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Have few types but with many possible functions for each.  The simpler option

38 (42.2%)

Have many different types that each takes a particular input, for long assembly lines

29 (32.2%)

Have many types, allow using the wrong ones, but using them correctly lets the items have quality levels

23 (25.6%)

Total Members Voted: 69

[IndigoFenix]

Wow, some good ideas here, keep them coming.  Many are impossible as suggested but could still be expanded upon.

'Gnomish oculus' sounds like an interesting idea.  Although at the moment they can use cheap, mass-produced clockwork beetles to guard the perimeter, this can cause framerate issues if you make too many, so I might make them a little more expensive and come up with a different lookout method.

Gingerbread men.    Ehh... not really what I had in mind by nature magic.  I was thinking more like... hmm, is there a way of spawning a whole bunch of friendly animals at the edge of the map?  Calling upon Gaia's Vengeance would be cool.  Turning animals sentient could also be thematically appropriate, although I don't think it would be especially useful. unless you wanted a bear as the mayor or something.  Maybe spawning 'illusion' animals that couldn't do damage but would distract enemies...

Gnomes are currently [GOOD], although the idea of dark gnomes suggests that they can go either way.  Is there any actual effect for making a civilized race [GOOD] or [EVIL]?

I've never heard the term 'gear punk', but yeah, that describes them a little better.  Most of their current machines are clockwork based, with only a little bit of steam-powered stuff.  The idea of making them not require fuel is certainly thematically interesting, although if so there will need to be some other method of limiting their production.  Maybe once powered workshops come out they can get those as an alternate smelting/metalworking method.  As for the vegetarian thing... well, I'll try it out and see if it makes the game better or worse.

As for castes, currently there are 21 basic castes for gnomes (each divided into male and female), one for each kind of craft ('craft' meaning a job where higher skill = higher quality items).  They don't gain extra skill leveling for working in their craft, but they are born with an innate affinity for it, so children should work in them (with 20 year childhoods, it'll be good to have the kids be useful for something).  There are also two special castes: an 'angry gnome' caste that has no innate skills, but is naturally prone to rage, has a very high anger level, and is alcoholic...good fighters, but also quite prone to going berserk, and a 'mad gnome' caste who has high creativity and learns skills quickly, but is usually the first to go stark raving mad when things start to go to pieces.  Also clockborgs, but they shouldn't show up unless you make them.

I'll see about the manual.  Speaking of which, how do you make the workshops look so good?  Is there some utility that lets you design workshops in accordance with the raw format and lets you view them with the tileset?

[shadowclasper]

Well, could you make some kind of power giving structure that can only be built on rocks? We just SAY they're taking power from hooking up to swaying trees, but in actuallity it's just a boulder on the surface with a gear linkage put under it?

Is it possible to make a power providing building that counts as a construction, not a building? So building destroyers would ignore it? If so, we have our 'hidden' power generator on the surface.

And also I -know- it's possible to have both digging soil and rock seperately. Kobolds do it with shovels v. picks. You just have it so that gnomes can't get picks until mid game. Same for a trading post. Gnomes are secretive. They probably aren't the trading type. They grow their own metals from seeds they can 'craft' in special machines perhaps (like a millstone).

Just curious. Don't we already kinda sort have powered workshops in the form of a millstone? We just change the output and input for it surely? Or is the millstone one of those weird, uneditable hard-coded things?

I don't suppose there's a way to make a special sort of bridge is there? One that can only be built 1x1? so that it's basically a wall that goes up and down? That way we have our 'hidden doors' made of rough stone or clay or something?

[Nahere]

And also I -know- it's possible to have both digging soil and rock seperately. Kobolds do it with shovels v. picks.

No, they don't. They had shovels, but the only reason they couldn't dig stone was because making kobolds playable also made all stone undiggable in a world. The only difference between any two digging items are their size and their attacks. Now they have neither shovels or picks, but can steal picks as a mid to late-game reaction.


Also constructions are hardcoded. So is power, for that matter, but a DFhack plugin is being worked on for that.

[Meph]

No worries about the Gingerbread men. I just saw them in the raws and was like: That does sound like some goofy gimmick. Not necessary to add them.

