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[Comrade P.]

Speaking of IVAN treatment, I have a question:

Is IVAN treatment compatible with Limiter Unlock genemod? There are no restrictions for these treatments on wiki, but it sounds like those two would inevitably lead to various accidents when combined, I think.

Answered (IRC quote below)

[swordsmith04]

[22:15] <+Swordsmith04> PW, Comrade P wanted to ask you whether the IVAN Treatment and the Limiter Unlocker genemods should be incompatible (he thought it might lead to something like the actual Ivan)
[22:17] <Piecewise> You might not wanna mix high level gene mods sword

Compatible, but not recommended.

[Xantalos]

[22:15] <+Swordsmith04> PW, Comrade P wanted to ask you whether the IVAN Treatment and the Limiter Unlocker genemods should be incompatible (he thought it might lead to something like the actual Ivan)
[22:17] <Piecewise> You might not wanna mix high level gene mods sword

Compatible, but not recommended.

So get Cthunkan to try it out, got it.

By the by, is it still possible to tinker, but to make a weapon solely for oneself, or alter an existing weapon a bit, like it originally was?

[Unholy_Pariah]

I have an idea that needs work, and informations.

is it possible to make a self sustaining manipulator that anchors an item to a specific object and completely elimates that objects weight in relation to its anchor?

If so how large would the manipulator be?

If the object being swung around was reduced in size would this affect the end price?

Basically, is it possible to make an automanipulator that lets you swing a battlesuit sword around as if it only weighed as much as a flashlight by metaphysically anchoring it 15cm beyond the crosspiece of a sword hilt?
And would exchanging the BS sword for a hexbug volleyball make it cheaper?

also you told me in the past that while we cannot use GPS coordinates for space magic we can use special objects to replace the space magic origin co-ordinates so that the manipulator itself doesnt need to be re-oriented.

How much would one of these space magic targetting sensors cost?
How far can they be moved from the manipulator and still function?

[Parisbre56]

Note that to make automanipulators self sustaining they need to be about the size of a car. So as long as you're fine with limited uses, it should be possible.

[Unholy_Pariah]

Note that to make automanipulators self sustaining they need to be about the size of a car. So as long as you're fine with limited uses, it should be possible.

Im not expecting this to be man portable, it would be nice though.

But yeah, barring any technological alternatives to shrink it this weapon is likely going to be vehicle and avatar only.
Although im hopeful it could be modified for use with an assault suit.

[piecewise]

Well then yes, it would be a possible to make something like this and make it portable. Probably not super portable, but portable.

So, that means that, as long as an enemy isn't willing to nuke the shit out of an area from really far away, it should be possible to deny orbital artillery support capabilities?


Next thing: artillery support shuttle. Basically a high-altitude gunship. We talked about this before, do you remember that? Think a shuttle with the following features:
-Can fly at high altitude.
-Decent sensors to be able to accurately fire.
-Has QEC to Sword and good regular comms to talk to ground troops.
-Has a shape to help with stealth (like what the B-2 has going) and a coating of stealth material.
-Has a suite of countermeasures (flares, chaff, ...)
-Armored with a ground layer of sharkmist plate and hexsand on top of it (enough to protect against conventional AA laser installations).
-Armed with:
      -A couple lasers of variable output (maybe a design like the FEL cruiser, basically a big box with multiple exit sites for the laser beam). At the least, an output/turret in the front, back, sides and underside
      -A LESHO-like launch system for very precise missiles that can (but don't strictly have to) be accelerated with gauss tech. Missiles can have various payloads.
-Cockpit to allow for up to 3 pilots (or 6 braincases), but can be remote-controlled by steve as well.
-When a pilot is present, the chances for an artillery strike to hit is better according to the pilot's AUX skill. But please, don't make the thing miss 4/6 of the time when on autopilot, like the Hep artillery did, that was a bit ridiculous.
-It costs 5 tokens to have the artillery shuttle deployed.
-1 token buys you 3 airstrike 'vouchers'. Spending more vouchers at once allows a larger strike (spending 1 might buy you a 3 sec laser sweep of battlesuit-damaging power, spending 2 might buy you a single laser pulse straight melting a battlesuit, spending 5 vouchers might buy you a kinetic missile with a nuclear payload, etc). Should we precisely define what amount gets you what, or woud you prefer to keep it more vague?
-Name: not sure yet; Probably High Altitude Gunship ("Deploy the HAG!") or an animal as designation (probably a bird of prey. Eagle, falcon harrier, buzzard, hawk, something like that. What would you like best or find easiest to remember?

Well, you should be able to at least retaliate. I can't tell you how effective it would be because scenarios are different.


Your gunship sounds acceptable too. Though, it may have limited use depending on the situation. But still, sounds acceptable. You might want to add on a box of tungsten rods for carpet bombing.

The Painsuit. Don't shoot me yet.

