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[Tiruin]

And last query before I rush off.

PFP 90 minutes to day end.

Compromise vote time.  Max White, TheDarkStar, and Toaster are tied for first place.  I can compromise to Dark or Max.  TheDarkStar's my second Scum pick.  I'll be watching votes as best as work allows in case a tie reappears or other votes are placed.  If work slows down enough I'll be able to answer and ask before day end.

That do you all think of this post. Would Imp bus her scummy looking teammate D1 and be the one to get him lynched?
I think the answer to this is a no, and I think I will Unvote, given that Imp has answered one of my questions and I'm doubting the fact that she's scum.

Does the bolded part take any relevance to why you thought Imp was scum?
Next.
Does the note on people 'missing' questions make them more scummier than not? Why so? Or, why not?

[Persus13]

I be curious, laddie. What did you see back then--back here--that you're not seeing back up there?

I looked back and noticed that Imp was the deciding vote on DarkStar. That and the fact a roleblock is not  concrete proof Imp is scum cause me to decide that Imp wasn't necessary as scummy as I thought.

Also extend

Throwing this fast and running back to work, which is in shambles.

Because this applies to me too.

We're out of extends.

And last query before I rush off.

PFP 90 minutes to day end.

Compromise vote time.  Max White, TheDarkStar, and Toaster are tied for first place.  I can compromise to Dark or Max.  TheDarkStar's my second Scum pick.  I'll be watching votes as best as work allows in case a tie reappears or other votes are placed.  If work slows down enough I'll be able to answer and ask before day end.

That do you all think of this post. Would Imp bus her scummy looking teammate D1 and be the one to get him lynched?
I think the answer to this is a no, and I think I will Unvote, given that Imp has answered one of my questions and I'm doubting the fact that she's scum.

Does the bolded part take any relevance to why you thought Imp was scum?
Next.
Does the note on people 'missing' questions make them more scummier than not? Why so? Or, why not?

Partly, Imp is hardly the one to not answer questions, and the fact that despite her needing a replacement she took a little time to answer my question lowered my suspicion slightly. Her D1 vote was the main factor though.

[Superblackcat]

Just to point out...
Heroic Guard Does not see if the person was targeted or not, only Observant Guard does that.

Thanks!

I'll make a more detailed post in half to an hour!

[makeinu]

Extend.

One thing I should point out about Imp.

At the end of the Day 1, the vote was tied until Imp cast the third vote against TheDarkStar. I think this makes her an unlikely candidate for a dopp, unless she likes breaking ties to bus her scumbuddies. It's possible, but I don't see it.

TheDarkStar was acting pretty scummy, I think anyone would agree with that. So, that's a WIFOM argument, but let's take it on anyway. Here's the sequence of events changing the vote board D1:

The Whiteboard
Caz: Toaster
Max White: Persus13, Tiruin
Sinlessmoon: Caz
TheDarkStar: Jim Groovester, makeinu
Tiruin: Max White
Toaster: Imp, TheDarkStar

PFP 90 minutes to day end.

Compromise vote time.  Max White, TheDarkStar, and Toaster are tied for first place.  I can compromise to Dark or Max.  TheDarkStar's my second Scum pick.  I'll be watching votes as best as work allows in case a tie reappears or other votes are placed.  If work slows down enough I'll be able to answer and ask before day end.

In the end for me, its come down to who do I feel I feel is the biggest threat to the town right now and honestly, its Darkstar for me. I've stated why before, and others have as well. Be I wrong, I will face the consequences. Sorry man, it was fun.

The Whiteboard
Caz: Toaster
Max White: Persus13, Tiruin
Sinlessmoon: Caz
TheDarkStar: Imp, Jim Groovester, makeinu, RangerCado
Toaster: TheDarkStar

Of note, Imp voted TheDarkStar before RangerCado did, and she had been voting Toaster with TheDarkStar before then. When TheDarkStar ended up lynched at the end of the day, and he would've because of RangerCado's vote change, anyone that had acted in any way scummy, in anyone's estimation, that hadn't voted for him would have come under suspicion. And sure enough, Persus13, Tiruin, Caz, Superblackcat (subbing in for Max White), have all come under suspicion. Toaster hasn't, but he's not acted scummy at all the entire game. RangerCado got some pressure from Jim, but he backed down. Other than that, the only suspicion cast at anyone who voted for TheDarkStar has come from people who didn't vote for TheDarkStar.

