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[GreatWyrmGold]

I hope it works out that way.

[Tack]

I guess it's a matter of population.

Amount of people who are in FGRP subforum
Amount of FGRP people who are in the RTD subforum
Amount of RTD people who are in ER.

[LordSlowpoke]

I hardly even notice ER, but sure, have a subforum if you want to. It all boils down to whenever subforums are going to be handled like candy now, because that's what I fear might happen after the nth one gets made and dislike the idea thereof.

[Sean Mirrsen]

I hardly even notice ER, but sure, have a subforum if you want to. It all boils down to whenever subforums are going to be handled like candy now, because that's what I fear might happen after the nth one gets made and dislike the idea thereof.

Consider that a subforum would be only be given to large, multithread, constantly updating games that show signs of continuous growth. How many games, besides those that already qualify, do you see currently that are even close to fitting that description? "Handed out like candy" would only apply if just anyone could apply for the candy. This is more like... I don't know, "Handed out like Medals of Honor". It'd take time for any given game to grow to such size that it'd need its own space, so "more and more will come" isn't a terribly good guesstimate. And if they do come, then it's a win for everyone involved, methinks.

[Harry Baldman]

It still would not hurt to create a general-purpose board for threads that need extensive organization not properly supplied by the regular RtD forums. So what if current games besides ER do not match the requirements for it today? A couple of months down the road, a new candidate may appear that needs organization on par with ER's level.
And it would knock the favoritism argument out of the ballpark, so there's two birds with one stone.

The one problem is that ER will most likely be alone for a good while. That kind of lets the favoritism argument back in...

It's better than nothing. Besides, we once again go back to the argument that no other thread currently rivals the need for ER's organization, so this is a compromise between the two sides.

Just because something is a compromise doesn't make it a good idea. Just call the ER subboard what it is - the ER subboard. If there appears another game of a similar size and need for organization, give that a subboard as well. If the unlikely event that, say, four such games appear comes to pass, then you can consider making a multi-thread game subboard out of all the individual game subboards. If you don't call the ER subboard what it is... well, consider this - you can have a subboard for a single game, made for purposes of organization. Or you can have a subboard which only allows in sprawling games with thousands of posts across multiple threads, long running times, dozens of dedicated players and highly consistent update speeds, and put only one game in it. In either case, you have an ER subboard, in the second case you simply try to lie about it to make people feel better. If somebody will be offended by ER being given preferential treatment, calling its subboard a different name is unlikely to placate them, in my opinion. So far, though, nobody seems particularly offended by the idea, which might be a good sign.

I hardly even notice ER, but sure, have a subforum if you want to. It all boils down to whenever subforums are going to be handled like candy now, because that's what I fear might happen after the nth one gets made and dislike the idea thereof.

Consider that a subforum would be only be given to large, multithread, constantly updating games that show signs of continuous growth. How many games, besides those that already qualify, do you see currently that are even close to fitting that description? "Handed out like candy" would only apply if just anyone could apply for the candy. This is more like... I don't know, "Handed out like Medals of Honor". It'd take time for any given game to grow to such size that it'd need its own space, so "more and more will come" isn't a terribly good guesstimate. And if they do come, then it's a win for everyone involved, methinks.

I agree with this, pretty much. If we ever get to a point where subforums do get handed out like candy because there's tons of games that have reached ER's current scope, well, I wouldn't exactly be particularly broken up about it, mostly because we'd have tons of games that have reached ER's current scope, and hopefully a comparable level of quality to justify the interest in them.

[DarkArtemisFowl]

You're not thinking ahead though. Of course, nothing matches ER in its scope now. I'm saying that it should be a general-purpose subforum because eventually there will be other games like ER, and I can guarantee you, that some troll or another GM's gonna get mad and say that their game is as great as ER. This is a little bit of forethought to prevent unnecessary feuding.

[GreatWyrmGold]

I hardly even notice ER, but sure, have a subforum if you want to. It all boils down to whenever subforums are going to be handled like candy now, because that's what I fear might happen after the nth one gets made and dislike the idea thereof.

Slippery slope fallacy. Insert amusing and facetious comment here.

You're not thinking ahead though. Of course, nothing matches ER in its scope now. I'm saying that it should be a general-purpose subforum because eventually there will be other games like ER, and I can guarantee you, that some troll or another GM's gonna get mad and say that their game is as great as ER. This is a little bit of forethought to prevent unnecessary feuding.

Whatever subboardy rules we decide on (either general guidelines for getting a new subboard or specific ones for being moved to the more general "Epic Games" one), we need to make sure they're clear.

[Toaster]

I hardly even notice ER, but sure, have a subforum if you want to. It all boils down to whenever subforums are going to be handled like candy now, because that's what I fear might happen after the nth one gets made and dislike the idea thereof.

Slippery slope fallacy. Insert amusing and facetious comment here.

Going to have to disagree here.  This is, essentially, a legal decision, and precedent has a long-standing tradition as a legal concept that drives decision making.

