that he didn't answer and you never followed it up. It's easy to overlook things when you're addressing everyone but do you think his persistent absence is notable?
Yeah, I overlooked that one. SBC hasn't really seemed scummy to me (or present) so I guess I wasn't focusing on them as much as other people. And yeah, I think it's notable, but not enough to warrant a lurk-lynch if that's what you're getting at.

MyOwnWorstEnemy
I'm distressed because I was being an idiot. I'm not ticked because you're calling me out on things that you think are scummy. I was being honest in my last post, not necessarily angry and I didn't intend for it to come out that way. Here's a little tidbit about me: when someone points out something I did wrong, I do get a bit angry, but I get angry at myself for not being as good as I should be, hence MyOwnWorstEnemy.
I'm sorry, it seemed like you were angry at me (from my perspective of reading it) and I wasn't exactly happy when I wrote it (RL issues) so I guess I kind of snapped at everyone in that post a bit, through no fault of your's or anyone else's. I really felt like a huge jerk after I read your reply, so I'm still sorry.
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Oh look, I have a steam account.
Might as well chalk it up to Pathos.
As this point we might as well invoke interpretive dance and call it a day.
The Derail Thread

Caz

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Re: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Day 2)
« Reply #265 on: March 01, 2014, 12:14:56 am »

Well, frick. I was about to consider voting Caz, except for the fact that he always frelling acts like this in every game I've read/played with him,

I really hope I don't. Also more Farscape references please.
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Tiruin

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Re: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Day 2)
« Reply #266 on: March 01, 2014, 01:28:09 am »

PFP
Quickpost


Everyone voting Caz: Is it her emotions that bring you to vote her or something else?

Because looking at everything there? It ain't ringin' scum to me. But perhaps that's because I get the tinge that it isn't a Mafia context that's causing her playstyle to be as such.
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mastahcheese

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Re: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Day 2)
« Reply #267 on: March 01, 2014, 01:55:50 am »

I think it was the general lack of seriousness. But it seems common from them (Not every time, but it isn't the first).
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Oh look, I have a steam account.
Might as well chalk it up to Pathos.
As this point we might as well invoke interpretive dance and call it a day.
The Derail Thread

Caz

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Re: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Day 2)
« Reply #268 on: March 01, 2014, 02:10:14 am »

mafia is serious business
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notquitethere

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Re: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Day 2)
« Reply #269 on: March 01, 2014, 08:19:55 am »

Caz
re: NQT - you asked why I didn't follow up to IG's non-response of question. that is because he is dead and corpses tell no tales.
Bullshit. He responded on Day 1 and you talked after he gave that answer.

lynching conferendates is a better strayteg imo
You're doing a terrible job of convincing us that you're not a confederate.

stuff, and nope. I'll vote NQT for rying to start a brw on me thouh.
This is pure OMGUS. Do you genuinely think I'm a confederate? Why? You've active-lurked all day and you undermine your own contributions. If you don't want to play then don't play.



Wolf
NQT: I can't say there is a clear message to be gained, no. TDS died before he could give a strong opinion.
So you can see where I'm coming from and you withdraw the accusation of WIFOMing? I'm glad he gave his reads though because in conjunction with the reads of everyone else an interesting picture emerges.

NQT:
So... could anyone tell me why we shouldn't lynch Caz?
Do you have something more substantial to say, or are you restricting yourself to small posts to avoid attention?  Putting up a post asking others to lynch someone, and only that, without a solid accusation, is scummy, at least in my book.
I don't always have lots of time to post. But regardless, I had just prior to that put up more substantial post. In fact, if you look back, in the majority of my posts I address multiple other players. As I said, I've been waiting on reads. I've been tabulating the reads in order to see who is overall the scummiest:


Darkpaladin and Caz are the scummiest players according to the majority of the other players. Caz's vote on me is pure OMGUS, Tiruin's points have been addressed and I expect her to unvote when she's next in the thread. As for your latest case...

Since the game started you have been trying to eliminate the experienced players.
This neatly ignores my mid-Day 1 vote on Imperial Guardsman. Also, if you think, looking at Caz's play, that he's experienced then I think you need to look again. Scum have an incentive to kill competent players. I beseech you to go read the Mafia Theory thread, then you'll see that Town in general suspect more players because they're actively looking for scum and they're less afraid of drawing attention to themselves. This is what I've been doing.

First and only vote D1: Tiruin, who is IC'ing in the current BM and ran the last one.
Did you even read the thread?! I voted Scientist and Imperial Guardsman. I've had a wider range of cases than anyone else in this game. Having a narrow range of cases or absolutely no cases is a scum tell.

