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[Urist McTeellox]

Hallelujah for the caste showing, though I'd still be checking the Uruk/Ronin strengths because if they're 'weak' or lower I name them 'Weakhearts' and treat them like dirt.

It's worth noting that 'weak for an uruk' can still be quite strong for an orc! Orcs have an average strength of about 2500, whereas even the weakest Uruk will have a strength of 2000. Plus Uruks have a larger body size, which I know makes some differences to combat.

And snagas are incredibly agile compared to everything else, having abut twice the agility of your typical orc/uruk. I don't know what that means for combat optimisation; I suspect pointy things (so they can focus whatever strength they have into an impale), but I'm guessing that if they were trained well in dodge they'd be darn hard to hit.

~ T

[Gamerlord]

I never use combat snaga. It just seems so... insulting to my Uruk Clan Champions.

[Urist McTeellox]

I'm currently looking at getting orcish sorcs to be less spammy with their 'bone plates' buff. Right now it triggers every 3000 ticks (causing a combat event), and lasts for 1000 ticks. So 1/3 of the time the buff will be up, and otherwise it'll be down.

I'm looking at changing it so that it triggers once, and is permanent (although if it's removed somehow, sorcs will be able to re-cast). To keep the current balance, it'll provide 1/3 of the boost it did previously. (333 toughness boost, rather than 1000).

This will also reduce spam from warlock traders.

~ T

[Gamerlord]

Whoooooo! That is finally getting taken care off!

[Meph]

A suggestion for the combat spam:

Give their blood the syndrome that gives them the interaction:boneplates. Dreamwalker gets injured, covered in own blood, speaks boneplate-spell. Later, he will heal, clean himself up, and stop doing the interaction. This way he will only do the combat-log entries while being in combat. The boneplates themselves could be altered slightly, for example using  [CE_MATERIAL_FORCE_MULTIPLIER:MAT_MULT:NONE:NONE:1:2], which reduces all incoming damage by 50%. Its stronger then before, but obviously would be used less.

[Urist McTeellox]

Give their blood the syndrome that gives them the interaction:boneplates. Dreamwalker gets injured, covered in own blood, speaks boneplate-spell. Later, he will heal, clean himself up, and stop doing the interaction. This way he will only do the combat-log entries while being in combat. The boneplates themselves could be altered slightly, for example using  [CE_MATERIAL_FORCE_MULTIPLIER:MAT_MULT:NONE:NONE:1:2], which reduces all incoming damage by 50%. Its stronger then before, but obviously would be used less.

Oh my goodness, that's brilliant. There's potential for a few 'injured in combat' reactions for the orc spellcasters.

Are there any dwarves or other critters that already do this? Being able to look at an example first would be grand.

~ T

[Meph]

There are two ways: Either you just add the syndrome that gives the interaction in the creature file directly, which would mean that all creatures of that caste have it (I dont have raw example for that), or you make it the complicated way. For which I do have raws, thanks to Roses.

Code: [Select]

[INORGANIC:TEACH_SPELL_EARTH_STONESKIN]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STONE_VAPOR_TEMPLATE]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL_SOLID:blinding flash of light]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:LIQUID:molten failure stone]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:GAS:blinding light]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_CLASS:\AUTO_SYNDROME]
[CE_BODY_MAT_INTERACTION:MAT_TOKEN:RESERVED_BLOOD:START:0]
[CE:SYNDROME_TAG:SYN_CONTACT]
[CE_CAN_DO_INTERACTION:START:0:END:10000]
[CDI:INTERACTION:SPELL_EARTH_STONESKIN]
[CDI:TARGET:C:SELF_ALLOWED]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Stoneskin]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:C:20]
[CDI:USAGE_HINT:GREETING]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:C:1]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:3]
This is fancy, because its an inorganic that is produced in a workshop. The inorganic will add the syndrome to the blood of the worker. Thats this part: [CE_BODY_MAT_INTERACTION:MAT_TOKEN:RESERVED_BLOOD:START:0]. So instead of learning anything, the worker gets something in his blood, which can teach him, as soon as he is covered in his own blood. As you can see he can do Stoneskin for 10000 ticks, (END:10000). Thats about one ingame week. 33600 is one month. The example spell would be on himself, and every ally in 1 tile-area (thats what the HINT:GREETING is for).

