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[NAV]

For some reason Pimpoleum can only be programmed to change shape, not move around.

[Empiricist]

Damn. Thanks for the heads up.

[Parisbre56]

Damn. Thanks for the heads up.

You can always just have flying use Exo instead of Aux, by having the user directly control it. Of course, it will probably be slower than a MK suit and probably more unstable too, but probably more responsive, with better acceleration.

Imagine if it were used for ships. Every rower gathers around a giant column of evershifting pimpenium floating in the middle of the vessel, hundreds of men and women woken from stasis, each group standing on its own level. They sit down crossed legged, trying to follow instructions, even though their shackles get in the way. They close their eyes and extend their hands, until they are enveloped by the material. And then, the green voice gives the command and everyone thinks the same thought. The column snaps forward and immediately everyone is pushed hard against the floor by the acceleration. The column wobbles for a bit, the material shifting and trying to escape, but the automated systems maintain its position, making sure it is in the optimal shape, resisting stray thoughts, reaching out to grab the hands of those who falter.

It could work really well for some other setting or maybe a fanfic set in a universe settled by humanity in the future. Have the rowers be slaves, like in ancient times, moving giant vessels for trade or combat. Maybe in this universe, newton's first law is not true and objects actually decelerate when a force is not acting on them, greatly multiplying the inefficiency of vessels that carry their own fuel. Laser-powered Solar-sail-like things can be used close to colonies, but they are cumbersome and expensive. So humans have adapted by using pimpmetal to create ships that can move almost indefinitely, as long as they have rowers above and enough power to create food for them. You could even have great harverster ships coming down to collect more rowers from planets that have regressed to more primitive states. Set up an evil empire or a pirate faction that raids worlds for slaves and resources.

I know that if syvarris was in that universe he'd say that they're doing it wrong because they can embed the pimpenium in the ship instead of having it free inside it or put all rowers in braincases and brainwash them or something like that, but screw efficiency, sometimes you want to make something look cool.

FAKEEDIT: Damn my imagination. I started with writing a single sentence and then I was inspired with a story and then I had to write it.

[Nikitian]

And now you have inspired me, Paris. And that is... troublesome, in the long run. 

[NAV]

I added a few ideas to my post. For an upgraded longcoat and an upgraded Gungnir electrolaser.

[Egan_BW]

We have a new tinkermaster! Does that mean we can test armor thickness?

[syvarris]

I'm putting you in charge of tinker on a provisional basis. The council will still be around to provide advice if you need it and I'm here if you have questions. Try to strike a good balance of not making completely overpowered stuff but also still letting people have fun.

Well... That's surprising.  Not unwelcome, though!

Council people!  I'm assuming you'll continue deciding balance and price?  I'd be willing to do it, but something tells me that's not what PW intended.

To tinkerers: I'm probably gonna be more of a jerk about Tinker than PW.  If you try and ask tiny little questions just to get quotes you can use to trap me later, then I'll rule 0 those quotes into shivs whivh I can stab you in the back with.  And then I'll see if I can convince PW to actually deal that damage to your chars.  Try to syv syv, and you will regret it.

Aside from that, have fun!  A new age of Tinker has come!

We have a new tinkermaster! Does that mean we can test armor thickness?

Yes.  Just don't expect it to be respected by PW.  _{In other words, go ahead; nothing has changed.}

I'll deal with earlier posts later--I'm busy now, and just wanted to make an introductory post.

[Empiricist]

Try to syv syv, and you will regret it.

Sigged.

[Radio Controlled]

Yep, most probably. Unless pw wants to do it differentlynow, I think that still stands.

[Nikitian]

Council people!  I'm assuming you'll continue deciding balance and price?  I'd be willing to do it, but something tells me that's not what PW intended.

Nope. Please, nope. At least, not completely. I mean, that's half of the point of Tinker to give the initial price. Without the price, we might as well have experienced tinkerers run "tinker" through explaining stuff to other people (the way you helped Pancaek, for example).

So - no. This change absolutely does not equal giving the whole pricing power to the Council; that simply must not be. In fact, it might rather be the opposite, or something in the middle. So - I highly request that you assign prices (with Piecewise's approval, of course) and maybe then they go to the Council for "balancing".
_{(Do not let them intimidate you. They are your peers right now, more or less. You were assigned by authority of Piecewise, not the Council.)}

Edit: I do not imply that the Council shouldn't balance things if Piecewise (or you, even) call for it. I imply that you should not default to handing all equipment over to them for pricing. Because, just a few posts back, we can see that Piecewise still gave out prices on the majority of equipment (if still sometimes called for the Council's assistance in more difficult cases).