WIFOM:if I were in Imp's place, and scum, I'd've bused TheDarkStar. In a heartbeat. Just to create the WIFOM.

Ultimately tells us nothing about Imp. Interestingly, the same scum/not-scum argument can be made about RangerCado, for the same reasons.

PPE: Thanks, Superblackcat. I'm glad I'm not the only one to notice Tiruin's role-clam (embiggened for legibility).

Also PS: I really doubt Imp is scum because of what I did yesterday night. Granted, it doesn't confirm your action Toony so here's me being vague, but not useless.

I'm a heroic guard and I saw nothin' or nobody targetin' Imp. I'm "claiming" because I believe nobody would believe me [well, ok, some would, but given the notion of a roving protector, I'd just like to relish this one note of WIFOM'ing scum] and yet I'd assuredly want to plop in the tiniest piece of information relevant to my role.

Yes this is in tiny text and in paragraph form. You're free to believe me or not.

Here's my problem, and it's not that the Heroic Guard doesn't see if the person was targeted.

It's that this is the second claim to Heroic Guard I've heard so far today, and the other claim, unlike Tiruin's, specifically was Town Heroic Guard (they can be dopp, if I'm reading correctly). And, also, the third Guard claim I've heard today.

I'll let that sink in for a bit.

[Superblackcat]

Ok, Jim

Quick Clarification.

You voted Sinless because he asked to stay in during the night. Continued once replaced because of the uncertainty of the claim?
Now that the claim has been confirmed, how does your voting/suspect list change?

Persus:: This is... sadly a bandwagon. I think...

Anyways, I'm quite curious as to why you manage to jump onto bandwagons that are started... every single time.

Also, just pulling in METAs here... During Sprint, d1, every single vote, save the 1st one, was jumping on a bandwagon. You were the 2nd person on a person every single time.

In BMXLIII: You jumped in a vote on RPG, He was not yet voted, jumped on bandwagon kleril, but jumped off much sooner than other, and onto Darvi, who was also not yet voted... Jumped back to kleril,

Then he promptly died.

(Thank you for dying, I didn't have to sort through 50k posts).

It seems to me, in the games in which he is not scum, he is much more likely to jump off band wagons, and form his own pressures.

MakeINU Where were the other claims to Guard?

Imp, Sorry about making you be here, or something. But do you have an argument against you being scum?

[Tiruin]

Luckyblackcat

Just to point out...
Heroic Guard Does not see if the person was targeted or not, only Observant Guard does that.

Thanks!

I'll make a more detailed post in half to an hour!

I know that. D:<
Now, other than my dramatic one-liner here, I figure you've something to say about that?

I note that you haven't voted--ever. Who are your suspects and what did you judge them by?


makeinu

Extend.

One thing I should point out about Imp.

At the end of the Day 1, the vote was tied until Imp cast the third vote against TheDarkStar. I think this makes her an unlikely candidate for a dopp, unless she likes breaking ties to bus her scumbuddies. It's possible, but I don't see it.

TheDarkStar was acting pretty scummy, I think anyone would agree with that. So, that's a WIFOM argument, but let's take it on anyway. [...]

Well, she could've just kept silent and none would be the wiser given the variance and spread of votes, which would give credibility to that notion instead of delving into the WIFOM region there. However the notion does stand that if Max/Toaster was town or scum, she could've voted anyone else...and none would be the wiser.

But the notion holds. Why would she attack a scumbuddy at that moment given that prospect? A strange Dopp with an anti-tech field pertains to a Mad Scientist-type, a valuable commodity to a scumteam given that its the only role that isn't an alien that has an item. Town points perhaps? Plausible. Checking back her posts? It more likely discards the notion of her being scum in my eyes.

Here's my problem, and it's not that the Heroic Guard doesn't see if the person was targeted.

It's that this is the second claim to Heroic Guard I've heard so far today, and the other claim, unlike Tiruin's, specifically was Town Heroic Guard (they can be dopp, if I'm reading correctly). And, also, the third Guard claim I've heard today.

I'll let that sink in for a bit.

...There were others? Huh. Where did you see them?
Or did I miss them.
...*searches 'guard'*
...*nope*
Why're you letting it sink in for a bit? Intriguing to me, that you're giving an idea but not your own thoughts about it (or forwarding/presenting an idea for others to think about). Something up, there?