Hope this helps.

I had this lying around, because I wanted to convert my own mages with exactly this, but havent gotten around to it yet. The white/black mages seem to be expensive/rare enough, that no one complained about the spam yet.

EDIT: To One-Up that: Make the USAGE_HINT:FLEEING in an interaction that the creature only gets when injured, and you will have an interaction that will only be triggered, if the creature is covered in blood, losing a battle, and decides to flee. Could be a NOPAIN and CRAZED berserker thing. ^^

[Meph]

Another thing: Do you have any inclination of adding the battlecry system to orcs?

In case you have no clue what the heck I am talking about: Dwarves have a couple of interactions, which look like this:

Code: [Select]

YESBATTLECRY[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:BATTLECRY_HUMAN]
YESBATTLECRY[CDI:ADV_NAME:Battlecry (human)]
YESBATTLECRY[CDI:TARGET:A:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
YESBATTLECRY[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:A:2]
YESBATTLECRY[CDI:USAGE_HINT:ATTACK]
YESBATTLECRY[CDI:VERBAL]
YESBATTLECRY[CDI:VERBAL_SPEECH:battlecry_dwarf_human.txt]
YESBATTLECRY[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1]
YESBATTLECRY[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:903]
The odd wording in it is this: CDI:VERBAL_SPEECH:battlecry_dwarf_human.txt. This means that they dont use a normal VERB that is declared in the interaction, but instead a random line from the battlecry_dwarf_human.txt. And its content looks like this:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Code: [Select]

The dwarf yells: You're not so tough!
The dwarf yells: Who are you calling short?
The dwarf yells: Beer and blood!
The dwarf yells: Tromping all over like a big ole elephant...now you die!
The dwarf yells: Humans. All talk and no action. I'll give you action!
The dwarf yells: Not so high-and-mighty now, are we?
The dwarf yells: Guns. Cowards..... wait, we can make guns too.
The dwarf yells: Oh, look at me, I'm a human. Prancing around in rose gold, no beard and all, with piss smelling like flowers.
The dwarf yells: We will never be part of your Empire. Sod off!
The dwarf yells: How did you guys even figure out how to make steel? A disgrace.
The dwarf yells: Humans, kill them!
The dwarf yells: These are brave men knocking on our doorstep. I say Lets go out and kill them!
The dwarf yells: Human, I'll chop your legs off, then we can find eye to eye.
The dwarf yells: Your muskets wont help you now!
The dwarf yells: Beer and blood!
The dwarf yells: You will regret the day you left your mothers womb!
The dwarf yells: Taste my axe. Regarldess of me actually wielding an axe or not.
The dwarf yells: By Armoks beard, today is not your day, believe me.
The dwarf yells: You and your tiny bollocks can crawl back into the hole they come from.
The dwarf yells: Losing if fun? FUN? I will show you fun!
The dwarf yells: You will not leave alive.
The dwarf yells: You cheeky bastard, think you can just walk in here. Not today.
The dwarf yells: What do we say to the god of death?
The dwarf yells: Now thats a shady figure. What are you supposed to be?
The dwarf yells: Hey, you! Yeah, you dodgy scamp. Think you can just get away with this?
The dwarf yells: Hey you nutter, come and get some!
The dwarf yells: What an idiot. What a dirty, little, buffle-brained bastard. I gonna shove his poxed weapons up his poxed arse! That twat!
The dwarf yells: Are you gonna cock-up the rest of that little invasion of your's too?
The dwarf yells: Blimey, you are a big fella. Have to chop you up at the knees, do I?
The dwarf yells: I gonna give you one on your bobbin, see how you like that!
The dwarf yells: You cack-handed fool. Watch how a real fighter does it. But be careful, I will only to it once.
The dwarf yells: Stop cocking about and come here, you bastard!
The dwarf yells: Gobshite! Another one!
The dwarf yells: Hey, you wanker. Get over here!
The dwarf yells: Move your arse over here! Or are you afraid of someone half your size?
The dwarf yells: Dont be such a fanny. Afraid, are we?

