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Total Members Voted: 6

Voting closed: March 19, 2014, 05:27:58 pm

[GreatWyrmGold]

Corran watches him go in amusement.

"Due process? If due process was enough to get justice they wouldn't have needed us to begin. One day that naive little builder is going to have to grow and accept the world doesn't work that way.

These scum respect nothing but force.

((...Do you actually believe this, or is this just an IC view? Because either way that's a horrible thing to believe.))

[kj1225]

"I don't normally say this but, take a lesson from the christians at least they do things right from time to time."

Blank storms out to do his actions.

[Patrick Hunt]

(( A bit of both, law isn't fair. The richer or more powerful you are the more laws you can get away with ignoring. ))

[GreatWyrmGold]

((Well, yes, but "due process" is that thing that stops people from being imprisoned/executed without a chance to defend themselves in court. I'd say that it stops the rich and powerful from being more powerful...not to mention that that bit has more to do with issues outside the general form of the legal system. Shooting criminals won't help that.
Not to mention that very very few of the criminals would have death sentences, especially as this seems to be set in Illinois, which doesn't have a death penalty.))

[Patrick Hunt]

(( Maybe, but at least in the UK rich people tend to just throw money at a lawyer and the problem goes away. I'm not going to start shooting shop lifters or tax evaders.

But murderers, rapists, perverts, gang members and that kind of thing? Well hunting season is now open.


You can take 2 approaches, non violent which is far harder, far more time consuming and just creates a power vacuum for a new gang to step into. Or violent which is faster and easier and still creates the power vacuum. Except a gang isn't going to be scared of a few years in prison and once it's over you've got 2 gangs instead of 1. However if you wipe them out you create fear in the rest, keep wiping them out and over time they learn to stay away.

Some people are to dense for that but in most cases they're going to move to a new location, or be wiped out first. Or at least thats my approach in this. Kill enough of the gangs and criminals who deserve to die and you discourage criminal behavior. Not entirely but it'll cut it down a bit which is a good start.

Besides IC wise thats who Corran is, any criminal other then minor idiots gets an automatic death sentence.



You could try to deal with the minor crimes without violence, like the 2 drugs houses. See if your methods are as effective as mine are. Arguing won't convince Corran but results might.  ))

[GreatWyrmGold]

((I've gone over this before. If you wipe out the ones you find, they find ways to not be found. If you can't address the root causes of crime, it will still keep happening no matter what you do. Those root causes are what Carl's been trying to get at this whole time.
And nonviolent means have one advantage: We don't get the bad PR from gunning down people with not so much as a trial. Legal issues are going to come up when we get noticed.))

[Patrick Hunt]

(( Bad press like Corran got when he went on a 2 year mass murder spree? Not really big on his list of concerns. Besides which the result of that action is law enforcement all over the USA now worship him as a hero and he got a promotion.
You can try to address the route cause. How do you plan to remove greed from the world because thats what motivates the Cossacks.
So unless you intend to give them the planet the only permanent solution to them is a lead enema.

And if they adapt thats fine, just makes a nice challenge for me to dig them out to kill them again. ))

[GreatWyrmGold]

((Bad press like enough to get the governor to shut it down. I'd call that a Game Over. And, of course, some people care about that kind of stuff. And Corran going on a two-year murder spree, wiping out crime, and getting lauded for it is really, really bugging me. That's not how police work. That's not how the law works.

You can't remove greed, but you can make sure it's being directed towards non-criminal ways. Greed is, after all, nothing more than wanting to get stuff. If the path to get stuff by ways other than crime is open and offers the same or better rewards, why wouldn't a greedy person take it?

And you don't get it, do you? Crime can change in more ways than you're going to be able to expect and prepare for. It's analogous to the evolution of species. Freeze everything, and things grow to resist the cold. Throw in a disease, and their immune systems get advanced. They'll survive and persevere no matter what.))

[Patrick Hunt]

(( And so will we, your not going to convince them they can make more money without putting in a lot more work.

You can try by all means you might even succeed sometimes, but force will be needed and people will die. For instance. Try talking The Rebs into surrendering.  I'll buy a bodybag. ))

[GreatWyrmGold]

((Not that much more work, and a lot less risk. And you don't need a lot more money to get most people to take a life where they're not at risk of being shot at or going to jail.

Some force, when needed? Sure. Force as the 100%-of-the-time, no matter what, attempted panacea? That's just stupid.))

[Patrick Hunt]

(( Uhm I have said try your way. I'll handle the out and out violent groups. The Rebs are beyond peace. Fanatics don't bow down to words they have to be beaten down, especially fanatics who commit suicide rather then be taken alive.

The rest I'll leave until peace fails. ))

[TCM]

"Wait, we're not going to reason or capture with anyone?"

[Patrick Hunt]

"Not everyone, but The Rebs yes. If they commit suicide rather then surrender what do you think they'll do to our men if we hesitate to put them down? The Cossacks sure they have guns but they prefer money so they'll probably surrender and hope to post bail later.

I'm not taking risks with my mens lives when dealing with enemies known for extreme violence.

[TCM]

"I have a question for you Corran. Just wondering with your moral principles and all. If you met the vilest human being you absolutely hated, and had a good sniper shoot on him, but the shoot would have to go through a young child he's carrying, would you take it?"

[Patrick Hunt]

"Of course not, I'd shoot him in the knee first then kill him once he drops the kid.