Basically it is a system built around bare exoskeleton. It breaks wearer's joints by bending them backwards repeatedly until it doesn't have enough strength to do so or until they don't break anymore.
Few weak lasers positioned around to cut and burn flesh, rigged to use exoskeleton's power source.
Medical system loaded with poisons and acids to inject or evaporate into breathable form.
Pistons to break major bones, ribcage and spine repeatedly.
Serrated spikes to impale and tear flesh and organs.

User wears it before being dropped on mission site and by time he gets there he's beefed up to handle most of basic forms of damage. Not intented to wear during mission.

For the ivan treatment eh? Well, It might work, but I feel like you might be surprised at the result. Remember, the ivan treatment modifies the body to deal with damage. Honestly it would probably just modify the body in such a way that it smashed out of the suit.

I know I'm on a mission that has technically already started, but I'd just like to ask a question about a certain medical concept: Organ Printing

You said the problem with fleshknitter was that it grew things very quickly but didn't provide any structure for the cells.

What if there was a device a medic could carry that could "sculpt" organ scaffolding that is then pumped full of fleshknitter? Then the resulting cells would have a scaffold, something that would guide them, help them form the proper structure, the proper type of cells.

The advantage is that you have two tools ("printer" and fleshknitter can) that can heal most kinds of injury. (Although you'd probably need some tools from an advanced kit as well to make your job easier and more likely to succeed, since it would be better if you clean the wound and stop the bleeding and prepare the area.)

The disadvantages are that it takes more time than merely injecting some fleshknitter in the wound (printing an entire arm would take forever and probably drain the entire printer cartridge, but merely reconnecting a limb or fixing an eye would be relatively quick). It's also a sensitive process that requires the patient to remain reasonably still and the environment relatively safe. And, even though the software in the tool handles many things like analyzing the shape of the wound and knowing how to print certain kinds and configurations of flesh, the medic is responsible for making the ultimate choices about what kind of cell goes where and what shape the organ should have (meaning that with a bad roll, you might end up with an eyball in your guts). So it's much like real surgery in a way.

Overall, not as good, quick or easy to use as Xan's body and it can only work on fleshies, not robots, but it might be cheap enough and versatile enough to justify its existence. I could see it as an upgrade for a medic who already has an advanced kit and a can of fleshknitter.

See, fleshknitter pumps in undifferentiated cells that then rapidly differentiate and plug up holes and maybe even restore minor degrees of function due to sheer luck. The scaffolding would get them in the right shape and all, but thats generally not enough. What about all the extra cellular matrix? Or the Epidermal layers lining the inside or outside of various organs, or layers of different cells in general. I mean, you spray it in the lung, it doesn't necessarily form the alveoli pointed in the right direction, or even form them at all. Muscle cells are quite long and need to be aligned, skin needs anchoring points and bloodflow from underneath.

Fleshknitter is basically a big benign tumor we use to plug holes. It's not lung in a can.

I have an idea that needs work, and informations.

is it possible to make a self sustaining manipulator that anchors an item to a specific object and completely elimates that objects weight in relation to its anchor?

If so how large would the manipulator be?

If the object being swung around was reduced in size would this affect the end price?

Basically, is it possible to make an automanipulator that lets you swing a battlesuit sword around as if it only weighed as much as a flashlight by metaphysically anchoring it 15cm beyond the crosspiece of a sword hilt?
And would exchanging the BS sword for a hexbug volleyball make it cheaper?

also you told me in the past that while we cannot use GPS coordinates for space magic we can use special objects to replace the space magic origin co-ordinates so that the manipulator itself doesnt need to be re-oriented.

How much would one of these space magic targetting sensors cost?
How far can they be moved from the manipulator and still function?

"infinite" automated manips exist, they're used in ships like the sword for generating gravity and increasing the power of the guns, but they're very large. Far too large and expensive for any individual.


Also, I have no memory of saying that or what it would entail. You'd have to link me to my post.

[Parisbre56]

Ah, I see. So the problem is that this is a purely chaotic random thing. You'd need something more guided, something that will not only make the cells be in the right place but also make the right kind of cells appear  Well, I guess that will require more research.

[Radio Controlled]

Your gunship sounds acceptable too. Though, it may have limited use depending on the situation. But still, sounds acceptable. You might want to add on a box of tungsten rods for carpet bombing.

Yeah, it'd be very limited in the amount of actual missions it can be used on, but would offer cheap and indirect firepower in return (Heabi mission would've been good :v ). Also, you sure about the rods? My idea was to use the missiles and arm them with nukes (using Simus' 'clean nuke' if needed) because I thought that'd be more cost-effective and less bulky (and a couple megaton nukes can bomb a pretty big carpet). I mean, one'd need to accelerate the rods to immense speeds to use them for carpet bombing, no? Needing enormous accelerators and/or spess mahics? Or am I missing something here?

EDIT:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I mean, one'd need to accelerate the rods to immense speeds to use them for carpet bombing, no? Needing enormous accelerators and/or spess mahics? Or am I missing something here?

