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Author Topic: Einsteinian Roulette: OOC and NEW PLAYER INFO  (Read 2543344 times)

Gentlefish

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Re: Einsteinian Roulette OOC
« Reply #9675 on: October 04, 2014, 04:37:51 pm »

Yep. The hulk just (hopefully) made Pinocchio. Or else I just ripped his nose off.

lw

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Re: Einsteinian Roulette OOC
« Reply #9676 on: October 04, 2014, 04:40:49 pm »

I just want to test the elasticity of the mask. Or to get it off from my face. Or both.
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Nikitian

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Re: Einsteinian Roulette OOC
« Reply #9677 on: October 04, 2014, 04:48:11 pm »

@AoshimaMichio Then I must apologise for misinterpreting your intent. Achievements in the original meaning of the word, I support thoroughly.

Spoiler: On Jim: (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: On medals: (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Aaand on structure: (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: On stealthy fighters (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Postscript (click to show/hide)
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Gentlefish

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Re: Einsteinian Roulette OOC
« Reply #9678 on: October 04, 2014, 04:54:41 pm »

Why not Sod-brains built into small craft? It'd keep the size down and allow it to keep some complex thought.

syvarris

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Re: Einsteinian Roulette OOC
« Reply #9679 on: October 04, 2014, 04:58:08 pm »

@Paris
I had been under the impression automanips a bit larger than people would work, which is pretty small compared to an avatar.  Even if it's car sized, like ship manips, it's still relatively small.  One of the tests I was planning on doing was to see if you could make unusual shape AMs, like two half shells that encase the Avatar.  That would allow basically any size.

Why does the pilot have to constantly be driving?  It's space, not the ocean.  He spends all of his energy throwing himself forwards, goes into a drug addled coma for an hour, then does it again.  Over and over.  Have some sensors keeping track of how on-course you are, and they can tell him to alter his course if he drifts too far.  It's inefficient, sure, but it's also undetectable, and 'occupies' the same minuscule space as the 'weapon'.  And the only fuel you need is nutrient slurry, and possibly drugs.

Of course, if you don't want a weapon on this thing, an avatar isn't a good choice.  It's always going to be a fighter craft that can also pull off spying well.  The only reason the Synthflesh is there is to power the amps, and amps don't have much use on a purely stealth mission, unless you're doing something crazy like mindcontrolling people from orbit.

I'd think the time when extra manueverability is most important is when you're in an observable area, and turning off stealth is a very very bad idea.  Adding traditional propulsion would only hurt you then, although you would be able to go faster when you're unobserved.  I just don't think that would be highly important.

@Nik

Jim: He did murder people on the serial killer mission.  "Civilians, AWAY!"

Stealth craft: As I said above, the synthflesh is there because it massively increases the power of an amp.  Miyamoto made an enormous heatblade that chopped at least one skyscraper in half, before continuing further into the atmosphere and out of sight, and that's still knife fight range in space.  I just don't think a normal amper would be able to do much, unless we basically made them barnacles.  Even then, they'd only really be able to hurt people- not the ship itself.

@Pufferfish

Because fighters don't make any sense in space battles.  They have to have a method of moving that doesn't need massive amounts of fuel- requiring either an amp or a very large automanip- and can't even carry powerful weapons anyway.  If that doesn't convince you, search this thread for the big argument about fighters in space.  There's pages of arguments about why they're a terrible idea.

Gentlefish

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Re: Einsteinian Roulette OOC
« Reply #9680 on: October 04, 2014, 05:09:08 pm »

Well I was saying, you were talking about mass-stealth, sod-brains would be the perfect fit, and amps in bulk are (relatively) cheap, considering you're building, essentially, vehicles.

Devastator

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Re: Einsteinian Roulette OOC
« Reply #9681 on: October 04, 2014, 05:25:01 pm »

The problem of this still being a game, and not wanting to choke out the silly fun and shenanigans too much?

The best way to ensure silly fun and shenanigans is to institute multiple layers of management!

Yes, exactly! The less time the GM has to spend organizing us, the more time he can spend screwing us. If we self organize (for example, the wiki), we save valuable screwing time. Same thing for the generals. The fact that the system is simple and only becomes meaningful at the higher levels, being mostly flavour in lower levels, means that newbies don't need to care about it while learning the game while generals don't have to spend 10 hours organizing people. It's perfect.

Support ranks, so that nobody has to learn who you are is still a pretty, well, terrible reason.
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Nikitian

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Re: Einsteinian Roulette OOC
« Reply #9682 on: October 04, 2014, 05:26:48 pm »

@syvarris
We don't know what exactly consitutes the Exo genemod, but there is one. Likewise, with quite a bit of deliberate gene-altering, willpower reserves of the pilot might be increased. And finally, we could try and make them synchronize, or even mind-merge (with a trick or two from psychic Altered legacy), which could magnify their power when used en masse.
The point would be the cost-efficiency of such light craft. Even with all of the above, it might cost much less than mass-producing synthflesh. Sure, it is possibly a lot better, but what good would its, say, 10x effectiveness be if 100x of cheaper craft could have been produced instead? Very rough and made up numbers, of course.
It would still be very good as a stealthy craft, and better at cracking up tougher targets, but perhaps for smaller ships just a fleet of cheap&dirty gravicraft could prove better. That's assuming they are that much cheaper, however.