To tinkerers: I'm probably gonna be more of a jerk about Tinker than PW.  If you try and ask tiny little questions just to get quotes you can use to trap me later, then I'll rule 0 those quotes into shivs whivh I can stab you in the back with.  And then I'll see if I can convince PW to actually deal that damage to your chars.  Try to syv syv, and you will regret it.

Aside from that, have fun!  A new age of Tinker has come!

Hey, quick litmus test! (As you know me well, and we have tinkered together, so you know my approaches.) Should I fear your rule of the Tinker?
_{(This is not a question about your integrity and fairness - I presume them inviolable, of course. This is a question of whether not-syvs should fear the reign of syv-Tinker.)}

[syvarris]

@Nik
I'll probably continue giving suggestions on what I think are fair prices. I did that even before I got appointed, after all.  What I mean is that I'll give final say on stats to the council.  I might argue with them more than I did before, but even if I wanted to have executive power over stats, I don't; if the council disagrees with me, their word is final.

No, you shouldn't fear me.  Off the top of my head, I can't think of anyone who should--Nobody has been very underhanded with Tinker in a long time, not even myself.  Still, I am going to be much more willing to rule 0 past statements that I have made.  PW's old word still trumps any of mine, of course.

Okay, but could it be done?

...This is a problem.  Questions about how reality works have to be answered by PW.  I can offer my opinion, but it's obviously going to be nothing more than "I think PW would do X".

Said opinion is "Probably, if you have a really high uncon skill."

Also, for future reference, please include context in your post.  They can be quotes, or simple copypasta in a spoiler or whatever, but please minimize the amount of scrolling I have to do.  Radio's post below is an okay example, though it lacks some context.

Most of that is possible, though getting all those things to play nice together might be a little tricky; Though, the dimension  hopping thing is a no go. Extrauniverstal engines are...well it took the doctor several hundred years to figure out how to make it and they're very large. Not easy to mass produce.

Yeah, scrap the universe hopping then. Figured those wouldn't be easy to get anyway.
 
And yes, I acknowledge getting these various technologies, what with their very different origins and characteristics, go mesh together is not a trivial task. Which is why I thought the adaptive organic computers might work well for this, since we could presumably keep evolving them till it works (though if something like a wetware ai would work better that's also fine of course).

How large a ship could we teleport, by the way, with the current machine? And could we build a bigger one?

Any more info you need? More details, plans on how to do the 'training' of the contol unit? What do you/Steve think of the plan itself, think it could work/provide game opportunities? Or shouldn't we bother working on it more?

This is another reality question.  Also a Steve question.  Also, there's five individual questions, which makes it somewhat unpleasant for me to parse.  You know how my action posts typically have numbered bullet points, each of which typically receives one response?  Using that method will probably get the most clarity from me.

In any case, I do know we can build a bigger extrauniversal engine.  I asked at some point in the M26 thread, and PW said we could build it larger.  Beyond that, I cannot answer any of your other questions.

Sorry to add to your workload Piecewise, but I’ve been wanting to ask this question ever since I read the first mission.
Would it be possible to resurrect a crystal person using the crystalline projector and a unwilling test subject? You don't have to tell me if it is and please don't tell me how to do it. I'm fine with experimenting in or out of Tinker once I get done with my mission, but I thought that it might save both of us some work if I knew if what I was attempting was even possible in the game.
P.S. Please don't kill

I'm sensing a trend, here...

No idea, though it sounds interesting.  If I had to guess, you might get a sapient being out of this, but I highly doubt it would be useful in any manner, and it probably wouldn't be the same species as the crystal people in the same way a sod is not a human.  PW ain't gonna hurt you for a question like this though, so feel free to ask him yourself.

Now that I'm off mission it's time for tinker   

Heavy Exoskeleton
-An upgraded exoskeleton that is the exact same strength as a synthflesh body.
-Bulkier than a standard exoskeleton, but should still let the wearer move freely indoors.

Because we need something to fill the gap left by synthflesh (at least strength tier wise). I'm mostly designing this as a base for the armoured version.

Heavy Armoured Exoskeleton
-Add armour to the Heavy Exoskeleton, a couple layers of battlesuit plate would probably be best.

Something to fill the niche of a mini assaultsuit, that provides lots of strength and protection but still lets the wearer move around freely indoors, and doesn't require getting your body chopped off. Fills basically the same niche as the old mining and industrial exosuits except modernized and militarized.