The interaction can only be done by a dwarf, and only targets a human. I wrote these for every sapient race in the mod. So a dwarf can identify a threat and make a comment, fitting to the type of enemy he faces. I also wrote one set for each invader, so that they can threaten dwarves. A lot of the speech files is copy+pasting, but its a super neat way of adding easter eggs, or giving creatures more character. You can even do caste-specific ones, and very easily at that. You simply run the speech file through an online "accent converter" and make it cockney or welsh or pirate-speech. And then you can add this to each caste. Suddenly all corsairs speak welsh, all uruks speak redneck, all normal orcs speak without accent.

It has no gameplay or balance changes, but its very easy to mod, and has a lot of potential for lore and atmosphere building. I always wanted to make some kind of community thread about it, and have people collect these. ^^

[Urist McTeellox]

This is fancy, because its an inorganic that is produced in a workshop. The inorganic will add the syndrome to the blood of the worker. Thats this part: [CE_BODY_MAT_INTERACTION:MAT_TOKEN:RESERVED_BLOOD:START:0]. So instead of learning anything, the worker gets something in his blood, which can teach him, as soon as he is covered in his own blood. As you can see he can do Stoneskin for 10000 ticks, (END:10000). Thats about one ingame week. 33600 is one month. The example spell would be on himself, and every ally in 1 tile-area (thats what the HINT:GREETING is for).

That's pretty neat, thank you! I'm using the simple change to the buff right now, but I'd love to incorporate blood-syndrome changes after I'm done with milestone 1.

Another thing: Do you have any inclination of adding the battlecry system to orcs?

I don't have any objections to it, but I'm not likely to add any cosmetic changes of this sort until after all the functional ones are in.  I like the idea, though, and certainly don't mind contributions.

In other news, the REACTION_CLASS for building materials worked great!  All the orcish 'industry' buildings can now be made from either iron, steel, or the rusted variants thereof.

I've also changed all the buildings to use the ARCHITECTURE labour (just like dwarves).

~ T

[Meph]

I've also changed all the buildings to use the ARCHITECTURE labour (just like dwarves).

Orcish BUILDING_DESIGNERs have nothing to do otherwise? That was the reason I did this for dwarves, because I didnt have any jobs for Architects.

Btw, building can have multiple build labors, so you could add both. ARCHITECT and the one that they used before.

[Urist McTeellox]

Orcish BUILDING_DESIGNERs have nothing to do otherwise?

Well, that, but mostly because I find that needing a citizen with labour 'x' enabled to construct a building gets in the way, and adds little to gameplay. Plus this means one could have a specialised civil engineer if one really wants beautifully designed buildings.

A question to everyone:

I'm looking through some of the damasc workshop reactions. They can create one bag of powered mithril from a single boulder with REACTION_CLASS:MITHRIL, but they can also create a bag from '900 units' of mithril bars, which is *six* bars. My understanding is that one boulder (after ore processing and smelting) normally yields four bars.

So, is this:

(a) me missing something obvious
(b) intentional, to make damasc reactions cheaper if one's dug the ore oneself, rather than smelted down elflinite
(c) a mistake, and the damasc workshop should only require four bars of mithril to grind to one bag of powder

Many thaks again!

~ T

[Gamerlord]

Hey Teell, did you add that fix for not being able to gen taiga orc worlds into the main version?

[Meph]

I dont think it was intentional. Its 4 bars to a boulder, so you might as well standardize the two reactions. In the other hand, its not such a big deal, just a minor oddity.

[Urist McTeellox]

Hey Teell, did you add that fix for not being able to gen taiga orc worlds into the main version?

If by 'main version', you mean SWP, then yes.   (And that particular bug shouldn't exist in the official 4g; at least I hope not!)

You should be able grab just the changes and be fine. (You can unzip that over a 4g release, or a copy of SWP based upon 4g)

I dont think it was intentional. Its 4 bars to a boulder, so you might as well standardize the two reactions. In the other hand, its not such a big deal, just a minor oddity.

Sweet! I'll go standardize it, if not for any reason to prevent some other poor person stumbling across it and wondering why things are set up that way.

~ T

[Meph]

I know that orcs have a little japanese touch, with katanas and such. It seems to fall short a bit under the raiders, pirates and clan features. I had to think of it, when I saw this in the mod releases: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=135172.0 Its a mod that adds all kinds of japanese weaponry. Maybe you can add a workshop for this. "The honourable forge of the East" or something. Just a suggestion.