Oh, and Jim killed the possessed civilians. At most it would be killing their bodies, while fighting the puppeteer. He did not kill them as civilians, in cold blood, with their minds very much in place and unharmed.
There is a reason Maurice was very angry with Mesk back then. Oh well.

@Pufferfish
Well you'd need to get a brain for that. Not a cloned one either, amps don't like them. Thats why sods can't use em.
Cloned brains cannot work with amps, for some reason. Which puts a very interesting spin on Jim's backstory, by the way (and no, I don't mean stasis dementia).
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Gentlefish

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Re: Einsteinian Roulette OOC
« Reply #9683 on: October 04, 2014, 05:28:13 pm »

Aaaah. Boo.

syvarris

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Re: Einsteinian Roulette OOC
« Reply #9684 on: October 04, 2014, 05:48:07 pm »

Primary thing you're missing, Nik: Every amp requires a human who uses it.  We'd need a hundred volunteers to gene mod, and put in little drones, and we'd need to give them all at least a movement amp, and some form of stealth equipment if we want them to get close enough to actually do damage...  Plus, they're all basically complete amp noobs.  For the avatar ship, we only need one skilled guy, and we can give him a universal amp, and a pair of decomps.  And then his power is massively magnified by the fact he's in an avatar.  I'm pretty sure Miyamoto, even with the avatar's bonuses, had no stat above a +2 when he pulled the enormous heatwave trick.  And IIRC, he wasn't even winded by it.  Compare to Jim, who has nearly a +3 in will, more efficient amps than Miyamoto, and usually gets fives.  He very quickly exhausted himself throwing around a bunch of random human shmucks. 

An avatar wouldn't have ten times the power of one brain.  It would have ten times the power of all the brains.  On top of that, it has far less cost in equipment and people.

Parisbre56

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Re: Einsteinian Roulette OOC
« Reply #9685 on: October 04, 2014, 07:55:49 pm »

@syvarris: I meant that you couldn't do things like leave the ship in orbit with an autopilot and call it down when it's time for extraction. You'd need to keep the pilot in it at all times. And you'd need to be able to trust the pilot at least as much as a player. I think the fact that we are considering the ships for a different role and imagining them differently is influencing our ideas.

EDIT: Also, automanipulator size is related to what the automanip is supposed to do. Harder things need larger automanips. And considering that a stealth ship should be as small as possible, so that it can land and hide somewhere more easily, how many automanips you have might matter in that case.

And another problem I just thought of is that a pilot might not be able to remain concentrated enough to get the ship out of a planet's gravity well.

@Jim-clone: Jim is technically not a clone, he's just a human produced with the DNA of another human as a template. It's like the original Jim is more like his father. Even if he is like his twin brother (which he isn't) then consider this: If you made a character and another player made a character that is your twin brother, would you still be able to use amps? Or would the fact that you are two different people matter?

Also consider the fact that Steve recommended germ cells with "variety" for the amp factory.

@Fighters: If you can find enough ampers to make fighters viable, then you're probably better off making a ghost ship.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2014, 08:02:45 pm by Parisbre56 »
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SeriousConcentrate

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Re: Einsteinian Roulette OOC
« Reply #9686 on: October 04, 2014, 08:17:25 pm »

It's true that Jim is very slightly genetically different from the original; part of his backstory is that Spectrum was modifying the DNA to work with amps better, so I guess that's the loophole we can use to explain why Jim is technically not a Sod. I have been toying with the idea of stasis dementia, though. And I guess once I get my combat stats where I want them (just five more Will and and six more Exo) I could just start pumping Cha and Speech... although I'll have to actually work on End and Dex if I want to go back human...

Anyway. Mind elaborating, Nik? I'm kinda curious as to where you were going with that.
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sambojin

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Re: Einsteinian Roulette OOC
« Reply #9687 on: October 04, 2014, 08:33:13 pm »

He's probably just trying to absolve Jim from being a mass murderer. Because, there were "reasons". Which unfortunately might disqualify Jim from getting a medal......... :p
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SeriousConcentrate

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Re: Einsteinian Roulette OOC
« Reply #9688 on: October 04, 2014, 08:45:54 pm »

Nah, I don't care about the civilian part. I think like maybe Lyra is the only person who hasn't killed a (innocent?) bystander directly or indirectly yet. :P I meant the 'interesting spin on his backstory' part.
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Gentlefish

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Re: Einsteinian Roulette OOC
« Reply #9689 on: October 04, 2014, 08:54:45 pm »

I guess that's true if you're talking about vets :P

Heh. The worst I've done to my team mates is subject them to the force of A Door Getting Punched Good. Which resulted in deafened fleshmates.
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