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[Robsoie]

I think the mod would be better if they  entirely scrapped the tech-tree and made all progress driven by mission discoveries, salvaging, lucky events and trading.   Perhaps the same is true of tech-trees in other games.

I wonder if there will be a mod that will be able to work like that, would be interesting to have a game based on this instead of the billions of researches system nearly every openxcom mods are using.
But can mods actually do that ? i mean they're mods of an actual game so there may be some limitation in the gameplay systems mods can actually completely change ?
Maybe would need a rewrite of the engine itself to accomodate such system rewrite, and i'm not sure there are many coders that are able to do that kind of work in the openxcom community.

[E. Albright]

You could fake it pretty well by making all advances tied to salvage, and all salvaged items have a flat, nominal research cost that take ~1d. That's probably the best you could do under the existing engine, but it'd be close to what you're talking about, even if it would still let players pick and choose whether to actualize their discoveries.

[Dostoevsky]

I don't like the X-piratez tech-tree as it feels  bloated and doesn't seem to interface well with mission discoveries.   For example, if I find an old Carbine in a very early game mission I shouldn't then have to  research a sequence of several unrelated things in order to be able to access carbine ammo in the trading market.

 I think the mod would be better if they  entirely scrapped the tech-tree and made all progress driven by mission discoveries, salvaging, lucky events and trading.   Perhaps the same is true of tech-trees in other games.

Politely disagree on this point, at least partially. Not being able to get ammo for a gun you find 'early' is good in my mind as you end up with various 'trump card' options at various points in the game, and for Piratez specifically at least the game is as much about (comedically) bootstrapping a civilization as it is about shooting stuff.

On the other hand, not knowing the stats for a gun potentially for a while both undermines that and encourages metagaming or either having stats memorized or just looking them up on the website xpedia.

That said, I think the concept would be pretty interesting in a similar context/mod.

[Chiefwaffles]

The thing about X-piratez is that stuff like the tech tree jank is 100% a part of its charm. For the most part. I will die mad about needing a fucking staple gun that sometimes one specific npc has in one mission type in order to make progress in very important things. But still.

Overall it makes you feel like you earned what you have, lets you appreciate finding equipment and ammo on missions, and lends to the mentioned civilization bootstrapping theme.

[Robsoie]

A note about xcom files, if you're running into a crash there's a chance it may have been fixed for the next release.
But if your crash prevent you to progress any further, you can download the current state of the mod on github :
https://github.com/SolariusScorch/XComFiles

And replace your current ...\OpenXCOMdirectory\user\mods\XComFiles\   folder

[Salmeuk]

I don't like the X-piratez tech-tree as it feels  bloated and doesn't seem to interface well with mission discoveries.   For example, if I find an old Carbine in a very early game mission I shouldn't then have to  research a sequence of several unrelated things in order to be able to access carbine ammo in the trading market.

 I think the mod would be better if they  entirely scrapped the tech-tree and made all progress driven by mission discoveries, salvaging, lucky events and trading.   Perhaps the same is true of tech-trees in other games.

Politely disagree on this point, at least partially. Not being able to get ammo for a gun you find 'early' is good in my mind as you end up with various 'trump card' options at various points in the game, and for Piratez specifically at least the game is as much about (comedically) bootstrapping a civilization as it is about shooting stuff.

rightly so, I think X-piratez comes from an old-school philosophy that everything needed to understand the game should be within the game. Essentially, if you meet the game halfway and eschew outside wiki's and other sources of knowledge, then you will have a better experience, as part of the game is learning about the various statistics and details and best-fits. Playing X-piratez with the wiki open is kind of the wrong way to play, but there is no such thing... but the game is sort of designed as a closed experience, best enjoyed through failure after failure until you come to terms with the game's harsh reality.

far too often, games are designed with the knowledge that players will seek out these outside sources for optimal patterns of play, and so the designers preemptively account for this outside reference. Usually this means flattening difficulty curves and making every choice "balanced", since by golly we wouldn't want the playerbase always favoring a specific item! That would be awful, giving the players a choice to use a worse item just for the fun or RP value. /s

this strange need in the modern gamer, to play optimally even in single-player experiences, kills whatever jouissance comes from first learning a system, and is quite toxic for early-access games. Everyone is an expert opinion on balance and relative worth, but where does the fun come into the equation? excuse this rant, but X-piratez actually does it right, even though it is a b*tch when it comes to sections of the tech tree.

[Dostoevsky]

New version of X-Piratez was released a few weeks ago, so seems the mod is still trucking away. ModDB link here.

Haven't played it yet, but both the major changes look good--

Fist, more ninja balancing:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

the base that pops up in Year 1 is now a special variant that's much tougher to take down but also far less active. The intention is make the ninjas more 'thorn in your side' and less an immediate campaign-ending threat that you need to tech-rush to deal with reliably.

Second, 'nekomimi' (catgirls) are now playable/recruitable.

