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[Parisbre56]

I was thinking of having Sean give us modified chem throwers that use the newly discovered heat absorber to cool air and store it in a tank to fire later, like an inverse blowdryer. Depending on how potent it is, it could even liquefy oxygen. Of course, Anton first needs to tell people IC about our mission before I can suggest that... And it needs some research so that it doesn't get clogged by ice or explode.

[Dutrius]

I suppose usefulness would be limited by the atmosphere of whatever planet you're using it on.

[Egan_BW]

Let's have a standardized DOOMARMS treatment please?

[Radio Controlled]

Let's have a standardized DOOMARMS treatment please?

But, if it becomes an item, maybe make it come with some sort of protective box or whatever that contains it in normal situations. One could still go overboard when actually using it (like with an amp), but it would prevent it constantly exploding as an electricity grenade every time focus lapses for half a second. Maybe make the treatment give only 1 doom arm, and have said arm be held in a protective box meaning it can't grab things anymore (aka 'loose' function if that arm). But once the end of the box is opened by the user, it's zap time.

This to offset the raw power and added safety of the treatment.

[Parisbre56]

Let's have a standardized DOOMARMS treatment please?

We already have that, but it needs willpower to release instead of willpower to contain. Which is a way more reasonable way of doing things, if a bit less powerful.
http://einsteinianroulette.wikia.com/wiki/Armory#Electro_Psychokinetic_Amplifier

[Egan_BW]

To both of you; where's the Fun in that?

EDIT: Hmm. Have it come with a specially designed rubberized glove, so it can be removed dramatically when it's time for DOOMING.

[piecewise]

We're gonna have to throw this to a more group consensus then. Since, while it makes sense in universe, it could potentially change things a lot.

And I'm gonna have to find ways to let non-exo/uncons have fun too.

[Execute/Dumbo.exe]

Hopefully Heph gets a working Space magic protection suit prototype ready soon if this change passes.

[Devastator]

I'd also be against space magic detectors because by rights they should detect basically all PCs.  Synthflesh?  space magic.  Blueradite batteries?  Space magic.  Laser absorbing coating?  Space magic.  Infinite energy generators?  Space magic.  Amps and manips that are not currently in operation?  Space magic.  Artifact?  Space magic.  It would probably also include every combat ship and shuttle, and might also include the magic rocket fuel in MkIIIs.

I'd expect PW would work around that by not having space magic detectors detect PCs.

And I'm gonna have to find ways to let non-exo/uncons have fun too.

That's been out for a while already.

lastly..

(I don't want) invisible undetectable unstoppable instantkills.

What sort of character did you build again?  An invisible amp-sniper?  That's why I don't think you are sincere.  It's because you are complaining about the exact character you built yourself.

[Lenglon]

Devastator, I'm not a liar.

Lyra's primary role is one that mission commanders don't let her actually fill. She's a scout. In order to fill that role, she needs stealth and detection capabilities, secondary medical skills, nonlethal attacks, and the ability to get herself out of panic situations. The primary role her amps are supposed to fill are for when things go south, she's been caught, and she needs to escape. Since they are for short burst use and not her primary, she doesn't need the endurance of other ampers, hence her low Mind score. She cannot use deathtubes in any form because of her body, and the mass-manip amp is extremely useful for environment manipulation, and the reason for the microwave amp is because it's the closest thing she can get to Blue, which still hasn't left Tinker due to it being highly token inefficient, but which has psychological comfort value to her.

The problem is since nobody lets her actually do her job properly and keep bringing her in for her secondary roles as her primary purpose, she hasn't been able to actually do what she's designed to do. she is constantly kept in the middle of a large pack of people and expected to be a mainline amp fighter and medic, which is wrong. but she's better at it than newbies simply because she's a veteran character and her short burst is about as long as a newbie can last, and that burst is at full veteran firepower.

so yeah, she's been used as an invisible amp-sinper. but that's not what she's for.

and as for the specific traits: NPCs have detected her, have seen her attacks, have repeatedly stopped her cold, and she has a kilcount of 0 (check her missions if you like, she hasn't even taken down a single sod) so you can try to say she's all that, but the results have shown quite thoroughly otherwise. If I wanted what you're describing I'd have built like Xan in stats and picked up a can of 3 token or less (i think it was just 2 or 1, but I don't remember) invisopaint for her suit. by now she'd have a +5 or +6 in Exo, a will of iron, and been able to go toe-to-toe with an amp specialist DBZ style.

I don't play to minmax, and one real look at my character should have shown you that (I recently upgraded her Uncon because she's been learning to use her claws. Think about that for a second. If you need help, look at her Str). I have a character that has a low End and Mind and needs to be self-supporting. I want a chance to dodge specifically so I can do what I've set out to do. If I'd can get my way then Lyra's killcount will remain 0, I just need to be able to justify keeping her away from the stomping gun brigade so we can actually not set off every single trap PW ever sets.