[GreatWyrmGold]

I hardly even notice ER, but sure, have a subforum if you want to. It all boils down to whenever subforums are going to be handled like candy now, because that's what I fear might happen after the nth one gets made and dislike the idea thereof.

Slippery slope fallacy. Insert amusing and facetious comment here.

Going to have to disagree here.  This is, essentially, a legal decision, and precedent has a long-standing tradition as a legal concept that drives decision making.

I'm referring to the idea that if one long-running, massive game gets its own subforum, they are going to be "handled like candy". That's a definite SSF. And I really don't see how precedent comes into this unless some other game gets to ER's size and complexity.

[LordSlowpoke]

I hardly even notice ER, but sure, have a subforum if you want to. It all boils down to whenever subforums are going to be handled like candy now, because that's what I fear might happen after the nth one gets made and dislike the idea thereof.

Slippery slope fallacy. Insert amusing and facetious comment here.

Going to have to disagree here.  This is, essentially, a legal decision, and precedent has a long-standing tradition as a legal concept that drives decision making.

I'm referring to the idea that if one long-running, massive game gets its own subforum, they are going to be "handled like candy". That's a definite SSF. And I really don't see how precedent comes into this unless some other game gets to ER's size and complexity.

going to chime back in with my willingness to bet money that someone's going to want a magical girl subforum as soon as er gets its own, if not sooner

$50 sounds like a good wager to me

[GreatWyrmGold]

I'd probably take you up on that if it wasn't written in a way that would allow you to demand a magical girl subforum and claim the money.

[Sean Mirrsen]

Rise of the Magic Girls needs no subforum. It's perfectly contained within its IC and OOC threads, with no signs of growth sideways.

[Harry Baldman]

You're not thinking ahead though. Of course, nothing matches ER in its scope now. I'm saying that it should be a general-purpose subforum because eventually there will be other games like ER, and I can guarantee you, that some troll or another GM's gonna get mad and say that their game is as great as ER. This is a little bit of forethought to prevent unnecessary feuding.

For an RTD to grow to ER's size is something that takes quite a bit of time, quite a lot of dedication, quite a bit of talent and quite an attractive (and probably specific) game concept, and another ER-like game appearing is something that is likely to take years to happen. It's not an event you can easily replicate, and it probably hasn't been for lack of trying. Until a point when such a thing happens, ER will be alone in this general purpose subboard. And we can't even be sure it will happen again, necessarily. It's not very productive to accept remote possibilities as events that will certainly happen soon enough for them to be in any way relevant.

And it's not at all because ER is great that it needs a subboard - it needs a subboard because it is huge and has to grow even more soon. The question isn't of quality, but of quantity (though quality can occasionally cause greater quantity). And once again, I propose that if we ever get to a point where another game has a plausible reason for growing to five, six or more threads while still keeping a large amount of player interest, this game should also get its own subboard. Because a game with size and staying power like that doesn't happen all the time, at least not here it doesn't. If we gave piecewise his own subboard rather than ER, feuding would be well justified, because that really would be favoritism. But ER getting one doesn't seem likely to trigger the same, because ER has yet to be matched in size by anything on the RTD board, and its further expansion on this board may render its presence increasingly looming and undesirable. And if it ceases to expand, it may become messier and messier over time, impacting the ability of certain readers to read the game, players to catch up on what they've missed and more.

Honestly, what are the scenarios to consider here? Some person starts an RTD with 5 threads at once and claims that they need their own subboard? That would be fairly obnoxious on their part, and presumably it would be quite difficult to get other players to lobby for it. Some person says their RTD with one or two threads is too wildly unmanageable and clutters the board too much to keep on the RTD board? That would be quite unreasonable. Can you provide an example of a line of reasoning that would lead to founded feuding on the matter?

And I do believe some people would be offended more by the separation of games into 'Epic' and 'Non-Epic' than by the separation of games into 'ER' and 'not as huge, growing and unwieldy as ER', because that separation definitely would engender the attitude of 'What? What are you talking about, my game's all kinds of epic! 5000 posts is an arbitrary BS limit I'm going to reach anyway!' And if, gods forbid, you choose to go by some other method of classification, I can imagine the bickering and bitterness would only intensify. That's why classifying games into 'Epic' (read 'master race') and 'Non-Epic' (read 'peasants') won't work. It'll only exacerbate the potential feuding, particularly if you go with the reasoning 'but ER's the only one that qualifies! You can't blame us if the rest didn't have players that posted hard enough and GM's that didn't update often enough!' I just can't see such a classification ending well.

[WhitiusOpus]

I'm in agreement to simply give ER it's own subforum, because, just like Harry said (only summarized) there is very small chance of another game coming along with this scape, and it would have to be very long running to even begin with. Simply put, make a separate subforum for each that comes along that has that level of activity and space needed deserves and benefits from its own subforum. Honestly, how many of these do you think come along?

[DarkArtemisFowl]

I chose a general purpose forum with no other current candidates because it is a compromise. You still get a forum that organizes ER well, and does not support the argument that people may use of favoritism, since the bar will be set for games that truly do need organization on the level of ER. Sure, it may not come for years, the point of this is to have the greatest acceptance from both sides.