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[Rolepgeek]

Actually, I have been able to work on Paex, pretty well actually. Just the equipment crunch left, I believe.

Don't worry, Flying Dice; I took Alchemy, I can give you all your splash weapons.

I've been looking over the rules for it, though, and the production looks incredibly inefficient compared to other craft skills. Granted, not as bad as poisonmaking, insofar as that we wouldn't have to kill dozens of high-CR monsters for a single dose, but still. :/

Since we won't be going anywhere tonight, I might see about drawing up a factotum, because that'd be functionally a more versatile skillmonkey.

You read the OP rule changes to crafting, right?

EDIT: Oh, sweet! I just realized I have more skill points than I thought I did!

[GreatWyrmGold]

So do I!

[GreatWyrmGold]

It's just a shame that there are so few splash weapons, and that there is so little written in terms of rules for splash weapons, alchemy, and the like. Hell, just setting up as an alchemist seems to take material from 4-5 books, and that doesn't even cover everything. That's why I stayed away from that part of it. :/

Technically, you can get all that from just the PHB, it's just limited.
And yeah, alchemy and splash weapons are overshadowed by magic. Even at first level, Burning Hands covers a greater area (albeit a smaller range) than alchemist's fire, and Acid Splash has better range than a thrown vial of acid. Moving along, you're still in low levels when you can get Fireball, which completely overshadows them both. They simply aren't practical for long.
And that stinks, because alchemy is neat. But basically anyone who can alchemize (in vanilla) will soon or has access to those lovely AoE spells that render them nigh useless.

((Not to mention that enemies have to be pretty close together for it to be more useful than a thrown club.))

Man, more and more I'm loosing interest in this charbuild. Craft (Alchemy) requires spellcaster levels and is pointlessly inefficient, and Craft (Poisonmaking) is even worse... Might just take a few of the little toys and go for a more traditional build. There are a lot of nice debuffs and Save-or-Xes available, but they aren't very renewable even if you are a caster who for some reason decided to waste xp, gp, and skillpoints on alchemy. :/

One bit of good news: Alchemal items, being non-magical, do not require XP!

[Flying Dice]

Actually, I have been able to work on Paex, pretty well actually. Just the equipment crunch left, I believe.

Don't worry, Flying Dice; I took Alchemy, I can give you all your splash weapons.

I've been looking over the rules for it, though, and the production looks incredibly inefficient compared to other craft skills. Granted, not as bad as poisonmaking, insofar as that we wouldn't have to kill dozens of high-CR monsters for a single dose, but still. :/

Since we won't be going anywhere tonight, I might see about drawing up a factotum, because that'd be functionally a more versatile skillmonkey.

You read the OP rule changes to crafting, right?

EDIT: Oh, sweet! I just realized I have more skill points than I thought I did!

I did, and I totally forgot about them in the past few hours.

Doesn't change all the problems with poisonmaking unless Hans will let that follow the same rules as alchemy (pay 1/3 the price for cost of materials, rather than having to find and harvest enough to make doses). That and making sure it doesn't require spellcaster levels, because I can't find consistent, comprehensive rules on it anywhere. That, and allowing us to make pretty much any alchemical product/poison out there, because a lot of them won't be useful too much farther beyond our starting point, and the ones that are mostly come from errata.

Take, for example, the thunderstone. It's a great thing for lower levels (everything within 10' of the impact point needs to make DC15 Fort or take -4init and 20% chance to miscast anything with a verbal component), and can stay useful against high-level casters. Alchemist's fire, OTOH, is pretty shitty. 1d6 fire damage, 1 fire damage splash, and an additional 1d6 for the target if they fail a DC15 Refl save. That's barely useful at our level, and practically useless later. And then there's the real reason I went for this, Eggshell Grenades, Dust... :3


Yeah, between you and the crafting rules, I'm feeling better about being Batman.

