Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[megahelmet]

I vote for either throwing blades (It'd be really cool if they had some kind of javelin type weapon, with a rope so they could hit figures and pull them in. But I doubt that can be programmed in).

Bolos with a stun mechanic (they release a tiny dust cloud upon impact)

I'm a huge fan of the bolas. They already use throw and whip skill so great for ghouls. They are among my personal favorite weapons. Good at both range and melee. Not excellent, but good enough. I don't think they need to release dust clouds. My dwarven bola squads usually stop gobbos (and especially warlocks) dead in their tracks with bolas. They chip bones frequently. (And if made out of high quality materials, dismember unarmored bits like hands and feet.

Bolas should definitely be an option to craft. Although, back on the dust cloud thing...cool enchantments for bolas are a plus :p

But warlock bolas could definitely be a great deal more...twisted. Good races, use them for hunting, or for defense. Warlocks use ghouls that scour the land for more...parts. What would a bola used by ghoul look like? It might not even be built, but grown. Unnatural twisted strands of nether creeper with thorn barbs, dripping in poison that increases pain and causes bloody wounds that remain open, gaping, and oozing blood. 

It's not enough to just gather resources. For the warlocks, they need to know those resources died screaming.

[Grimmash]

This may be crazy, but the idea of skeletons or ghouls having non-biological ranged weapons seems really odd to me.  They are mostly mindless beasts, so having a ranged attack that is more than pickig up and throwing a rock seems a bit contrived.  I see skeletons as a bone shield, and ghouls like raging berserkers that are a bit tougher to kill.  Especially if warlocks end up getting spells.  I would envision a warlock army consisting of hordes of skellies and ghoules charging in while a necro or two stand back, hurling spells into the battlefield without a care for who gets hit on either side, and reanimating the fallen in the thick of the fighting to overcome the lack of quality of their troops.

Just my 2 urists, though.

[Meph]

Skeleton Archers are a thing in fantasy, thats why I took them. Handling swords and shields is not more or less complex than a bow. But I too cant see Ghouls using finesse. The problem is the hunting AI, I cant tell them to hunt with melee. Guess hunting will be disabled, and people hunt with the military, as it should be. That solves that problem.

Warlock spells are a thing now. About 50 of them.

The other issue I found is that creatures spawned with dfhack dont use interactions. Not a big deal with skeletons and ghouls, but I noticed non-exploding landmines, non-firing turrets, non-corpse-resurrecting Monoliths. 

But I found a way to add spawned units into the military. Might cause crashes, but thats what the Alpha Release is for.

[DoX]

A thousand of the bloodiest curses of Armok on hard coded elements!

Ah well. It was a good dream. I'd still love to see organic ranged attacks through the magic system, at least. Miasma breath and poison spit.

Okay. We can't change the weapons. Dag. So, we'll have to change the units!

Some sort of building/magic that turns ghouls into fiends? Smaller, weaker creatures that can use bows and bolas?

A way of re-assembling skeletons into skeleton archers? Like, one of their arms has an in-build bone bow?

Edit: Just read the post above. Ah well, hunting through the military seems like a good solution. Shouldn't be that huge an issue, given the amount of sieges/ambushes Warlocks will attract. Plenty of bones and blood!

[Meph]

No matter how much I take away in forms of ranged weapons: As soon as goblins, orcs, elves or anyone else with crossbows and bows come by, you will have access to them, and your soldiers will be able to use them, and your hunters will forcibly take them.

Miasma attacks are kind a pointless, because miasma only makes bad thoughts in civ members. Nothing else. But a miasma-named attack with syndromes can be done... but not real miasma.
And something else:I just found out that units spawned with spawnunit dont use interactions.

EDIT:Fixed it.

Two solutions: Teach the creature the interaction, or transform the creature once.

First inorganic spawns a Monolith. It doesnt use any of its own interactions. Second inorganic teaches a monolith on the workshop the very same interactions again. A wonder happens. They use them. Third inorganic transforms the monolith generic into monolith generic2, literally the same creature, just a different caste. No difference between castes either. Still, it fixes it. The spawned monolith caste does not do interactions, but the transformed caste does use them.