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=54004.0 => Utility for workshops. Its awesome. Does size, build states (1-3), colors with preview in different tilesets... please design them with the default tileset, because thats what most people will use. If you want any buildings designed, I am more than used to doing that. I have probably done ~500 by now, about 250 of which are in the mod.

I would almost say: Make all of them require power. Now that would result in interesting windfarms and river-embarks. ^^ Once Warmist is done, you might give high-end workshops very high power amounts as well, so 20 windmills just to power your Colossus-Chop-Shop or whatever.

Kobolds were able to dig only soil, because the entire world was build around them. You cant do that if you want multiple races.

GOOD/EVIL is not important for races, except that they can make sites in these biomes in worldgen. Might be harder/easier to have more/less sites, depending on the map you play on. They also take 30 times damage from the Moonsilver and Shadesilver in the mod. Moonsilver is good against evil, Shadesilver is good against good creatures. There are also 2 special poisons.

[shadowclasper]

Well dang. That sucks :S Ah well.

[Meph]

Suggestion:

A bear-pet with natural fisher skill. This is the only labor that works on pets, so you can make bears that fish for you.

Adding prone-to-rage to wildlife should make them attack invaders and ambushes, but not your "at peace with wildlife" gnomes. At least I think that this should work. Not sure about your pets though.

[Teneb]

Gnomes are currently [GOOD], although the idea of dark gnomes suggests that they can go either way.  Is there any actual effect for making a civilized race [GOOD] or [EVIL]?-

This made me think: should evil races have good counterparts?

[shadowclasper]

Gnomes are currently [GOOD], although the idea of dark gnomes suggests that they can go either way.  Is there any actual effect for making a civilized race [GOOD] or [EVIL]?-

This made me think: should evil races have good counterparts?

what? Like Saints to Warlocks? Storm Giants to Frost Giants? One might argue that gnomes are the counter parts to goblins?

[Meph]

I dont think that we should do counterparts. I already have the evil twins in the mod (copies of humans, elves, dwarves and drow that have babysnatcher), and I am playing with the idea of deleting them. Or giving them more ... of an identity. They are rather boring I have to admit.

[shadowclasper]

Well what if you put them all into the 'Bandit' category? A big old pirate/bandit alliance type deal? Outcastes or something?

[IndigoFenix]

Suggestion:

A bear-pet with natural fisher skill. This is the only labor that works on pets, so you can make bears that fish for you.

Nice one.  Probably should be one of the small utility pets though.  Do they need to be able to speak for it to work?

[mensrea]

So if Meph has demonstrated successfully that you can make a building (the arbalest) fire at things, then what about building based turrets? Or for that matter, building based turrets that need to be powered to work? Seems like a bunch of clockwork turrets would be sufficiently gnomey, and perhaps they would be far superior to the mobile dwarven counterparts.

[shadowclasper]

specialized ammo for clockwork weaponry would be pretty cool.

Again, things that emphasize the whole 'strike hard and fast and kill/incapacitate in the first blow' would be good. So shot that produces dust, or web, or similar might be things to load into an arbalest like device.

I have no idea if they can be made to need power though.

[Meph]

Meph has demonstrated successfully that you can make a building (the arbalest) fire at things, then what about building based turrets? Or for that matter, building based turrets that need to be powered to work?

The Arbalest is fake, the dwarven worker shoots, not the building. But Warmist is working on the second, its almost finished.

[IndigoFenix]

DFHack is awesome.

Just started coding it and I'm nearly done with my first script: constructCreature, which lets you construct a creature in a workshop that directly incorporates one or more reagent materials into its own body.  I'm using it for clockworks, but it's also perfect for animated weapons and golems.  The only problem now is making their colors show up differently depending on the material they're composed of.  No idea how to pull that off, haha...

I haven't tested it out yet, but it might even be possible to get a creature to ride another creature (no idea what that would do for pathfinding though.)  Summoning creatures from the wild and releasing them are definitely doable.  Or exiling civ members by classifying them as wild animals...

Too...many...ideas...going...mad...with...power...