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[Stuebi]

I havent read the whole thread, forgive me if the topic has since departed from the inital post and im completely wrong.

I actually played Eve for quite a while, but never long enough to "actually get gud scrub" and was allways lacking some decent people to play with.

My biggest gripe with the whole Game is the issue of finding someone cool to play with. I either ended up with complete nutjobs who demanded a time investment somewhere between "Whenever you can." and "Its either your job or the Corp, Choose!", or backstabbing children who argued all day and shot up your new ship the moment it leaves the Hangar.

I have no idea if my old Acc still exists (Or more correctly, if I can remember the Login. Im kind of tempted to start from scratch anyway.), but I might be interested in playing with a group if the atmosphere is "having Fun". So if there's a project going and you'll take people, i'd rather take a shot with people from bay12 than the usual suspects from the EvE-Forums.

[LordBucket]

I'm not even sure if that account is still valid anymore.
I doubt it, since its been several years ago now... 2009-ish,

In the past year I reactivated an account from 2007 without difficulty.

doing 4-level missions will bring me in good money, but what sort of missions are you talking about? I don't know how any of that works. I never got that far on my trial, before.

Note that doing L4 missions will require not only a sufficiently skilled pilot, but also a ship capable of doing them. At a minimum a drake, and at bare minimum skill levels to possibly complete an L4 mission, it will probably be far more time-efficient to do L3 missions.

I think the 30-40mil isk per hour mission running MaLAoS is claiming is probably not a realistic expectation within the two month timeframe you're talking about. I can confirm that 40 million ISK/hr doing L4 missions in a drake is possible, but think of it as an upper limit that you're unlikely to attain wtihout near-maxed skills and by farming specific missions. You might get better results in a tengu or a raven, but that means at least hundreds of millions minimum investment for a ship, and probably on the order of at least 6 months skill training time to be able to fly them usefully. Probably longer, since you'll want to actually be playing during those six months rather than sitting in a station working a dedicated long term skill plan for a ship you don't yet have. Also remember that ships can be lost. I advise against buying a raven or tengu the moment you can sit it one and then flying into your first L4 mission. That's likely to end badly.

For any mission runner much less than a couple months old, 10-15 million ISK/hr doing L3 mission is probably more realistic. Though I'm sure 30 seconds on google will turn up people claiming they can consistently make 100 million ISK/hr mission running with a month old character. In my experience, most ISK/hr numbers people post are inflated, assume max trade and social skills, alts with maxed leadership skills, don't count hauling time, etc.

so much money, there's nothing to spend it on

That's not a problem you're likely to ever have if missions are your source of ISK.

[sluissa]

Trust me, Bay12 is no better than any other random corp out there.

I just recently resubbed once again. Probably only for a single month unless this is the point where I can finally get myself together enough to buy plex. In anycase, coming from experience with Bay12 people, there are just as many traitorous people and... we'll call them passionate players that demand your time, as anywhere else. At the same time, just because we all belong to the same forum community on here doesn't mean we're all going to want to do the same things. When ARMOK was still a thing (Technically still exists, but nobody's been on in months.) There was massive arguments about where things should happen, what we should be doing, and if it should even exist for various reasons. And to be honest, I feel like everyone got in way over their head with the purchase of a POS within the first weeks of existence and with all but about 3 or 4 corp members being completely new characters.

I won't say it was all bad. I had some fun with the people I played with from around here, but in the end the drama killed it for me and I let my subscription lapse once again. Don't depend on trying to group a bunch of players that just happen to have an unrelated interest into playing EVE with you. Even if they all like dwarf fortress, it's unlikely they'll all want to do the same thing in EVE.

[acetech09]

snip

yeh. Well said. I kept quiet in this thread because I could only say negative things about the plan. It was a cool effort, though.

I can speak as a 4-year corp CEO that even when your members are focused, it's damn hard to keep a corp together. And even in the bay12 channel, there are a ton of different players with different play styles, some that I can't even possibly comprehend.