It's just a shame that there are so few splash weapons, and that there is so little written in terms of rules for splash weapons, alchemy, and the like. Hell, just setting up as an alchemist seems to take material from 4-5 books, and that doesn't even cover everything. That's why I stayed away from that part of it. :/

Technically, you can get all that from just the PHB, it's just limited.
And yeah, alchemy and splash weapons are overshadowed by magic. Even at first level, Burning Hands covers a greater area (albeit a smaller range) than alchemist's fire, and Acid Splash has better range than a thrown vial of acid. Moving along, you're still in low levels when you can get Fireball, which completely overshadows them both. They simply aren't practical for long.
And that stinks, because alchemy is neat. But basically anyone who can alchemize (in vanilla) will soon or has access to those lovely AoE spells that render them nigh useless.

There are some saving graces, though. Eggshell Grenades, Dust are 10gp each, and are a ranged touch attack that blinds the target for 1d4 rounds with no save if you hit them, as well as blinding everyone else in a 5' radius for 1 round if they fail a(n admittedly weak) DC10 Fort save.

Aboleth Mucus is 20gp for a Save-or-Die DC19 Fort save. Firestones are 50gp each, and if you target the square an enemy is in, each of them is an automatic 1d6 fire damage, no save, as a ranged attack against AC5. Ferrous Aqua and Powdered Silver are 1d6 plus a DC12 sickness ranged touch against things weak to cold iron or silver. Stonebreaker Acid is 20gp for 5d10 damage that ignores hardness to stone creatures and objects. Torch bug paste is 25gp for a nonmagical faerie fire that negates concealment and reveals invisible creatures.

There's also the bit that all of those things proc sneak attack damage as well.


Hans: Would you be willing to apply the PHB rule on alchemy (1/3 cost of the product for materials, no gathering required) to poisonmaking? That'd be an absolute godsend, because otherwise working in that direction is a waste of time. It'd be all the more fitting, considering that we're a party of evil kobolds. That, and having # ranks in Craft (Poisonmaking) (From CA) should remove the 5% chance to poison yourself.

Additional question: Would you allow the Collar of Perpetual Attendance? It's a ring-slot item that costs 2k gp and grants Unseen Servant at will.

[GreatWyrmGold]

Wait, a collar as a ring-slot item? I would have expected that to be more of a necklace.

[Flying Dice]

Wait, a collar as a ring-slot item? I would have expected that to be more of a necklace.

The item was originally designed as a cat's collar created using Forge Ring and Unseen Servant at CL1; presumably it resizes magically.

Actually, I've got another another question: The Glove of the Master Strategist is explicitly a singular glove in the Hands slot, and as such is not part of a pair. Would it be appropriate to rule that that means that a second single-hand glove/gauntlet could potentially be worn on the off-hand, or are we going to stick to RAW here?

Unrelated: I substituted the ACF Penetrating Strike for Trap Sense, and cannot gain any levels in Trap Sense if I reach the relevant levels in Rogue, as per Dungeonscape 13.

[Hanslanda]

That site has fairly low loading chances for me, but if I just try again it usually works. Also, it's the only conveniently-shareable version of the sourcebooks I have access to.

Also:

Drakruldus is done, I believe.

I've fallen behind on the IC thread (ie, not read any of it yet); can I just jump in (after catching up, of course)?

EDIT: I just realized I never finished figuring out my backstory, or added it to my character sheet. Once Mythweavers isn't too busy, I'll remedy that.

Yes, you can just jump in. I haven't quite moved them forward yet, but I'm about to. You're all going to magically materialize in the Dragon's Den.

Question for Hans: Would you permit Weapon Focus: Splash (-type weapons; the various thrown ranged rouch items)? It seems reasonable, considering that the PHB says that you can take Weapon Focus: Rays.

Also, in the OP, was this a typo?:

•   If you have at least 1 BAB, you can Point Blank Shot with any ranged weapon you are proficient in and are treated as if you have the Point Blank Shot feat without actually taking it. Also see feat section.
•   If you have at least 4 BAB, you can Precise Shot with any ranged weapon you are proficient in and are treated as if you have the Point Blank Shot feat without actually taking it. Also see feat section.