Code: [Select]

[INORGANIC:MONOLITH_SPAWN]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STONE_VAPOR_TEMPLATE]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL:Build a monolith]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_CLASS:\AUTO_SYNDROME]
[SYN_CLASS:\COMMAND]
[SYN_CLASS:spawn][SYN_CLASS:MONOLITH][SYN_CLASS:0][SYN_CLASS:Monolith][SYN_CLASS:\LOCATION]

[INORGANIC:MONOLITH_TEACH]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STONE_VAPOR_TEMPLATE]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL:Teach a monolith]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_CLASS:\AUTO_SYNDROME]
[SYN_CLASS:\ALLOW_MULTIPLE_TARGETS]
[SYN_CLASS:\ALLOW_NONWORKER_TARGETS]
      [CE_CAN_DO_INTERACTION:PROB:100:START:0]
         [CDI:INTERACTION:RAISE_CORPSE_MONOLITH]
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Animate corpse]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:A:10]
[CDI:TARGET:A:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1]
[CDI:VERB:hum:hums:NA]
[CDI:TARGET_VERB:shudder and begin to move:shudders and begins to move]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:100]

[INORGANIC:MONOLITH_TRANSFORM]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:STONE_VAPOR_TEMPLATE]
[STATE_NAME_ADJ:ALL:Transform a Monolith]
[SYNDROME]
[SYN_CLASS:\AUTO_SYNDROME]
[SYN_CLASS:\ALLOW_MULTIPLE_TARGETS]
[SYN_CLASS:\ALLOW_NONWORKER_TARGETS]
[SYN_AFFECTED_CREATURE:MONOLITH:GENERIC]
[CE_BODY_TRANSFORMATION:PROB:100:START:0]
[CE:CREATURE:MONOLITH:GENERIC2]
For completions sake: The creature file.

Code: [Select]

[CREATURE:MONOLITH]
[DESCRIPTION:A black monolith. It seems to hum in a frequency just below hearing. Tendrils of green smoky light search the area around it, gently touching and probing its surroundings for anything that once hold a spark of light, animating it to eternal unlife.]
[NAME:black monolith:black monoliths:black monolith]
[CASTE_NAME:black monolith:black monoliths:black monolith]
[CREATURE_TILE:244][COLOR:3:0:0]
[FREQUENCY:0][CANNOT_UNDEAD][BENIGN]
[EVIL]
[FIREIMMUNE][WEBIMMUNE][MAGMA_VISION]
[SMALL_REMAINS][NOT_BUTCHERABLE][IMMOBILE]
[NO_DRINK][NO_EAT][NO_SLEEP][NOPAIN][EXTRAVISION][NO_FEVERS]
[NOBREATHE][NOSTUN][NONAUSEA][NOEMOTION][NOBONES][NO_DIZZINESS]
[BODY:MONOLITH]
[SOUND:PEACEFUL_INTERMITTENT:12:15000:NONE:hum:hums:humming]
[SOUND:ALERT:20:8000:NONE:resonate:resonates:a resonating tone]
[USE_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE:BONE:MUSCLE_TEMPLATE]
[USE_TISSUE_TEMPLATE:BONE:MUSCLE_TEMPLATE]
[TISSUE_LAYER:BY_CATEGORY:ALL:BONE]
[BODY_SIZE:0:0:15000]
[CAN_DO_INTERACTION:RAISE_CORPSE_MONOLITH] => should animate dead.
[CDI:ADV_NAME:Animate corpse]
[CDI:TARGET_RANGE:A:10]
[CDI:TARGET:A:LINE_OF_SIGHT]
[CDI:MAX_TARGET_NUMBER:A:1]
[CDI:VERB:hum:hums:NA]
[CDI:TARGET_VERB:shudder and begin to move:shudders and begins to move]
[CDI:WAIT_PERIOD:100]

[CASTE:GENERIC]
[CASTE:GENERIC2] Note the interaction in the creature. Its the same that it learns from the inorganic. And note the castes, there is literally no difference, just that I needed at least two, to make the creature transform.

[Grimmash]

True there are skeleton archers, but meh.  Never bought it.  A workaround could be making the skill learning for ranged low.  That way you can use them, but it is a poor solition.  Add in a reaction to train the skill, actually any skill really, say at the skelegym, and you can force better stats for a price.

But again, if the majority wants good ranged undead, i can deal.