[aristabulus]

snip

...
I can speak as a 4-year corp CEO that even when your members are focused, it's damn hard to keep a corp together. And even in the bay12 channel, there are a ton of different players with different play styles, some that I can't even possibly comprehend.

Yup, it is for situations like these the term "herding cats" was invented...

More to the point, it's the by-product of any volunteer structure.  Yes, I know, some corps screen applicants... but once they are in, the only thing keeping them there is the choice to stay.

[Fikes]

I think the 30-40mil isk per hour mission running MaLAoS is claiming is probably not a realistic expectation within the two month timeframe you're talking about. I can confirm that 40 million ISK/hr doing L4 missions in a drake is possible, but think of it as an upper limit that you're unlikely to attain wtihout near-maxed skills and by farming specific missions. You might get better results in a tengu or a raven, but that means at least hundreds of millions minimum investment for a ship, and probably on the order of at least 6 months skill training time to be able to fly them usefully. Probably longer, since you'll want to actually be playing during those six months rather than sitting in a station working a dedicated long term skill plan for a ship you don't yet have. Also remember that ships can be lost. I advise against buying a raven or tengu the moment you can sit it one and then flying into your first L4 mission. That's likely to end badly.

I think even this is quite high. I run missions on a duo account right now, with a Drake and an Abaddon and bring in maybe 40m an hour if you count salvage and I get lucky with loot. People may be adding in some sort of lp/isk conversion, but I think in general they are just blowing the numbers way out of proportion.

I have seen people do this in real time. They will say "Wow, we are making like 150m isk an hour on this incursion" and I'll look in my wallet and see that we have only made 90m in an hour and 10 minutes.

I think everyone inflates their isk/hr. Any time I hear someone claim they are pulling in 150m a hour, I am immediately skeptical since incursions only pull in 100m/hr and require some pretty high level skills, expensive equipment, and 40 players working together.

Anyways, if you are new to the game my advice would be to stick to the known money makers like mission running, complexes, or wormhole day trips and don't get discouraged when you hear people claiming "I made 1.2 billion isk yesterday." because they probably didn't.

Trust me, Bay12 is no better than any other random corp out there.

I agree with this also. Seems like every time we start a b12 group, a week into it the leadership has vanished and everyone is pulling us in different directions and mad at everyone else.

Our WH POS was another great example of inflated isk/hr. At one point people were trying to convince me that they were making 100s of millions by living in our c2. Meanwhile, my payouts had been like 40m (over the course of a couple of days) and I had lost a fully kitted Noctis.

Anyways, we have derailed Molaos's Eve for free topic pretty terribly and we should all find our way back to the general Eve topic.

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=79870.msg5008830#msg5008830

[Ivan Issaccs]

As far as isk per hour inflation goes you are right. I've heard so many people over the years claim just as an example that they make 100+ mill an hour running sanctums in null.
Then it turns out they're dual or triple boxing ships which each cost more than the amount of hours I can imagine sane folk wanting to grind at the actual rate around 30 million. Where missions are concerned I think its psychologically required to inflate the real figure to justify spending so much time boring yourself to the point of cutting your own throat for the poxy payout they give.

That said in the past it possible to make in exceed of 150 million running vanguard incursions before they nerfed them. These days I live in a C6 Wormhole and I do make 200 million an hour running the sites, trouble is that if I only have a handful to run that day Ill be done inside 30 minutes. The biggest payout I ever saw for an op was just over a billion for a four hour op.


As far as a Bay12 corp goes I think it best each member finds a corp that does there preferred activities, I have never seen a corp that didn't specialize in either PVP or PVE that wasn't a crock of shit.

[Tobel]

I absolutely love EVE, but like others the monthly is holding me back. I have three fairly low level characters (fighter, miner, marketwhore) that I had a grand plan at one point to make enough ISK to sustain through ingame means. Sadly I got futzed over when trying to join a new mining corp and lost some things. From there I just lost hope. My combat char thankfully built up a good deal of supporting skills so he isn't just an empty shell piloting a ship far beyond his skill, if you need one.