ARM longcoat
-Take Civic defenders longcoat. Add a layer of hexsand coating. Add a hood that fits over helmets.
-Maybe weave in some battlesuit plate fibers, for added laser defense and durability. I'm not sure if that would work.

Sharkplate is very nice. There is still a niche for ultralight cloth armour, either for black ops to disguise as civilian clothes, or to layer over sharkplate, or to protect the limbs of someone wearing flight milnoplate.

Gungnir Electrolaser kit MK2
-Replace the tesla sabre with a spark gap, same power but much cheaper because it doesn't need any automanips or lightning emitters. Make it so it can be added to any suitable laser instead of just a laser rifle. Remove the token to required to attach it to the gun.

Because the Gungnir is a good idea done wrong. This should fix that making it a cheap upgrade instead of a ridiculously expensive one.

Ooh, I like this one.

Heavy Exoskeleton:
I don't see any reason why this couldn't exist.  Shouldn't be bulky, either.

I feel like an appropriate price would be either seven or eight tokens.  On one hand, it's ~twice as strong as a standard exo, which is only five tokens.  On the other hand, the strength bonus isn't very helpful, since only the LESHO and Fission Instigator require synthflesh-level strength, so the only real benefit is punching through concrete walls and such.

Heavy Armoured Exoskeleton:
Okay.  I'm assuming you're going with two layers of battlesuit plate?

Twelve tokens, I think.  Maybe one or two more.  It should certainly be cheaper than an assaultsuit at 15, but it should also be more expensive than full milnoplate at 10.  Balance-wise, a price of 12 isn't too close to Milnoplate since Milnoplate doesn't prevent flight, and doubling the armor doesn't double your survivability.

ARM longcoat:
Hexsand coating (assuming it's just thick enough to handle basic lasrifles) and hood should be free for an updated version.
Battlesuit plate fibers... That would stiffen the cloak a good bit, but would certainly add durability.  Let's say a token (making it four total), and it doesn't shatter into uselessness when hit with a strong kinetic.  Hexsand coating would still shatter, since it's a ceramic.  Fibers wouldn't add much laser resistance, since the lasers could just melt around the fibers, but it would hold together better, for what that's worth.

Gungnir Electrolaser kit MK2:
Nyyyeh.  Two tokens, unless the council complains.  Requires a handi roll to attach.  No battery rack.  Uses its own Tesla Saber batteries, not the gun's.  All assuming you want to mimic the gungnir's power.

If we're pricing purely on balance, this is definitely at least three tokens.  Very little range loss over the tesla saber when used as a bayonet, plus it can use CON instead of UNC when in atmosphere.  I think two is fair, though.

Also, the tesla saber is no longer a lightning sword, if memory serves.  It's a metal stick.

Eh, the chance of them doubling back doesn't really bother me, it isn't really supposed to be something you stay next to while it goes off.
Would there be any other problems with it or is that about it?

CONTEXT.

I'm pretty sure it would be unable to deal with spaces between walls.  IE:

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Only one side would be eaten.  You also might have difficulty making the bomb itself small, unless you're fine with digging a cone, or a thin hole.  They can't be told to change direction after a set distance, remember.

Still, my word ain't final.  I don't know how weevils work.

i wonder...

Can we replace the energy dissipating fibers inside battleplate with the energy devouring hexplate filaments to make some kind of super battleplate?

I like this idea!  It should make battlesuit plate even more resistant to lasers, and actually give it a good defense against plasma.  I could see it being slightly more expensive, since hexsand is a ceramic, which might make the manufacturing process more difficult, but I'd call it a free upgrade.

It would make our armor less shiny, though.  Probably an acceptable tradeoff, but still.

I need a cost and effectiveness for the following

-A mithril plate costs about 30 tokens, per armoury description. Can I get that fashioned into an armouring for the white mask, which only leaves a patch in the back of the mask exposed so as to be able to make contact to the body.
-Also, Add in some padding so that "the bullet hits the mythril, the armour is unharmed but the mask within is shattered" doesn't happen? If mythril even lets energy through, that is.
-Would it be possible to put some amoint of pimpcane metal on the back of the mask between the mask and the armour. So that it touches the mask but cannot just leak out? Enough material so that when possesed the mask can float at a reasonable speed.

 Would this work?

You dealt with this in IRC, right?  I probably shouldn't deal with this post if not, since I was involved in the design, but I'll do it anyway.

I'd call 30 tokens fair, no padding needed, with mobility pimpmetal being free on top of that.  It costs so much already that a bit of pimpmetal isn't a problem.

