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[Unholy_Pariah]

Or we could not fuck with the existing system that actually makes sense and we could make gene mods cheaper, because honestly they are seriously overpriced.

[SeriousConcentrate]

Or we could not fuck with the existing system that actually makes sense

Honestly this is the stance I agree most with. Gene mods I could take or leave, my character doesn't use them and when he gets killed off I won't be making another, but I'm not a fan of making changes when they're largely unnecessary. Like penalizing people who get killed in a game where death is as random and quick as this one, for example.

[syvarris]

Point 2:I said that a person could abuse the system by starting with no points in physical stats, and then immediately get their head chopped off, effectively gaining free stat points.  If you don't put points into physical stats, then you have zero in all of them, which gives a -1.  If a robobody gives +0, then your stats effectively each get set to 3, which gives a +0 bonus.  That's nine free points, which is certainly abusable.

Point 3: Mmn.  Maybe.  The sods we grow grow with brain, and the pits have to be retooled every time we change what they produce.  I don't know if we would be allowed to grow a body of a player, especially considering the fact that every player gets stat increases continually.  I also don't know if we could transplant a brain into a live body easily.

It certainly would cost a decent amount, and the person still can't ever swap to a synthflesh body without "losing" those points.  It also raises the question: If we could clone a body, with all it's bonuses, as cheaply as a sod, and transplant a brain into that body... what's stopping us from waiting until there's an operative with a total of +4 in physical stats, and copying their body to sell in place of synthflesh bodies?  Especially considering the fact that they would be dirt cheap.  Instead of issuing MCP.Is to people at the start, we could issue them Hulk McArmstrong's body.  And we could upgrade them every time an operative levels up to an even higher bonus.

Our entire force would consist of identical freakishly powerful bodybuilders.  Half of whom have women's brains.  _{^{Heh, Lyra}}

[SeriousConcentrate]

Point 2: It's abusable once, true, but it's not enough of an abuse that it really matters in the long run. Or you could just head that off entirely by saying the player's body has to be destroyed enough on a mission that just sticking synthetic organs in there wouldn't be enough to help them. Like, again, Jim, a man who was cut in half and probably could have gotten away with just robo-legs if his chest hadn't then been annihilated as well. That way if they get their head cut off just to get a robo-body it gets stuck back on, leaving them at square one.

Point 3: Logically, yes, that's the case. Game rules-wise, to me that's just a question of fluff. ER takes place in a time where science has pretty well mastered cloning and related techniques - or so I assume, since Saint isn't running any nurseries for little baby sods that I'm aware of. As for the question... well, that would be up to PW to tell us why we couldn't do that. Maybe the brain would just reject the body, or the other way around, who knows.

[Empiricist]

Humanflesh also has the advantage that it's needed for blops missions, but that's a small minority of people.  Plus, I think Charles is working on a fat xanflesh/robobody hybrid that would theoretically allow a robot to join a blops mission.

I should note that it would be far from perfect since it's more tailored for his own needs than anything else. It probably won't work too well on synthflesh (best case scenario: you end up morbidly obese), plus x-rays would pose a problem unless Xan figures out how to make meta-material flesh that affects x-rays or something.

[Hapah]

I was thinking of making a table of skill levels that'd help with this sort of thing, but I think ultimately it's the GM's decision. Some basic labels can help decide how badly a character is likely to botch a given action.

I.e.

• Skill <=-15 - Atrocious. Character is actively hindering own chances of success through borderline suicidal stupidity.
• Skill -14<=0 - Clueless. Character doesn't have the slightest hint of an idea what he is doing, or even why.
  
• Skill 1<=15 - Inexperienced. Character has minimal knowledge of what he's doing, but is still prone to making rookie mistakes.
• Skill 16<=30 - Competent. Character is skilled enough not to make rookie mistakes when doing simple things, but still not so much that he doesn't make errors and miscalculations from time to time.
• Skill 31<=45 - Proficient. Character does simple tasks with ease, and is unlikely to significantly mess up even with relatively hard tasks.
• Skill 46<=60 - Expert. Character easily does most anything that can be done with the skill in question.

Oh yeah, I'm sure we'll get something like this, in the end.

It doesn't allow for adjustment of the roll, meaning you can never ever get around the chance of rolling a one or six regardless of what you do

I like there being chances for 1's and 6's, though. The dice have six sides for a reason! And if you're trying something that you're overqualified for in the new system, you won't blow up the Sun just because you rolled high.

(Also, Happy Turkey Day, where applicable!)

[Radio Controlled]

I really dislike the second part.  It means that in some some cases, an untrained and unskilled guy is a better choice to do something, because he can't fuck it up really bad if he's allowed to prepare. 

But only if dynamic bonus applies to rolls, instead of skill modifier, which is what I would use (though personally, I think we should do away for now with dynamic bonusses, and if we later see they're really needed we can consider bringing them back).