Toaster hasn't [come under suspicion(?)], but he's not acted scummy at all the entire game.

Really? You don't see any suspicion in Toaster? Why?

WIFOM:if I were in Imp's place, and scum, I'd've bused TheDarkStar. In a heartbeat. Just to create the WIFOM.

Yeah, generalities don't help when people look into the essence of your bus.

PPE: Thanks, Superblackcat. I'm glad I'm not the only one to notice Tiruin's role-clam (embiggened for legibility).

For the record, I small-ified it so that it would be more obvious. I noted that people often miss my words when they're normal size (weird, but..it's been going on for quite some time) so any deviation from a normal post would catch the eye. ie mini-words.

PPE: Oh lookie, reply. Superblackcat
...Eh?

Persus:: This is... sadly a bandwagon. I think...

...Are you talking about yourself there? Because your sentence structure looks like you're talking about yourself and your vote, there.

Anyways, I'm quite curious as to why you manage to jump onto bandwagons that are started... every single time.

Also, just pulling in METAs here... During Sprint, d1, every single vote, save the 1st one, was jumping on a bandwagon. You were the 2nd person on a person every single time.

In BMXLIII: You jumped in a vote on RPG, He was not yet voted, jumped on bandwagon kleril, but jumped off much sooner than other, and onto Darvi, who was also not yet voted... Jumped back to kleril,

Then he promptly died.

(Thank you for dying, I didn't have to sort through 50k posts).

...Could you work on the sentence structure more? Why are you pulling metaknowledge to back your vote? How does that act as conclusive evidence?
Does the point of Kleril's death in a universe far, far away have a point here? Why thank his death--given that you somehow look like you're acting more on metaknowledge for substance than what is present in this game judging by the bolded part?

It seems to me, in the games in which he is not scum, he is much more likely to jump off band wagons, and form his own pressures.

Expound. Details here are vague. What exacts in his playstyle come 'off' to you?

MakeINU Where were the other claims to Guard?

Searchword: "guard"
..Yeah, I don't see it either.

Also please please please learn to use the forum quote style. It's pretty time-reducing to try to get where you're talking from and which part of who's post you're addressing.

[Mephansteras]

The Whiteboard
Imp: makeinu, ToonyMan
Jim Groovester: Persus13, RangerCado
Persus13: Jim Groovester, Superblackcat, Tiruin, Toaster


Day ends ~5pm Pacific Wednesday. There are no more extensions available this day.

[Superblackcat]

Ehehe:
Jim, didn't notice that you had unvoted... Oops

Tiruin:
MWAHAHA, MY NINJA MAKES YOUR POST ALL LIES!

Anyways:

PPE: Oh lookie, reply. Superblackcat
...Eh?
Quote from: Superblackcat on Today at 11:41:48 pm
Persus:: This is... sadly a bandwagon. I think...
...Are you talking about yourself there? Because your sentence structure looks like you're talking about yourself and your vote, there.
Quote from: Superblackcat on Today at 11:41:48 pm
Anyways, I'm quite curious as to why you manage to jump onto bandwagons that are started... every single time.

Also, just pulling in METAs here... During Sprint, d1, every single vote, save the 1st one, was jumping on a bandwagon. You were the 2nd person on a person every single time.

In BMXLIII: You jumped in a vote on RPG, He was not yet voted, jumped on bandwagon kleril, but jumped off much sooner than other, and onto Darvi, who was also not yet voted... Jumped back to kleril,

Then he promptly died.

(Thank you for dying, I didn't have to sort through 50k posts).
...Could you work on the sentence structure more? Why are you pulling metaknowledge to back your vote? How does that act as conclusive evidence?
Does the point of Kleril's death in a universe far, far away have a point here? Why thank his death--given that you somehow look like you're acting more on metaknowledge for substance than what is present in this game judging by the bolded part?

Quote
It seems to me, in the games in which he is not scum, he is much more likely to jump off band wagons, and form his own pressures.
Expound. Details here are vague. What exacts in his playstyle come 'off' to you?

Quote
MakeINU Where were the other claims to Guard?
Searchword: "guard"
..Yeah, I don't see it either.

Also please please please learn to use the forum quote style. It's pretty time-reducing to try to get where you're talking from and which part of who's post you're addressing.

A: Yes I am talking to myself

B: No conclusive evidence. But just the fact that he has jumped on a bandwagon as second is bad enough. Now that it only happens when he is scum... is worse.