Are you gonna pursue armory inclusion for this?  Basically gets you 25% off, although that's not exactly the main purpose of armory inclusion.

I know that if syvarris was in that universe he'd say that they're doing it wrong because they can embed the pimpenium in the ship instead of having it free inside it or put all rowers in braincases and brainwash them or something like that, but screw efficiency, sometimes you want to make something look cool.

You know me so well, don't you?

[Execute/Dumbo.exe]

...
Well, I doubt many structures would have buffered layers like that, which is what the Weevil explosive would be designed to get through, and you don't really need explosive power, only enough to propel the weevils into the wall, perhaps you could have soemthing like a strecthy tarp with adhesive layers around the sides, with little pouches of weevils set in a simple pattern backed with some directed explosives, that would allow you to easily adjust the size of the hole, right?

[Parisbre56]

Suggestion: Treat Arranger as replacement for Gauss-type weapons. Balance their bullets that way.They're essentially gauss rifles that trade slower fire rate (each bullet needs to be loaded instead of being semi-auto) for the ability to use more powerful and varied ammo types. They even have the same price.

So what you need is to create a larger, gauss cannon equivalent that can shoot the equivalent of nuclear rounds and a LESHO equivalent that can shoot the equivalent of computer guided nuclear AT sniper rounds. Then you can balance bullet types based on the bullet types we have on gauss rifles right now.

So, for example, for the normal, 1 token clip equivalent, you could get multiple weak bullets. Perhaps some sort of kinetic impact rounds that hit whatever the gun is pointing at with the equivalent force of a bullet, if we want to be unimaginative.

What do you think, Syv?

I briefly thought about suggesting things like repair or heal bullets, but then I realized that's the sort of thing Aux users would do, only this time I'd be replacing other skills with Con and I don't want to screw with balance.

[NAV]

The heavy exoskeleton's good for more than just wielding a LESHO. There are several guns that require an exoskeleton and +1 or +2 strength. It would let people without +1 or +2 strength wield those.

For the ARM longcoat (Maybe I should rename this Dragoncoat because of the scales?) I decided against the fibers. Being more expensive than sharkplate is just wrong, and the fibers don't add enough to justify the extra token.

Council please!

Spoiler: Heavy exoskeleton (click to show/hide)

An upgraded exoskeleton that's slightly bulkier and about twice as strong, the exact same strength as a synthflesh body in fact. It lets you wield even heavier weapons and use even more brute force. It doesn't have any real armour though.

syvarris' recommended price: 7-8 tokens.

Spoiler: ARM Longcoat (click to show/hide)

A stylish hooded trenchcoat covered in black scales. The coat is made from the same reactive carbon nanofiber weave as a Civic Defender's Longcoat and the scales are made from laser-resistant ceramic hexsand. It will protect you from energy weapons up to a laser rifle, and it will protect you from kinetic weapons up to a gauss rifle but it won't last many hits against those. It has a hood to protect your head.

This is a flexible ultralight armour intended mainly for layering over other armours without increasing encumbrance. You can have regeneration and slightly better defense for the same price with a Sharksuit.

syvarris's recommended price: 3 tokens

Heavy Armoured Exoskeleton:
How about 1 layer of hex-composite on the torso and helmet, + 1 layer of battlesuit plate on the entire body? That way the vitals have significant resistance to heavy weapons, and the entire body is basically immune to small arms.
12 tokens seems ideal, since you're still getting much less than an assaultsuit. Maybe 13. 14 is crazy.

Gungnir Electrolaser Kit MK2:
Why would it need a handi roll to attach? It should just bolt on to a rail like any attachment.
All the parts it needs to consist of are two metal prongs, some wires, a trigger, insulation, a rail mounting, and a transformer. All pretty cheap stuff, 1 token max. Then add a small generator. 1-2 tokens? Total: 2-3 tokens? The only thing that should cost significant money is the generator.

The main reason I want it generator powered is so we don't have to keep track of and pay for two types of ammo for one weapon.

Effect:
In atmosphere: Your laser now shoots lightning. It fries any uninsulated electronics you shoot, and it fries any uninsulated people you shoot. Really good against people in vehicles or other ungrounded metal boxes, or in water. Might have a chance to arc to multiple people or electrocute them with a near miss.
In vaccuum: You have a taser bayonet.
In water: You die.

Does that seem fair? Remember this is an upgrade not a weapon, you still have to buy the laser to put it on.

[Unholy_Pariah]

Can I get my super battleplate put up for armory inclusion?

maybe call it warplate?