And would you rule that the ranged weapon feats that either just say "Ranged weapons" or specify "thrown weapons" include splash weapons under that umbrella, or no? So for example, would Far Shot increase the range increment on a tanglefoot bag from 10' to 20'?

1. Yes, that is a typo. I believe it should say Precise Shot the second time.
2. Yes and yes.

Also, I didn't realize there were lizardfolk. Hanslanda, if it's alright with you, I'll be coming up with optimized troops for the 'Mount and PMing their stats to you.

I also have the stats for my minions, but I  wondering if I should change their races now, to reflect the races in the Mount.

Yeah, there's really only three intelligent races in the Dragon-Mount, not counting the singular Dragon. Lizardfolk, Dragonkin, Kobolds. I would be delighted if you did so, that would be quite helpful.

You can if you like. The area you are in is... Remarkably homogenous, as far as races go. There's the Dragon-Mount, and then outside of that it's pretty much only humans and a few monster races, like Ogres and Minotaurs and stuff.

Hans: Would you be willing to apply the PHB rule on alchemy (1/3 cost of the product for materials, no gathering required) to poisonmaking? That'd be an absolute godsend, because otherwise working in that direction is a waste of time. It'd be all the more fitting, considering that we're a party of evil kobolds. That, and having # ranks in Craft (Poisonmaking) (From CA) should remove the 5% chance to poison yourself.

Additional question: Would you allow the Collar of Perpetual Attendance? It's a ring-slot item that costs 2k gp and grants Unseen Servant at will.

1. Yes.
2. Yes, you must have 6 ranks to remove the 5% chance. This is absolutely trivial for you at your level as a Rogue, so happy birthday.
3. Link? Found it. I will allow it, as long as you promise not to abuse the power I am giving you.

Actually, I've got another another question: The Glove of the Master Strategist is explicitly a singular glove in the Hands slot, and as such is not part of a pair. Would it be appropriate to rule that that means that a second single-hand glove/gauntlet could potentially be worn on the off-hand, or are we going to stick to RAW here?

You COULD wear a second glove/gauntlet, but all magical gauntlets that are part of a set must be used together otherwise they are like the goggles. They do nothing. So, if the second gauntlet you are trying to use is not an explicitly singular glove, then it does nothing.

[GreatWyrmGold]

But if it was a (singular) Gauntlet of Flaming Punches +2, that would be fine. Which I believe was his question. Well, aside from the specifics.

I'll try to catch up.

[Rolepgeek]

Questions:
Can we get RP bonuses to various skill checks and such? Just like a +2 or so? Like, saying I convince the shopkeeper of the important of our quest, diplomancy style versus:

Paex grins, his lips pulling back to reveal dessicated gums, as he hears the merchant's headstrong refusal to let them into his basement. "Now, friend," he says, striding up to the counter and hopping onto a stool to get onto an equal heading with the man, "I can certainly understand why you might be reluctant to allow me and my esteemed colleagues into your under-establishment. But we seek to do no ill! I'm sure you've heard lots of stories about kobolds, their treachery and conniving ways, their cunning and malevolence, but above all...their loyalty to the Great Wyrms. We are on a task for the Great Wyrm, one which involves purging the vaults below your shop of their rather dangerous inhabitants. To do anything whatsoever to harm your merchandise or well-being is to the opposite of our interest; we seek to kill the ferocious rat-beasts now below our feet only so that we can keep this town safe; it provides a valuable trading post for our wares, and you, as the merchant, are most important of all! If you could allow usdown there, to slay those vicious creatures for you, it would be the kindest of blessings. We are, after all, only trying to help..."

Also, does being undead make me immune to fear effects? And if it does, could I forego that immunity? And if I can't, can we please acknowledge that in the levels before I become a Necropolitan, I could have been subjected to a fear effect and failed my save?(I want to become a Dread Witch, and also a Nightmare Spinner)

[Flying Dice]

Question for Hans: Would you permit Weapon Focus: Splash (-type weapons; the various thrown ranged rouch items)? It seems reasonable, considering that the PHB says that you can take Weapon Focus: Rays.

