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[miljan]

Leaked talk on 25. february EU foreign affairs chief Catherine Ashton and Estonian foreign affairs minister.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEgJ0oo3OA8

Interesting thing is they already talk about eastern ukraine region will make problems, donetsk saying that it is under occupation from ukraine and that russia should take over.
And some nasty thing with snipers hired to kill people by someone from the new government. Very nasty things.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

UR, the background music is amazing. Do you know what band is it?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haydamaky_(band)

[Kicior]

A picture is worth a thousand words, so this post is worth a few thousands.

Spoiler: It's over (click to show/hide)

Sloppy translation:
-They're coming from west! There are thousands of them, we stand no chance!
-Yes. It's over.

-Vanya, what is this?
-Words of disapproval.

 

Putin claims protesters in Kiev where trained in Poland and Lithuania.

World according to Putin:
-well prepared people, trained for a long time in Poland and Lithuania, professional like  the Russian special forces
-spontaneous reaction of Crimeans in self defence, you can buy those uniforms in a shop.

[Sheb]

Leaked talk on 25. february EU foreign affairs chief Catherine Ashton and Estonian foreign affairs minister.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEgJ0oo3OA8

Really nasty indeed. I wonder if it is true.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Leaked talk on 25. february EU foreign affairs chief Catherine Ashton and Estonian foreign affairs minister.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEgJ0oo3OA8

Hm, Estonian foreign minister retold rather popular conspiracy theory about "opposition snipers" he heard from one of Ukrainian activists, so what?

[GlyphGryph]

So, it seems like the Ukrainians are basically responding as "right" as they could be - they are remaining in staunch opposition, military is standing together, but they are not letting themselves be provoked and are not initiating any sort of conflict.

And then you've got nice scenes of solidarity like this:
"Crimean Tatars bring food to surrounded Ukrainian soldiers while «not-Russian» mystery men refuse loaves of bread and stand awkwardly."
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=618663294849115

[olemars]

Leaked talk on 25. february EU foreign affairs chief Catherine Ashton and Estonian foreign affairs minister.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEgJ0oo3OA8

Really nasty indeed. I wonder if it is true.

The "Olga" mentioned in the call has a somewhat different story

Olga Bogomolets said she had not told Mr Paet that policemen and protestors had been killed in the same manner.
"Myself I saw only protesters. I do not know the type of wounds suffered by military people," she told The Telegraph. "I have no access to those people."
But she said she had asked for a full forensic criminal investigation into the deaths that occurred in the Maidan. "No one who just sees the wounds when treating the victims can make a determination about the type of weapons. I hope international experts and Ukrainian investigators will make a determination of what type of weapons, who was involved in the killings and how it was done. I have no data to prove anything.
"I was a doctor helping to save people on the square. There were 15 people killed on the first day by snipers. They were shot directly to the heart, brain and arteries. There were more than 40 the next day, 12 of them died in my arms.
"Our nation has to ask the question who were the killers, who asked them to come to Ukraine. We need good answers on the basis of expertise."
Mr Paet's assertion that an opposition figure was behind the Maidan massacre was not one she could share.
"I think you can only say something like this on the basis of fact," she said. "Its not correct and its not good to do this. It should be based on fact."
She said the new government in Kiev had assured her a criminal investigation had begun but that she had not direct contact with it so far.
"They told me they have begun a criminal process and if they say that I believe them. The police have not given me any information on it."

But yes, it should be investigated. The rest of the conversation about the new government having little trust among the protesters, being same as the old boss etc., and that there would be east/west strife was widely reported at the time.

edit: It's also odd how phone conversations keep getting put on youtube in relation to Ukraine.

[Sheb]

Interesting. Could be fake, or the Ukrainian FSB is really good at tapping phones.

[10ebbor10]

Look, the EU is doing something.

[Bouchart]

So, it seems like the Ukrainians are basically responding as "right" as they could be - they are remaining in staunch opposition, military is standing together, but they are not letting themselves be provoked and are not initiating any sort of conflict.

The best response the Ukraine can make is a crash nuclear program. 

[Darvi]

Look, the EU is doing something.

I don't believe you.

[Dutchling]

Look, the EU is doing something.

Does the EU know?

Also, can you copy+paste that shit? It has a paywall...

[Bouchart]

It's not a paywall but you have to register.

[Dutchling]

Registerwall then.

[GlyphGryph]

I've been seeing a lot lately about how this whole thing is sort of a short-sighted and rather desperate point of opportunism for Putin, personally. He's provoking confrontations, setting himself up against the West as an enemy not because he wants conflict or more territory or even cares about the West, but because he's increasingly unpopular at home and fears unrest or replacement, and is trying to direct the Russian gaze outward at foreign enemies. This is why his government has been pushing against homosexuality (represents the West), pro-Nazi western-supporting groups (same), etc.

But that on the world stage, he fears China far more than he does the West. He's taken a stand against the West because he feels comfortable the wilingness of the West to push back is minimal. But He's running out of options, because it's becoming increasingly clear that he can't take any more active engagement with China as it would put Russia as the weaker partner and his credibility won't survive it - and with the fact that much of eastern Russia is now "ethnically Chinese", he's desperately afraid they might do the same to him that he's doing to Crimea and there's basically nothing he could do to stop them if he wanted to.

Don't know how much that holds, but it DOES seem like Russia is starting conflicts it believes it "can't really lose" even if the actual gains are minimal, and it seems like a decent explanation of why - using it as a unifying excuse to maintain power back home, and as a "safe" display of power when dealing with the rest of Asia.