  First night kill: TDS, an active player with several months of experience.  Next target, Caz, another player who's been around for a while.
If I were scum I'd get rid of the competent active players, like you, Solymr, MOWE or Cheese. That'd make more sense than DarkStar.

You like vote analysis so much?  Then why don't you chew on that one for a little while.
Yes I do like vote analysis. Do you know what the major vote analytical scumtell is? The players that vote for the fewest unique targets are most likely to be scum. They are wary of drawing attention to themselves by targeting people. Good town players target the widest number of players because they genuinely suspect everyone.

Spoiler: Target analysis so far (click to show/hide)

Based on my own reads then, I'm going to unvote Caz and vote Dark Paladin as the overall most scummiest player (most suspected generally and also one of the lowest contributors in votes). Caz might yet well be scum, but we should probably lynch targets in order of suspiciousness. Dark Paladin, if you want to turn this around, give us your reads on everyone and make a case.

And while you're at it, could you explain why you chose Tiruin over ALL OF THE OTHER LURKERS.  SBC contributed even less that day, but you gave him a pass in favor of lynching the more experienced player.  You spent most of the day trying to convince us to lynch lurkers, most of whom had more experience than the active players.
I've already explained why I voted Tiruin. But, here, let me remind you. This is what I said at the time:

Tiruin
Addressing the stuffs later on.
I look forward to seeing this. We don't have forever left in the day so don't take too long. Before you ask 'is this a pressure vote?', yes, it is a pressure vote. You've posted a grand total of once since the game began. I can understand that real life can get in the way, that's OK, but I'd really like to see a bit more from you before the end of the day.

So you see at the time of my vote, Tiruin had contributed the least in the game. I wanted to hear more from her, so I laid down a pressure vote. This is a legitimate strategy for inducing players to contribute. For a pressure vote to have force then you have to carry it out if they don't deliver, Tiruin didn't deliver so I kept the vote. Now sure, by the end of the day, SBC had contributed less, but also by the end of the day it wasn't as if switching ym vote to him would have done anything. And you'll see that I didn't ignore him completely. Unlike most of the other players in this game, I'm trying hard to keep tabs on everyone and encourage people to contribute:

Superblackcat, DarkPaladin
You've both posted a total of three times since the game began. Do you plan to use your vote before the day ends? Who do you think is the most suspicious player?

That's why you said on day one that you didn't think that Solymr was scum.  He's not as much of a threat to you, in your opinion, whereas some others might be.  You said how you believed IG to be just a poor town player, and lo and behold, he was scum.  I think that he had your advice on his seemingly suicidal unvote and shorten, which you then PROCEEDED TO DEFEND as "he's probably not scum, guys, he has no self-preservation".
You'll see that, as the town cop, I made the exact same defence of a suicidal player (who, lo and behold, turned out to be town) over a year ago. I was wrong this time.

The plaintiff rests his case.
It pleases me that you've put a lot of effort into trying to figure things out and get to the truth. This is good play. BU#ut good play also involves not becoming emotionally invested in your own cases and recognising where you're wrong. And you are wrong about this, as hopefully I've been able to clearly show. Your argument rests on the faulty premise that I've only been targeting experienced players, and also that a player that makes strong use of their vote is scummier than players that don't vote at all. Reflect deeply Wolf, do you really think I'm the scummiest player in the game?



Cheese
Well, frick. I was about to consider voting Caz, except for the fact that he always frelling acts like this in every game I've read/played with him, but Wolf makes a pretty compelling point, I hadn't even considered that. I'm really wanting to see your response to that, NQT.
Caz always acts like this? Interesting. What do you think of my reply to Wolf?

I didn't know he was scum. The way that Solymr was wording his questions seemed to me like he was pretty convinced that IG was scum, so I went on with my line of questioning under the assumption that he was. Since Solymr never thought to point this out like you have now, it made it look (to me at least) like he wasn't going to argue the point, since it seemed as if he were already sure of the fact.
But after the NK on DarkStar, which made no sense to me, at least from a "Solymr is scum" perspective, I decided that maybe he simply didn't think of it in that light.
That puts your comments into a bit more perspective, thanks.

Yeah, I overlooked that one. SBC hasn't really seemed scummy to me (or present) so I guess I wasn't focusing on them as much as other people. And yeah, I think it's notable, but not enough to warrant a lurk-lynch if that's what you're getting at.
Well, we've got so many inactive players right now that it's probable best to get rid of the more suspicious of the active lurkers first.
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