[Devastator]

I ran a scout character as well.  He had +1 Aux, so he could use drones for scouting.  Brother Lars would make a good scout too.. his high fate can get him overlooked, and he's quite tough to take anything that can spot him.  Newbies would make good scouts as well, as they are expendable enough so that their losses don't matter.

The thing is, every character can be considered a scout, as it's a tactical role.  The scout is whoever is in front.  Naturally, the mission commanders don't put the most potent character in a role that can be filled by everyone, including sods and drones.

It's easy to say that you never intended to make an invisible amp-sniper, but that's what you built.  Sure, you can call her a scout, but that doesn't mean you didn't make an invisible amp-sniper.  The two are not exclusive.

I just have to think, though, 'do you tell the truth about your character?'.. and your character is afraid of body mods.  So you've spent every token you've earned and borrowed on body mods and implants.  You've submitted yourself to an experimental treatment from an item called the death-cube.  Your body mods have been custom and groundbreaking, along with a long list of features that you wanted to have.

So, no, your character is not afraid of body mods.  Lets look at the rest of your claims, then.

Does your character have low mind?  Your character has +2 to mind.  Calling +2 low is, well, inconsistant.  +2, including one from char creation, is not low.  It could be higher, but as mind points only rarely run out, so it's probably the optimal amount.

You do have a killcount of zero, but that's the same as most people.  Many missions have very few enemies to fight, and the times when you have taken killshots (several) haven't worked out, but the attempts have been made.  Saying that you refuse to kill anyone isn't correct, you've been willing to kill people in the past.

So do you have a strong prohibition against killing?  Well.. no.  You've never let it stop you before in the past, and you willingly volunteer on missions knowing that you may very well have to kill people.  It's easy to say that you don't want it, or you don't like it, but it's never affected your in-game behavior.  How about disliking being controlled by others?  Well, you claim to have a very strong one, but you just found out that Steve has an override button in your brain, and despite admitting that you haven't come to terms with your officers over it, are rushing off to volunteer for another mission where that might be in play.  OOC, you vote in favor of keeping the override button, and providing very few reasons for it not be used frequently.

As for optimizing, lets take a look at the -2 to con, which you chose before you ever had your body preventing you from using con weapons.  In return for that, you are 'forced' into using the two most token-efficient weapons, that also have significant utility capabilities.  That is what a powergamer does, goes for the most bang for the buck.  Same for the uncon boost recently.  You'd need three levels to get another point in exo, and there are lots and lots of useful uncon stuff available these days, and it's looking like a really bright future for an uncon user.  In addition, strength is irrelevant to the new forcefield blades.  I've got a feeling that the next set of body mods would have had forcefield claws in it..

The comparisons to Xan seem reasonable, but it's just as easy to interpret that as not boosting stats beyond the point where they are worth less than the points you put in them.  It might mean you're a better powergamer than him.

I do believe you when you say you wanted to build a scout, though.  Scout is a role that you've defined for yourself, so you would get to do whatever you want.  Saying that you don't get to do "your job properly", when you are the one who has created that concept of "your job" is fully every bit as conceited and obnoxious as my pointing it out to you.  So drop the double-standard, if you want me to back off.

I hear this stuff, and I hear things like "I'm perfectly okay with the murder of billions as long as I don't have to get MY character's hand's dirty."  "I'm okay with Steve having control buttons for every other soldier, as long as I don't have MY freedom restricted."  "Pshaw, all you dirty characters are prisoners and soldiers, but MY character is here due to a mistake, and has a nice clean job where she gets to do something useless and gets paid for it."  "All you poor people have to worry about teamwork, while I get to define MY role in missions."

Me?  I'm just a dirty little bastard who is projecting his problems onto you, because Lenlon is Miss Perfect who cannot have any problems of her own.

[Dutrius]

Devastator, please stop being so inflammatory. This is starting to look like a personal attack.

[Lenglon]

going to PMs because clearly this is a personal issue Devastator has with me, and there's no reason to keep clogging the Tinker thread with it.

[NAV]

Spoiler: Mechanical multitool: Awaiting council and Heph approval (click to show/hide)

Name: Mechanical multitool
Cost: 2 tokens
Description: A must have for any tinkerers. It's a complex set of actuators, mechanical parts, metal pieces and sensors that can transform into a tool that can be used to manipulate any basic mechanical device. It's a mechanical thing; works great on something like an engine, but don't expect to solder anything with it or check voltages or something. About 8-10 inches long, 3-4 wide, and weighs about 10 pounds.

Would the multitool be able to function as something like a saw or drill or other power tools? How good would it be in this roll? It would probably need stuff like separate saw blades, drill bits, grinding wheels, etc. added.

How about a welder/soldering iron/generator combo for 1 token?

And how about lowering the price of the cutting torch to 1 token, or even combining it with the welder combo above? I think we can all agree its current 3 token price is way too much.

Reposting this so it doesnt get forgotten, and editing it a bit.

[NAV]

Oops