[Mathel]

Is it a recent development that final stage of Ninja bases is a 2 parter, or was it in last version too? I only managed to get past the 4 14mm turrets in this version.

[Rolan7]

I'm in September and wow there's a lot of stuff flying around.  Some of it's civilian traffic I haven't dismissed yet, but a lot is presumably the sky ninjas and also megapol I guess.  I'm thinking maybe I should start the air game

(I got this far with moderate autosave-use and by modding the airbus to be undetectable- it doesn't rely on cloak so it should be indistinguishable from other traffic, and only carries 6 people, screwit.  I'm using the Turtle now but I've had to dodge it around enemy patrols a couple times.  The Revolution HQ's ability to randomly spot distant traffic was a lifesaver, but obviously unreliable)

I kinda want to get interceptors because I've had good results with them in the past: fast and deadly, and I don't mind the expense of using missiles and several hangars.  I think I'm still a few weeks away from that though.  I have access to:
Scarab: Tough and magnifies its weapons, but I don't know where to get heavy guns (I have the one Bioplasma Projector, that's it)
Worm: Almost as fast and has 2 LT instead of 1 LT, but frailer and weaker.  I'd keep wanting to use it as a transport too??
All that necroplane stuff:  I've saved up 53 parts which looks like enough to put together a prop plane, but I have no idea how they stand up against sky ninja interceptors

Or I just keep laying "low" until I can assemble normal Interceptors full of expensive but heavy missiles.  I guess I'll do that anyway, but I'll probably get a Scarab to guard my Turtle until then.  I started in Egypt Thebes (the bonus was a sweet surprise and perfect for my peasant-heavy preference!) and the Ninjas are in Canadia, a comfortable distance away.  Except that I built a three-hangar interception base in the Confederacy... within the radar of their first expansion.  I geared it up for base assaults, but nothing yet.  Perhaps because I have only engaged the ninjas AT ALL when saving Lokk'nar, so I'm not triggering retaliation from them.  Yet, heh.

Total aside, but I got a somewhat nasty surprise from the last Ratmen retaliation.  I knew it was ratmen (or Doom) because there wasn't a (visible) craft, so I gave everyone domestic shotguns.  Turns out they adapt for that.  Hooray for always carrying a melee weapon, even if it's just bandit knives, and they're still just ratmen and their animals.

(Even more aside but when has that ever stopped me:  I feel a little bad about doing Ratmen Rodeos and I often skip them.  They're dangerous bandits, but sometimes it feels a bit like a pogrom.  Is it silly to mow down human bandits and then balk at doing the same to beastmen?  Sure, but that's how I feel!  Maybe that's counter-revolutionary of me.  After all, it's like the Alliance says:  "We are all mutants"... that cuts both ways)
tldr;
How can I get more HV craft weapons if I want to use multiple scarabs?
Can necroplane-part fighters stand up to ninja and megapol interceptors?
Can the Worm?

[Dostoevsky]

Is it a recent development that final stage of Ninja bases is a 2 parter, or was it in last version too? I only managed to get past the 4 14mm turrets in this version.

That was prior version -

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

the ninja castles or whatever they're called are, in my opinion, best dealt with via debug mass-kill. The mission seems downright ludicrous and (last I played, at least) they were rather too punishingly active on the world map to leave up. Prior to this version the best way to address ninjas was to take down any and all airfields pronto, preventing any castles from popping up. Which felt kind of dumb, as this was basically actively avoiding content - it's only the castles themselves and the 'defend the general' missions. The other ones are fine.

tldr;
How can I get more HV craft weapons if I want to use multiple scarabs?

My recollection is early on HV weapons are kind of limited outside of codex options. If you're desperate the carronade is the earliest option, but unless you're looting lots of cannonballs from necropirates very much skip. The quadcannon is from Hanna and the 250mm rocket system is an early crafting option... you can also get lucky with gambling I guess, hah.

Can necroplane-part fighters stand up to ninja and megapol interceptors?

With an excellent pilot maybe? The prop planes are pretty fragile, especially against ninja interceptors, and the whole deal with ninja craft is they have really high dodge requiring relatively accurate guns and/or skilled pilot. The weaker megapol craft seem a bit more likely to take down.

I'd probably use the worm over a prop plane; much faster and more durable. The prop planes are meant to be pre-codex, pretty much.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

There is a new-ish 'necro jet' that should be able to, but requires some ninja tech to develop (you're basically making your own version of their jets). That may seem chicken and egg, but with spy missions and more minor ninja missions it's quite possible to learn it without assaulting a ninja airfield, if I recall.

Can the Worm?

A few versions ago the Worm was overtuned and really fast, but looks like it's been taken back down to size a bit. It's a decent interceptor, especially early on, but the gas traps it features on ground are almost more nuisance than benefit - it's easy to forget about them and set them off with your own troops. (There is a way to set them off from inside the craft, at least, though surrounding your craft with smoke is a double-edged sword.)