Edit:
Also, I could harvest 21 fields of flax at a time in my hayday. ATITD4lyfeee#420swag

[motorbitch]

people claiming "I made 1.2 billion isk yesterday." because they probably didn't.

i had days where i was making that and more with exploration and ded 5-6 sites.
however, it was offset with weeks of finding nothing, and inevitable losses.

its true that mission income is not the highest. tho, at last its steady. only that it reqires quite high skills to make decent isk/h.

financially, i nerver have been better then in factional warefare. im not greedy tho. im very happy if i can pay for my 2 plex a month (i have a dedicated covops account that doesnt make any income) and have some fun getting blown up.
fw has the huge advantage that i dont have to grind very much to get my income. even the grinding doesnt feel so very grindy as its mostly baiting and waiting for a fight.

[MoLAoS]

I was somewhat famous on a few forums for being a topic derailer, always with the best of intentions of course, so argue about mission income as you like. Actually every time you say mission income is inflated it gives me a happy because I decided to do PI instead. Before the war I actually was making 200mil an hour for a couple days. If I can ever get my new CEO and the logi guy to respond to my damn messages I don't doubt I'll make that much again. Well the CEO is not that bad really.

I've run a few player organizations and it wasn't bad. I may be biased by playing games that only serious people get into. My rental alliance was actually really well organized, friendly, and active. Mostly because the leader was awesome I suspect.

As far as a Bay12 corp, I'd probably recommend tell culture but that always works out so much better in theory than practice. Its great for me personally but maybe 90% of people hate it.

When I was in the RPG.net wormhole corp the one thing I went to gave a payout of 20mil, I think people who were actually useful got a lot more. It only took maybe 45 minutes. I suspect they make about 60-80mil an hour with an average selection of sites and only the necessary number of ships. Which isn't that great really.

As far as the plan, when I had it initially I was in an easy going, well running rental alliance where my only costs were 2.5bil a month for rent and I was easily going to be able to plex 12 accounts, pay rent, and have a lot left over. Like, a lot. Maybe 10bil a month. Possibly a lot more if I was playing 4 hours a day instead of 2 doing PI.

Of course then PI prices dropped, the war happened, and PLEX went up about 30mil a pop.

Now I'd expect a net 15bil profit on 3 hours a day of playing per month. Which makes social cohesion concerns more important.

[Tobel]

How is the interest for this looking so far?

[MoLAoS]

Well, this is officially cancelled. I talked to several major nullsec alliances about moving due to the situation in Immensea and Catch going to shit. They almost unanimously gave me some crap about how they don't want too many non PVP characters in the alliance and what not. I don't rat, barely any of their players do PI, I'm almost in position to handle all my own JF logistics plus more. And I'm happy to do PVP on my main plus possibly multi clienting with some others. Having more accounts in corp has no gameplay effect at all. But my killboard isn't good enough. Like we are playing fucking Call of Duty.

I may continue to play a bit on a few accounts but honestly, playing with one or two accounts makes the game play almost the same as a shitty themepark and its not paying off fun wise.

[sluissa]

I know this is over, but I was curious what exactly the "rent" was getting you.

[MoLAoS]

I know this is over, but I was curious what exactly the "rent" was getting you.

when i was renting in immensea, i never actually paid anything. i was there provisionally and immensea was lost before my 3 month trial period was up. so Nulli didn't charge me. The reason I rented was to have access to nullsec planets for PI. They are something like 5x as productive extraction wise as highsec when you get -0.4 security or lower. I was also getting access to planets where the POCO tax was a mere 2%, which is pretty awesome. And alliance logistics would ship my product to Jita and ship back skillbooks, implants, and command centers for planets at a really good rate.

[LordBucket]

MoLAoS: Have you considered moving to lowsec? You'd probably need to do your own shipping, but if you settle in Amarr or Khanid space there are some regions that barely see any activity. We have some players based out of Ordion, for example. I've once or twice gone on lowsec roams with them and it's generally been an hour of jumping around not seeing anyone.

Since you have multiple accounts already it would be easy for you to put one in a shuttle to scout ahead of your transport.