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[Chaoswizkid]

It's not like anybody in Crimea is willing to fight for the party in government.

I think there are guys in Crimea who are willing to fight for their country against invaders. And much more than Russians expect.

The whole idea - "fighting for the party in government" is something I fail to understand...
Do you think that Russians in WW2  fought for Stalin and Communists?

Many did, but that is beside the point.

Pretty sure "many" doesn't mean "majority" at all.

Your government did enough to piss the Crimeans off in the course of the twenty years it ruled over independent Ukraine.

Wait, then why are they upset now that the government that pissed them off is gone? Shouldn't they be happier now that it's gone?

[Comrade P.]

Avis-Mergulus, You are so delusional...  Crimea has population of 2+ millions, and you think that each and every one will great Russians as liberators?

Say this to those guys in Odessa.

Main mottoes are to be noticed:
Russia! Russia! Russia!
Fascist shall not pass!
Odessa - City-Hero!

[Chaoswizkid]

Avis-Mergulus, You are so delusional...  Crimea has population of 2+ millions, and you think that each and every one will great Russians as liberators?

Say this to those guys in Odessa.

For a city of almost 1 million people, pretty sure it's totally plausible that is just a vocal minority.
Not saying that attitude isn't the one that the majority in Odessa has, but I don't think you should state it as all of Odessa treating Russia thankfully.

[Mictlantecuhtli]

I always find it amusing how the people most willing to violate a country's sovereignty are hyper nationalists.

[Sheb]

Let us remember that 40% of Crimea's population are Ukrainians or Tatars. Not a majority, but a very large minority.

[Comrade P.]

I always find it amusing how the people most willing to violate a country's sovereignty are hyper nationalists.

You say that like it's a bad thing. If you think nationalists = nazis, you're wrong. It's like a gradation from moderate to extreme. Like some medcines - a small dose is vital, larger makes you feel like shit, greater one kills.
Ukrainians took a greater dose.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Comrade P. I never said that there are no "Russia come save us" type in Ukraine

But you Russian believe that each and everyone thinks like that.....

You know.... there are no single region in Ukraine that gave less then 1% to Svoboda in the last parliamentary elections. (not bad for "Neo-nazi Western- Ukraine only party.")

In Crimea Svoboda got 1.04%. (BTW, Russian Bloc, the only openly "let's join Russia" party got 1.2% in Crimea and 0.31% in Ukraine )
In Donets'k region  Svoboda got 1.2%
In Odessa region Svoboda got 3.3%
In Kharkov region Svoboda got 3.8%

That's only Svoboda, not counting other pro-Ukrainan and\or Pro-Western liberalism parties..

[Sheb]

I love how Russia says he want to send troops to stabilize the flashpoint situation in Crimea. When the situation was caused by them moving troops in. It's like Napoleon saying he'll send more troops in Russia to stabilize the situation there.

Also, the UK recalled their ambassador to Russia. And why did Russia recall its ambassador to the US? Because of Obama's "costs" remark?

[miljan]

I expected more a civil war than russian acting this directly.

Now, if eastern ukrain is really pro russian, nothing will happen. Ukraine will not fight, as they can not fight for a territory that doesn't want to be a part of ukraine. From that perspective it is actually better that russian invaded,  to stop possibility of civil war. The simple reason that russia is doing this tells me that there is big pro russian feel from the people in that region.
Russian can swallow that part of ukraine, but it will not be able to digest it if it doesn't have support from normal people.

It's always better to divide a country in two than to force it to live together. And it's happening all time in last 20 and more years.

But, if easter ukraine is not really pro russian, then shit will happen. But than, I am not sure what would be the goal of russian invasion.

So i think that this will be finished without armed conflict, more or less, and that the ukraine will be divided.
 

[Comrade P.]

Comrade P. I never said that there are no "Russia come save us" type in Ukraine

But you Russian believe that each and everyone thinks like that.....

Spoiler: Election results (click to show/hide)

You know.... there are no single region in Ukraine that gave less then 1% to Svoboda in the last parliamentary elections. (not bad for "Neo-nazi Western- Ukraine only party.")