Also, in the OP, was this a typo?:

•   If you have at least 1 BAB, you can Point Blank Shot with any ranged weapon you are proficient in and are treated as if you have the Point Blank Shot feat without actually taking it. Also see feat section.
•   If you have at least 4 BAB, you can Precise Shot with any ranged weapon you are proficient in and are treated as if you have the Point Blank Shot feat without actually taking it. Also see feat section.

And would you rule that the ranged weapon feats that either just say "Ranged weapons" or specify "thrown weapons" include splash weapons under that umbrella, or no? So for example, would Far Shot increase the range increment on a tanglefoot bag from 10' to 20'?

1. Yes, that is a typo. I believe it should say Precise Shot the second time.
2. Yes and yes.

Hans: Would you be willing to apply the PHB rule on alchemy (1/3 cost of the product for materials, no gathering required) to poisonmaking? That'd be an absolute godsend, because otherwise working in that direction is a waste of time. It'd be all the more fitting, considering that we're a party of evil kobolds. That, and having # ranks in Craft (Poisonmaking) (From CA) should remove the 5% chance to poison yourself.

Additional question: Would you allow the Collar of Perpetual Attendance? It's a ring-slot item that costs 2k gp and grants Unseen Servant at will.

1. Yes.
2. Yes, you must have 6 ranks to remove the 5% chance. This is absolutely trivial for you at your level as a Rogue, so happy birthday.
3. Link? Found it. I will allow it, as long as you promise not to abuse the power I am giving you.

Actually, I've got another another question: The Glove of the Master Strategist is explicitly a singular glove in the Hands slot, and as such is not part of a pair. Would it be appropriate to rule that that means that a second single-hand glove/gauntlet could potentially be worn on the off-hand, or are we going to stick to RAW here?

You COULD wear a second glove/gauntlet, but all magical gauntlets that are part of a set must be used together otherwise they are like the goggles. They do nothing. So, if the second gauntlet you are trying to use is not an explicitly singular glove, then it does nothing.

1. Thanks for the clarification.
2. Thank you, thank you, and all praises to you! I solemnly swear that I am up to no good will abuse this power for fun and profit will remember my Spiderman morality.
3. That's exactly what I thought the case would be; I wanted to know just on the off chance that I find/get the chance to buy such an item.

One further question: RAW for Stances in the ToB state that level one ToB characters can only take level one stances (by saying that they "begin play" with 1st level stances), but a lot of the RAI I've seen while researching suggest that a character who later multiclasses into a ToB class says that you can take any stance that would be allowed to a character with a ToB class level equal to your character level. What's your stance on this? I'm sort of torn between the two interpretations, and it's just a vague option that would be several levels away if I do go for it. Either way it wouldn't affect my character terribly much.

...

Okay, that pun was absolutely terrible and I am a terrible person for posting it.

[Taricus]

You only get "half" initiator levels from fighter if I remember correctly. If not, it's likely half from all classes. Though the longer you wait, you end up missing out on a lot of the more powerful manoeuvres.

[Rolepgeek]

Correct, however, sometimes it's because you want a dip. Like a one-level dip for Assassin's Stance as a Glaivelock.

[Hanslanda]

Questions:
Can we get RP bonuses to various skill checks and such? Just like a +2 or so?

Also, does being undead make me immune to fear effects? And if it does, could I forego that immunity? And if I can't, can we please acknowledge that in the levels before I become a Necropolitan, I could have been subjected to a fear effect and failed my save?(I want to become a Dread Witch, and also a Nightmare Spinner)

 

Yes, if you do it well enough. Take note that you can also receive anti-bonuses of the same form if you roleplay poorly or if you know... You're an undead monster race trying to convince some Joe Schmo Shopkeeper to sell/buy shit.