Not saying that is conclusive evidence. But when do you have conclusive evidence in mafia?

It was a joke, I was saying that because Persus died, I stopped looking through the thread.

C: Looking through his previous games. He stayed on a bandwagon, only when it got to the point when kleril seemed incredibly scummy, and really had no way out. Other than that, he jumped around and voted others.

(or 2 others)

I don't like people who jump on bandwagons... not one bit.

[Superblackcat]

Hey all.  I have no time to catch up on the thread or quote anything.  Throwing this fast and running back to work, which is in shambles.

I confirm I was blocked last night and put to sleep.  I think that means a psychic warden did it.

Did you or did you not feel the overwhelming presence of an elder god?
Meaning: Chains. Locks. Keys. Metal bars.
Any of them, did you feel?

Also extend

Throwing this fast and running back to work, which is in shambles.

Because this applies to me too.

Also, No more extends

[makeinu]

Tiruin: I haven't gotten the least scum vibe off Toaster yet, something I can say of no one else in this game. Hell, looking at me from the outside, I totally wonder I didn't get lynched D1. I should be thankful to TheDarkStar for really scumming it up there. And I've noticed that with your posts as well, that people miss things. Perhaps it's because you seem to meander when you write. It's hard to follow your train of thought. Deliberately, I assume.

MakeINU Where were the other claims to Guard?

In PMs. Those are allowed this game, remember?

Why the hell would I role-claim on someone else? That's just dumb, to take what trust has been built and toss it on a fire.

I may play the fool, but that doesn't mean I am one.

[Superblackcat]

Oh damn....

After reading through D1, I believe Persus more to be acting bad day 2...

In D1, he seemed very non scummy. Unvote

Hey Toaster, Might you step it up this game? I'm pretty sure I heard somewhere that you and Jim are the masters of Mafia here... I'm quite sad to see what a master of mafia here is.

What posts thus far do you think has had the most impact towards scum hunting?

[Tiruin]

Persus:: This is... sadly a bandwagon. I think...

...Are you talking about yourself there? Because your sentence structure looks like you're talking about yourself and your vote, there.

A: Yes I am talking to myself

What is your definition of a bandwagon? Does it carry any implicit meaning?

Anyways, I'm quite curious as to why you manage to jump onto bandwagons that are started... every single time.

Also, just pulling in METAs here... During Sprint, d1, every single vote, save the 1st one, was jumping on a bandwagon. You were the 2nd person on a person every single time.

In BMXLIII: You jumped in a vote on RPG, He was not yet voted, jumped on bandwagon kleril, but jumped off much sooner than other, and onto Darvi, who was also not yet voted... Jumped back to kleril,

Then he promptly died.

(Thank you for dying, I didn't have to sort through 50k posts).

...Could you work on the sentence structure more? Why are you pulling metaknowledge to back your vote? How does that act as conclusive evidence?

B: No conclusive evidence. But just the fact that he has jumped on a bandwagon as second is bad enough. Now that it only happens when he is scum... is worse.

Not saying that is conclusive evidence. But when do you have conclusive evidence in mafia?

It was a joke, I was saying that because Persus died, I stopped looking through the thread.

...So you are using metaknowledge to further your case. Why in the world are you doing that when you say that there's "no conclusive evidence" at all?! That contradicts your whole belief there.

A second person voting on another person is not a bloody bandwagon. Did you look at his reasons for doing so? Why aren't you using those as a reason instead, given how they're more likely than not, relevant towards why he voted and your train of logic here.

C: Looking through his previous games. He stayed on a bandwagon, only when it got to the point when kleril seemed incredibly scummy, and really had no way out. Other than that, he jumped around and voted others.

(or 2 others)

I don't like people who jump on bandwagons... not one bit.

Define. Bandwagon.

makeinu

Tiruin: I haven't gotten the least scum vibe off Toaster yet, something I can say of no one else in this game. Hell, looking at me from the outside, I totally wonder I didn't get lynched D1. I should be thankful to TheDarkStar for really scumming it up there. And I've noticed that with your posts as well, that people miss things. Perhaps it's because you seem to meander when you write. It's hard to follow your train of thought. Deliberately, I assume.

MakeINU Where were the other claims to Guard?

In PMs. Those are allowed this game, remember?

Why the hell would I role-claim on someone else? That's just dumb, to take what trust has been built and toss it on a fire.