[Rince Wind]

(Even more aside but when has that ever stopped me:  I feel a little bad about doing Ratmen Rodeos and I often skip them.  They're dangerous bandits, but sometimes it feels a bit like a pogrom.  Is it silly to mow down human bandits and then balk at doing the same to beastmen?  Sure, but that's how I feel!  Maybe that's counter-revolutionary of me.  After all, it's like the Alliance says:  "We are all mutants"... that cuts both ways)

Same, regarding the ratmen.

It sounds like you kill them because they are ratmen, and those are often bandits. And even the lore says they lead criminal lives because they basically have no other choice as no one trusts them.
When you attack bandits you do so because they already commited crimes

[Dostoevsky]

Note that the little on-foot bands you sometimes encounter on the world map are ratmen scouting teams; if they get close to your base they'll often trigger a base assault (i.e. they sell your location to bad folks).

[Salmeuk]

new version has a faster pace than I recall, from a few versions back. unless RNG is blessing me, I have plenty of variety of missions now and my issues re: being forced to complete events has somewhat faded because of this. hopefully I'm not secretly penalized for NOT taking on every goddamn rescue / assault mission I hear about.

so, for 'vehicles' like the hunt party and V8, what is the point of using these low-tech options? Should I be patrolling cross-continent in the first year on foot or something, looking for bases?

And why are there boats when cars can (apparently via wheel-skimming techniques with good throttle control) cross the Mediterranean . . .?

[EuchreJack]

The V8 mostly exists to fill the gap if you lose your starting Bus, and leads to some decent ground vehicles (with turrets).

[Rolan7]

Wow, thanks!
Most of the contacts I was seeing were little copters, apparently scouts of [redacted] (I checked the raws, I do that a lot).  The Scarab with only a double 25mm (no HVs) and highly skilled pilots took them out no problem.  They technically intercepted *me* and fired back but it was mostly like the ratmen ground parties, with their shots failing to penetrate the Scarab's damage reduction.

That Scarab seems to do reasonably well against patrolling Ninjas, and is close to a match to the 3 interceptors that launch from their main base.  Didn't quite win in my test though.  Perhaps if I let the weird HV bio-gun charge up a lot, or added a cannonade, or used the Turtle as a shield (I think that's a thing).

I took down a bandit blimp (they're fragile) and got very fortunate placement for the ground battle - I was able to take out one of its automated guns from the doorways of the Turtle with massed Linux SMG fire!!  It took several turns, probably at least a fifty hits, but damage was getting through and that gradually weakened the armor even without pre-dmg.  I took care of the other automated gun with a mortar after clearing the rest of the map, heh.

I got a Splatty (advanced automatic self-charging laser shotgun) from gambling, and it's obviously very useful.  I only let my damsels use it.  Obviously that limits its usefulness as an assault weapon, but it's very handy on night missions - the damsel blind-fires into the darkness, and the fires tend to reveal foes!  It's also just incredibly deadly even at range.

I feel like I should have completed Back To School earlier than this (October 2601), but I just don't need it quite yet.  I finally kept an Osiron Security alive so I'm finally getting Modern Personal Armor (green tac-suits instead of just vests), and I finally have Hunter-Killers researched.  I joined the Mutant Alliance on Oct first so I still have a few days before I get obligatory pogroms, and having tac-suits would make me feel a whole lot better about them.  I'm set for Earth weapons, LASS/Mortar/HMGs, so I shouldn't be so nervous.  A couple hits can still take out my best Hands for weeks or permanently though, so I really want that armor.

I wish the Reticulan Vats would fire, already.  I made the bounty challenge last month so it should be a matter of luck.    Who needs a gnome mechwarrior when I have damsels, and plenty of revolutionaries (and Theban assault clones) to make the vats a breeze?

new version has a faster pace than I recall, from a few versions back. unless RNG is blessing me, I have plenty of variety of missions now and my issues re: being forced to complete events has somewhat faded because of this. hopefully I'm not secretly penalized for NOT taking on every goddamn rescue / assault mission I hear about.

so, for 'vehicles' like the hunt party and V8, what is the point of using these low-tech options? Should I be patrolling cross-continent in the first year on foot or something, looking for bases?

And why are there boats when cars can (apparently via wheel-skimming techniques with good throttle control) cross the Mediterranean . . .?

Most/all land vehicles are behind Contacts:Tiger Transport, with the lore being that you've contracted their boats to haul your vehicle around.  Don't think about it too much, but it's a cute explanation for an engine limitation hehe.

Some vehicles like hunting parties are undetectable to enemies on the geoscape.  I'm pretty sure that means an Expedition can walk right up to an enemy base.  Sadly I don't think Bikes are undetectable (booo, bikes are so cool and terribad!) and I'm almost positive Convoys do not count, but Convoys have weapons and you get 6 aux slots to an Expedition's 2.
Oh wow, this is a perfect landing position on this poor prepper camp

Spoiler: Oh wow, this is a perfect landing position on this poor prepper camp (click to show/hide)