Spoiler: Undead Type (click to show/hide)

An undead creature possesses the following traits (unless otherwise noted in a creature’s entry).
•No Constitution score.
•Darkvision out to 60 feet.
•Immunity to all mind-affecting effects (charms, compulsions, phantasms, patterns, and morale effects).
•Immunity to poison, sleep effects, paralysis, stunning, disease, and death effects.
•Not subject to critical hits, nonlethal damage, ability drain, or energy drain. Immune to damage to its physical ability scores (Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution), as well as to fatigue and exhaustion effects.
•Cannot heal damage on its own if it has no Intelligence score, although it can be healed. Negative energy (such as an inflict spell) can heal undead creatures. The fast healing special quality works regardless of the creature’s Intelligence score.
•Immunity to any effect that requires a Fortitude save (unless the effect also works on objects or is harmless).
•Uses its Charisma modifier for Concentration checks.
•Not at risk of death from massive damage, but when reduced to 0 hit points or less, it is immediately destroyed.
•Not affected by raise dead and reincarnate spells or abilities. Resurrection and true resurrection can affect undead creatures. These spells turn undead creatures back into the living creatures they were before becoming undead.
•Proficient with its natural weapons, all simple weapons, and any weapons mentioned in its entry.
•Proficient with whatever type of armor (light, medium, or heavy) it is described as wearing, as well as all lighter types. Undead not indicated as wearing armor are not proficient with armor. Undead are proficient with shields if they are proficient with any form of armor.
•Undead do not breathe, eat, or sleep.

Unless otherwise noted in the Necropolitan template section, this is the case.  What's the Prerequisites for Dread Witch?

But if it was a (singular) Gauntlet of Flaming Punches +2, that would be fine. Which I believe was his question. Well, aside from the specifics.

I'll try to catch up.

Yep.

You only get "half" initiator levels from fighter if I remember correctly. If not, it's likely half from all classes. Though the longer you wait, you end up missing out on a lot of the more powerful manoeuvres.

This, to F_D's question.

1. Thanks for the clarification.
2. Thank you, thank you, and all praises to you! I solemnly swear that I am up to no good will abuse this power for fun and profit will remember my Spiderman morality.
3. That's exactly what I thought the case would be; I wanted to know just on the off chance that I find/get the chance to buy such an item.

You guys are GETTING A LOT OF CANDY YOU KNOW. But it's okay. Things will get different once you leave the Dragon-Mount. You've got an entire pre-built society dedicated to building you into god-like badasses here. Once you leave, you're in ENEMY territory. Or at least Significantly-Not-Happy-To-See-You-Territory. And humans? Humans are Medium sized. This will be very relevant later.

[Rolepgeek]

Well, the one I'm worried about, is that you must have suffered at least one fear effect against which you failed your save. And also they have a class ability where they get more powerful when affected by things that would frighten them. Though, they gain the bonus even if they make the save, so I suppose immunity might work like that.

Additionally, could Horrific Aura simply extend my Fear aura as a Dread Necromancer?

ALSO: How the hell did he have a +15 level check? Jesus.

ALSOEDIT: Also, It was just an example. I would (First off) be disguised, probably lying out my ass, and if that didn't work, the Big Reveal.

Speaking of which, in non-combat situations, does my Fear Aura give me a bonus to Intimidate checks?

[Hanslanda]

Well, the one I'm worried about, is that you must have suffered at least one fear effect against which you failed your save. And also they have a class ability where they get more powerful when affected by things that would frighten them. Though, they gain the bonus even if they make the save, so I suppose immunity might work like that.

Additionally, could Horrific Aura simply extend my Fear aura as a Dread Necromancer?

ALSO: How the hell did he have a +15 level check? Jesus.

Yeah, we can assume you failed a fear effect once. Immunity means you never have to attempt a save, you auto-succeed and never suffer negative affects of that type, so it would function like you passed your save.

Yes, but remember, Horrific Aura is not effective against anything with more than 6 HD which is like... A LOT of the shit you will be fighting. Just a heads up.

I deliberately screwed the math up. It says 'The Character's Level or HD..." And I sort of used both. But hey, he IS a Dragonkin Champion, seeing as how he was at the conclave.