I may play the fool, but that doesn't mean I am one.

PMs aren't bloody allowe-
*checks*
Well I'll be damned.

Rule on PMs: Private Messages are allowed. However, I must be copied on all PMs. Failure to do so will result in very bad things happening to you. In addition you may NOT quote any PM from me, either your initial Role-PM or any role-related PMs. (Night role results, etc).  I'll make an exception for specifically rules-related questions. This is to keep the suspense and uncertainty in the game high. You're not supposed to know if the other person is lying or not, and quoting me gives too much weight to whatever it is you're saying.

Alright wise guy. What's the scoop. You say there were "other" claims yet lookie there, IT'S IN A BLOODY PM. You think I would get that info?

I may play the fool, but that doesn't mean I am one.

So said faux-fool speaks of other claims, yet dubiously lacks the public notice other than giving notice that he knows of such claims.
Interesting.

[Superblackcat]

Makeinu: If you were not going to reveal who pm-ed you, Why did you even bother to reveal that you did indeed get pm-ed? Wouldn't that just be adding to the wifom?

[makeinu]

PMs aren't bloody allowe-
*checks*
Well I'll be damned.

Yeah, I checked that first. I'm bloody used to using PMs. People will say things in private they won't in the open if they believe those things will stay private.

Alright wise guy. What's the scoop. You say there were "other" claims yet lookie there, IT'S IN A BLOODY PM. You think I would get that info?

No, I don't. Thing is, I can't directly counter your public role claim, nor am I really doing so. I'm just noting that I've got other role claims that counter yours. Those players choose not to public role claim after you did, that's their business, but I gave my word that I wouldn't out those claims, and I simply won't do it, past this.

But it means that a decision has to be made. Specifically, is your claim to be believed or not?

Because that comes down, to me, to the final answer as to who's scum or not. If your claim is accurate, then one or both of the others is likely inaccurate. Which means I've laid my trust on scum.

Thing is, I believe those other claims. Which means that I have to suspect yours, wherein you claim to have protected Imp, who, as it just so happens, did nothing last night because she was role-blocked. Imp, who you are publicly defending as not scummy today.

No night kill. Two players role-blocked. One, abducted, unable to speak. The other, out and requesting replacement, and silent.

One of them was scum. Of that there's no doubt.

Caz or Imp. Choose.


PPE: Superblackcat, it comes down to trust and whether I'll betray it. I won't, barring compelling reason to do so. Said reason being that one that I've trusted suddenly turns very scummy.

[Superblackcat]

Tiruin:
Sorry about lack of quotes:

Finally, you've seen me as scum since you watched the BM Sprint game. Did you think I was scum, and did I ever bandwagon someone?

So what happened to your case on RangerCado anyway? You said you were leaning scum on him and then stopped talking about him. Was it because no one else voted him?

As for your vote on me, I find it ironic that you've accused me of bandwagoning given that is what you are doing. I'm being voted by two other people (Tiruin and Toaster). Until Toaster voted me you gave no indications that you found me scummy, and now you're voting me for bandwagoning. I've given clear indications of whom I have thought scummy, and I fail to see how voting someone who I have cited as scummy to me before on multiple occasions is "bandwagoning".

Also, his reason towards Jim is... That Jim is voting Persus himself. And then... He goes back and takes some Jim posts, that he doesn't like I guess? He asks questions, argues against those posts... and votes Jim himself. Not a very convincing reasoning at all.

His reason towards Sin was complete bullshit and bandwagon, I will not bother to summarize it.

His reason towards Imp: Psychic Warden claim. Uhhh... I'd call it bandwagoning. It hard to attack the Persus + Persus has no reason other than the Toony's reason. If this isn't bandwagoning... what is?

I switched my vote from Persus to Toaster because I don't like Toaster, He's done what the scum has done in my other two games have done. Appear unnoticed. Squill, and Persus. Both of them I, and others, Town telled purely because nothing could be used against them... They were too much the righteous people.

Toaster... What the hell are you doing?

PPE:

MakeInU: So you won't post the CounterClaims you recieve so the town will get more information... Because of trust? If it was because of trust... You wouldn't be giving out more hints.

Suddenly more scummy...

This is seriously WIFOM, Forcing us to try to figure out who you are referring to as 'suddenly more scummy'.

I'd say just come out with it. You already said Wifom is bad for town, why are you adding more of it?