Edit: Just to be annoying, a few thoughts.  Having trained and used swords and bows, it takes a lot longer to be dangerous with a bow.  With a sword a beginner poses as much danger to themselves as the target, but the principle of swinging a sharp stick at the thing in front of you makes it relatively easy.  For a bow you need to knock, aim, lead, angle, and have good spatial awareness and depth perception.  This is why many medieval armies had conscripted foot soldiers and trained archers, for example.  And why US GIs have 6 weeks of training now and Rangers train for much longer to become snipers.  Accuracy with aimed weapons requires a lot of mental training and skill.

/end rant

[shadowclasper]

See, the problem with making them a military based hunter group is that there are so FEW of the damn groups to hunt with.

Question? Could you possibly make a new noble slot that can be filled by anyone, not just warlocks? A kind of 'Part's Man' who goes out hunting and gathering. The Fleshmongerer is the obvious choice for this duty, but as the dungeon's only doctor, he's too valuable for such a duty. The idea would be to have 1 or 2 groups of 5-10 ghouls slavering about with bolos and their pure visceral cunning hunting down shit.

Also. You could give Warlocks their own unique bolos weapon rather than a simple bolo launcher. They have a 'hunter's gauntlet' which is used to hurl the deadly and strange bolos that ghouls favor for their hunts.

[Meph]

True there are skeleton archers, but meh.  Never bought it.  A workaround could be making the skill learning for ranged low.  That way you can use them, but it is a poor solition.  Add in a reaction to train the skill, actually any skill really, say at the skelegym, and you can force better stats for a price.

But again, if the majority wants good ranged undead, i can deal.

Edit: Just to be annoying, a few thoughts.  Having trained and used swords and bows, it takes a lot longer to be dangerous with a bow.  With a sword a beginner poses as much danger to themselves as the target, but the principle of swinging a sharp stick at the thing in front of you makes it relatively easy.  For a bow you need to knock, aim, lead, angle, and have good spatial awareness and depth perception.  This is why many medieval armies had conscripted foot soldiers and trained archers, for example.  And why US GIs have 6 weeks of training now and Rangers train for much longer to become snipers.  Accuracy with aimed weapons requires a lot of mental training and skill.

/end rant

Having been a sniper in the german airforce myself: Yes, but this is still a game with dragons and skeletons. Do mind that skeletons only learn in a 50% rate, so I wouldnt call them "good ranged undead".

[shadowclasper]

I always imagined skeletons as succeeding by sheer volume of fire?

[Meph]

Dev Log - Day 10

I uploaded the next version of the Alpha: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=8308 I includes the eternal rose that can potentially be used now, since you can create the reagents, you can sell items at the hoardmaster, buy pets and poisons at the Demonic Attorney, learn rudimentary spells in the Libraries and create ritual reagents in the Alchemists Quarters. I did not add the build-mats and reagents to the libraries in this, since I want testers to have easy access to them. This means the alchemy produces items that are currently not used in anything. ^^

There are three things that I want to ask tester to use:
1. Test the spells and have fun setting the world on fire. (Then tell me which ones act weird)
2. The still has a "test mood" reaction. It allows to hack spawned creatures into your squads. Run this reaction on skeletons and ghouls you spawned, using workshop profiles. Do this once on a skeleton, and you can add it to the squad. THIS MIGHT CAUSE INSTABILITIES. I dont know. Quietust, warmist, no one knows. Possibly yes, maybe no. The only way to find it out is by testing in forts.
3. The Necromantic Shrine has two new test-reactions: Teach Monolith and Transform Monolith. Both are workaround to allow the monolith to fullfill its role: It will animate all deads around it. (they might attack it if you use "teach", they shouldnt attack it if you use "transform") Please give these a try. To teach or transform the monolith, spawn one and keep it one the workshop when you teach/transform it. Then bring it near corpses.

I almost finished the manual on them, but a few things are still missing:

[Gamerlord]

SO MANY SPELLS.

Hey, is there an upper limit on how many spells a warlock can learn?

[jaxy15]

SO MANY SPELLS.

They're warlocks. What do you expect them to do, bash people to death with a stick like some sort of primitive DWARVES or ORCS?

[Meph]

Its about 50% of the spells I want to add. 

Just got good news: Putnam fixed and improved his HackWish script, so the Darkpact will be a thing in the release. Wish for items, no crashing.

EDIT: Every Warlock can learn unlimited spells.

[zlurker]

I'ma pulla Black Mage and only learn 9th level spells.

[Jaso11111]

I can not express how cool this is

I love Necromancy in games and the idea of an entire fort dungeon dedicated to it just makes me giggle!