In Crimea Svoboda got 1.04%. (BTW, Russian Bloc, the only openly "let's join Russia" party got 1.2% in Crimea and 0.31% in Ukraine )
In Donets'k region  Svoboda got 1.2%
In Odessa region Svoboda got 3.3%
In Kharkov region Svoboda got 3.8%

That's only Svoboda, not counting other pro-Ukrainan and\or Pro-Western liberalism parties..

I do presume that Ukrainians are the people with various opinions, including both ultra-nationalist and pro-russian position. That is a normal situation.
And here comes my personal attitude. The problem is I do not like the people wearing symbols and sharing thoughts of SS divisions and I do like people who express their will through initiative of secession. That sentence was not supposed to say I'm right because you're Nazi, for I have no right to declare that.

[10ebbor10]

I expected more a civil war than russian acting this directly.

Now, if eastern ukrain is really pro russian, nothing will happen. Ukraine will not fight, as they can not fight for a territory that doesn't want to be a part of ukraine. From that perspective it is actually better that russian invaded,  to stop possibility of civil war. The simple reason that russia is doing this tells me that there is big pro russian feel from the people in that region.
Russian can swallow that part of ukraine, but it will not be able to digest it if it doesn't have support from normal people.

Well, they can fight if they want to. They probably won't win, but they can't find.

Also, the only thing that the Russian intervention in Crimea tells you about the local situation in Crimea, is that it's in the interest of the Rusian Federation (or at least it's leaders), to intervene in Crimea.
Besides, Russia doesn't intend to annex Crimea, they'll just install a new government in a separate satellite state.

[Avis-Mergulus]

Avis-Mergulus, You are so delusional...  Crimea has population of 2+ millions, and you think that each and every one will great Russians as liberators?  What you'll get is new Chechnya. If you invade in "mainland" Ukraine, get ready for widespread guerrilla in Donbass and all other regions.  That will be a huge surprise for Russian soldiers - "how so many Banderas infiltrated Eastern Ukraine?"

I am content to wait and see, personally. Let time show which of us is "delusional".

Chaoswizkid: I never said that many=majority. I merely pointed out that the idea is not absurd. When you take a government order to "defend your country", you defend their idea of what constitutes it.
And by "the government that pissed them off" I mean the government based in Kiev. Nobody is upset about Yanuk being gone because nobody liked him. Anywhere.
Also, I am no nationalist, unlike some former members of a certain far-right party. Your three percent are unlikely to help you.
Or are the accusations of nationalism only because it's barbaric mongol Russia going to war, and not some more democratic country? If so, tractum your cranium out of your recrum, please.
As for the "us Russians thinking", I have lived there for a significant portion of my life. Unlike, I believe, some western Ukrainians. I have my reasons.

[Comrade P.]

You know what is really interesting? The situation in Ukraine has grown from local protest to political games of Russia and Europe, and now it looks like no one really cares about Ukraine itself. Except Russia, who wants a part of it.
Not saying that the original point of Maidan - eurointergration - is ruined, and everyone accepted that.

[Mictlantecuhtli]

Also, I am no nationalist, unlike some former members of a certain far-right party. Your three percent are unlikely to help you.
Or are the accusations of nationalism only because it's barbaric mongol Russia going to war, and not some more democratic country? If so, tractum your cranium out of your recrum, please.

I just love how you can look past invading a country just because you're the ones doing it. Good thing your KGB didn't allow the Crimeans representatives a chance to self determine before you occupied it, or you might actually have to find out that not everyone thinks Glorious Russia is the savior.

[miljan]

I expected more a civil war than russian acting this directly.

Now, if eastern ukrain is really pro russian, nothing will happen. Ukraine will not fight, as they can not fight for a territory that doesn't want to be a part of ukraine. From that perspective it is actually better that russian invaded,  to stop possibility of civil war. The simple reason that russia is doing this tells me that there is big pro russian feel from the people in that region.
Russian can swallow that part of ukraine, but it will not be able to digest it if it doesn't have support from normal people.

Well, they can fight if they want to. They probably won't win, but they can't find.

Also, the only thing that the Russian intervention in Crimea tells you about the local situation in Crimea, is that it's in the interest of the Rusian Federation (or at least it's leaders), to intervene in Crimea.
Besides, Russia doesn't intend to annex Crimea, they'll just install a new government in a separate satellite state.

The thing is they dont have a reason to fight. You can not fight for something to save that doesnt want to be saved in the first place.

Invasion tells us a lot, not just that russia has interest there.