The first part of this, making people specify what they're doing, I like.  That's a good system that would work cleanly and without hassle, but it's also the original system we had.  If it's actually held to, it's good, but I don't see any reason we wouldn't fall to the same old pitfall of "Ehh, close enough".

To solve this pw could allow the Council to call out posts that try to do this, after which the bonus isn't charged and the turn lost. Not the most elegant solution, but it might help. Though again, I personally think we could do away with them for now.

Honestly, speaking from experience, knowing how to use your strength is easily just as important as actually being strong.  It makes just as much sense as with dex.  I'd say the same for charisma- knowing how to carry yourself, when and how to smile, laugh, frown, etc. is much more important than just being naturally pretty.  You're correct for endurance though, unless somebody here is a monk who can control their vascular system through concentration or something.

Sure, as I said, for some things it makes some sense. But knowing how to use it only carries you so far, and isn't that applicable in some situations. If you need to roll that boulder up that hill, knowing to 'bend with your knees!' will only carry you so far. In a system where robobodies can increase stats at infinitum, you have two equally strong bodies, one lifting dozens of kilos and the other hundreds. And sure, charisma is more than looks, but a huge amount of human conversation and charisma is facial expression. The smallest muscle in the face can influence how people perceive you.

Meanwhile, robopeeps get smileyfaces. If nothing else, they should logically get a massive charisma penalty. All that said, I do not think limiting people like this would be a very nice thing to do, and bad for gameplay.

If they get their head blown off, it isn't as bad, because their brain is in their torso.

Small thing: in real firefights, the torso is hit far more often that the head (it's a much easier target and such). If anything, putting the brain in there (and not armoring the torso) would be a disadvantage!

With human body mods, you either have to go with hilariously overprices gene treatments (See: Bishop, who's spent enough on gene treatments that he could have bought an Avatar, but is currently only slightly superior to a robobody) or risking your body on Doctor Roulette.  The pill machine is basically scientific suicide right now.

I agree that gene treatments are too expensive for the relatively meager boons they give, especially considering the alternatives.

[Harry Baldman]

It doesn't really make sense to keep a dynamic bonus applicable to rolls if the regular bonuses apply to skill alone, I think. So I'd also certainly agree with doing away with that whole business for expediency's sake if nothing else.

Also, that thing about putting brains in torsos is extremely dubious in terms of benefits, considering that the torso is indeed a much easier target than the head.

How about stat loss upon death being restricted only to rolling for it once when first getting put into a robobody (deliberately or otherwise), and having the maximum possible loss be considerable? Like 7-10 stat points at the very highest, for instance, while leaving a reasonable possibility of no stat loss as well?

And I do agree with needing to cheapen those flesh modifications, especially the regenerative ones - take off 3-5 tokens from the price of each, I'd advise 5 for the regeneration, since the thing it's supposed to do (prevent stat loss upon death and avert needing to sit out a mission due to extreme injuries) isn't at all relevant to gameplay anymore, and the regenerative abilities aren't overly impressive, either. Maybe add a flesh upgrade to decrease brain fragility. That'd get some traffic, I'm sure. Maybe add an upgrade that provides you with a backup brain a la Xan.

[kj1225]

Make one that gives common sense.

[Hapah]

It doesn't really make sense to keep a dynamic bonus applicable to rolls if the regular bonuses apply to skill alone, I think. So I'd also certainly agree with doing away with that whole business for expediency's sake if nothing else.

The first part is what I was thinking, yeah. I wouldn't mind seeing them go away either.

[Toaster]

Make one that gives common sense.

100 token minimum?



One thing these changes will do is make the spinal column upgrade a much better option, since it'll come into play as 1 protection much more so again.

[Harry Baldman]

One thing these changes will do is make the spinal column upgrade a much better option, since it'll come into play as 1 protection much more so again.

Would be great if it didn't come free with synthflesh bodies, as a side note.

[Nikitian]

One thing these changes will do is make the spinal column upgrade a much better option, since it'll come into play as 1 protection much more so again.

Would be great if it didn't come free with synthflesh bodies, as a side note.

It would still be better and more often purchased if it were quite cheaper (as well as other underused genetreatments, yeah)

[Toaster]

I certainly wouldn't price it down much; no less than 10 or so, because it's a very strong "anti-screwup" tech; remember it rerolls 2s as well.  Certainly it's a lot better than the fibroblast or partition therapies.

[Nikitian]

Sure, probably reasonable. Especially since at 10 tokens it's half the price of a synth-body (which already comes with one, so a straight upgrade).
Then again, fibroblast/membrane mods might better be priced down closer to Mk II cost (since otherwise there is practically no reason other than 'heavy'/'largely impractical' roleplay ones to purchase them).