I think the idea with tungsten rods is that you release them from orbit and gravity accelerates them to a high speed. Due to their high mass and speed they don't need any explosives either. Though, the planet would have to have sufficient gravity, so it might not work on asteroids unless the ship is already moving itself. At least, this is how they claim that they would work on Earth.

I dunno if they'd be worth it when used like that. I mean, it's a High-altitude gunship, not an orbital warship, and normally would still operate inside the  atmosphere. Longer range is possible, but then you loose accuracy, and the main use for this is precise artillery support, not indiscriminate bombardment, though when that is needed I think a complement of nukes should do the trick very well in a pinch. But if the main goal is glassing a site, then an orbital warship using a big rail/coilgun seems better.

From this video: http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/reel-physics/7296-GI-Joe-Retaliation-Tungsten-Rod-Drop
A tungsten rod of 8500 kg going 8700 m/s from an altitude of 800 km gives 32800 mJ, or 78 ton (0.78 kiloton) TNT equivalent.
If we assume a gunship is flying at, say, 100 km (a Lockheed AC-130 gunship has a service ceiling of about 9 km, by the way, and 100 km is the Kármán line on earth, aka upper limit of the atmosphere), and that it wouldn't be using rods of 8.5 ton a piece (that lockheed gunship only weighs about 55 ton itself), these rods would have substantially less energy. I could do a quick calculation, but you get the idea.

In the armory you can buy a 1 kiltoton nuke for just 7 tokens. The bomb on Hiroshima was 12-15 kilotons. So really, when not using very big coilguns to actually accelerate your ammo to high speeds (which would cost a lot and probably be big and heavy, an issue for ships in atmosphere), just using nukes is much more efficient (a nuke is a lot of power in a relatively small package).

Should we precisely define what amount of vouchers gets you what, or would you prefer to keep it more vague?



new idea: electronade

This is basically a non-'refillable' electricity grenade. Take the tesla arc electricity-throwing mechanism. Make it shorter and less focused so it throws electricity all around it, in an area of a few meters or so. Make it have a blueshard battery. Bigger than a regular nade, more like a grapefruit I think (Though i don't know for sure). Components are cheap and burn out through usage, should last about as long as the battery. Give it three round dials: one for % power used, one for time delay and one for how long it works. Has small battery life indicator.
different intensities:
0,5%: taser power, stuns unarmored people but doesn’t kill or harm them
2% kills unarmored people
5% kills lightly-to-medium armored people
10% full power, kills anything not very well insulated against electricity
Time dial indicates how long it works before shutting off. So at 0,5% power for ten seconds will make it work at stun intensity for 10 seconds and uses up 5% of the batteries' power. After that, it can be reused (until the battery dies out). Time delay says how long it waits to start working to prevent people zapping themselves (standard is 3 sec). Does this thing make sense? How many could we get for a token? Is 2 for a token reasonable?

[Unholy_Pariah]

Hmm.. think it was an old pm that i dont have any more.

im probably just misinterpreting a vague memory.

[Xantalos]

Ah, I see. So the problem is that this is a purely chaotic random thing. You'd need something more guided, something that will not only make the cells be in the right place but also make the right kind of cells appear  Well, I guess that will require more research.

Yep.
Absolutely.
Mmm hmm.

Saltiness aside, would the direction of essentially imprinting the design of human bodies into the substance so it can identity where it is and grow the appropriate things work?

[Parisbre56]

Easiest way to do it would be some kind of marker, "guide" or some sort of stabilizing agent put inside the scaffolding that will stop the knitter from being so random.

Normally you'd just inject the right kind of cells in the right places in the scaffold and let them multiply (I think, going from memory here) but that would take too long to be of any use.

[Xantalos]

Hmm. What if we had differently specialized knitters that had those cells from those parts interspersed through it already? Like an arm fleshknitter, leg, eye, etc. Probably best used by skilled medics to prevent accidentally growing an intestinal tract made out of teeth.

[Parisbre56]

In that case it might be quicker to just "print" specialized flesh knitter directly, unless there's an organ that requires scaffolding to be ”sculpted". Which would probably make it more expensive, since you'd need multiple cans of flesh knitter.

The reason I'm trying to tinker it like this is because it represents an upgrade to flesh knitter, it represents a natural progression for medics: medic gets emergency kit -> medic gets advanced kit -> (here should be a branch representing choice between flesh knitter tank and surgery kit) -> (organ printer for flesh knitter branch, more limbs for surgery kit branch)

Of course, nothing beats the combo of medic+exo+organo-dominator amp+can of fleshknitter for extra easy to process flesh. You should get that if you're ever allowed to get amps again.

[AkumaKasai]

Of course, nothing beats the combo of medic+exo+organo-dominator amp+can of fleshknitter for extra easy to process flesh. You should get that if you're ever allowed to get amps again.

No he should not.