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[lijacote]

I mean, nowhere in MY research tables do I see Undead Nation Mastery, so there's no clear way I can wrest control of Ermor away from Sceleria and make them helplessly, mindlessly grind themselves down distracting my enemies for no gain while I conquer half the disk...

The problem with the living ever rears its ugly head! No perspective, no eye for the long game. No eyes! Rotted off, snatched by hungry birds... Ermor will rise again!

[E. Albright]

...has it been that long already? Yes, I suppose we have reached the 9-month anniversary of the final demise of Etimmu:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Etimmu, mere hours (or possibly days; it felt like days) before his third or fourth death, depending on when you start counting. He seemed so happy (heroic HP bonus was +81 at the end):


Ermor caves, publicly acknowledges his re-re-re-interment:

[E. Albright]

I'm pushing hosting 12h pre-emptively. And I apologize for my frequent delays these past couple of weeks.

[Margrave]

Having finally gotten a chance to look at the turn, I will be going AI next turn.

Yes I know, shocked, understandable.

But take heart because deep down we all really want to see it go.

I am so very glad I did not cast Storm during the capital battle.

[E. Albright]

Are we good with doing a rollback? Sorry I missed the deadline - I've cut it close enough over the last month that it was bound to happen eventually, ugh - though it wouldn't have happened this time if not for the 30 hours awake followed by a couple hours of mindlessly collapsing in bed right before the (already-once-postponed) deadline. Grumble, grumble.

I'm not really willing to ask for more than 72h for a turn because that's just unreasonable, but given how long it's been taking to do a turn and how narrow my margin of error is (and hence the consequences of making the inevitable mistakes) it's been fairly frequent that I haven't been finding the contiguous block of time I need to get my turns done in random 72h periods these past weeks. How bad is it for the rest of you (R'lyeh excepted, obviously)?

On the subject of things I really don't want to do, I suppose I could mention the notion of calling the game. We're down to a two-way heat, and it's not clear who's going to win, so it's not like there's not some excellent opportunity for garnering endgame MP experience for the three significant powers still extant. But if it's at all as burdensome for the zombie nations as it is for the stoners, it might be worth considering. If you're all still good with keeping going, and can indulge my current chronic tardiness (which is unlikely to let up in the immediate future, though as always I'll try), then I'll soldier on. But given that we've been playing this since last November, and having just seen 4.02 wrap up, the idea did seem like it at least needed mooted.

Anyway, lemme know how y'all are feeling about all this, and if our consensus is to plow on, I'll process the rollback.

[Frumple]

To the extent it matters, the squids, most powerful nation of the world in heart and spirit _{^{(albeit nothing else)}}, will magnanimously accede to a rollback.

[lijacote]

Rollback is fine, continuing is fine. I'd like to see what will come of my plots to kill everything you thug dearly, but if the others want to give the victory to me, I'm good with that too.

With only one locus, really, for me to act on, my turns are very short. Cast rituals, forge items, script the recruits send them to the front, done. Only one province to really act on... yeah. It's not a bother for me.

[Darkwind3]

I'm fine with a rollback. My turns have been fairly short when I haven't had to do much, but they tend to take longer when I can't put off scripting my mages any longer or actually go through and produce a coherent plan of action for my war effort. I can imagine having to fight two enemies at once, while effectively using the resources at your disposal, turns take a while. Amulet of the Dead micro is hellish though; to move an Amulet of the Dead, it takes 4 clicks just to take it off, and another 4 to put it on a thaumaturg in a separate province. Repeat 30 times and you have mind-numbing menial labor that's necessary to ensure your longdead horsemen aren't being generated 10 provinces from the front. I'm afraid even winning this war might kill me from the constant forward movement of amulets destroying my wrists.

At least I'm not Ermor, I guess.

[E. Albright]

You pretty much nailed why my turns are so painful. I don't have the same micro either of you do, but I've been doing extremely precise scrabbling for every last resource for the last 20 turns. A short turn with very little scripting takes an hour, and one where I really have to dig into that sort of thing can take more than twice as long.

I'll do the rollback tonight.

[E. Albright]

Okay, so, I wasn't going to be able to get the turn done before tonight, and I swear I pushed the hosting back accordingly - in fact, I swear I pushed it back 12h a good 3h before host time, when Sceleria was still out too. And yet, stale. Grr. Grrrrrrrrr.

I can do another rollback if you all are game.

Given how time-consuming this is, and how wane my enthusiasm for it has grown, I probably should bow out, but given that if I found a sub the odds would be very, very good that they'd quickly get overrun simple due to lack of context even if they were experienced with Agartha and endgame play, I feel a certain obligation to slog on. This is definitely at the "more of a chore than a joy" stage, though. To be honest, and to revisit and reconsider my last diatribe on the subject, I'd be happier calling the game than keeping going. I'll do it if the other players really want to keep at it, but this is getting soul-sucking, and having missed another hosting deadline (especially when I'm pretty damned sure I shouldn't have) is just underlining that.

Lemme know if anyone else has any more involved opinions on the matter than the comments a couple of days ago. I'll go ahead and do my prior turn when I have the chance tonight under the assumption I'm continuing, but as I stated above, the last few days have underscored how little pleasure I'm taking in this.

[lijacote]

I'd not be entirely unhappy to see the game end. I would gladly submit that I did not win, and that it is a tie between the two of you remaining powers.

[Darkwind3]

I'm fine with a rollback if we do continue, but I can't say I'd be sad to see the game end. (Well, a little bit.) The game is still very much up in the air, but I'm not sure I'd have the strength of will to finish the game given the amount of time that could take (though of course Sceleria would win in the end ). Certainly not if the only other contender wanted the game to end.

Can we say Sceleria wins because it holds the most throne points?

[Frumple]

Hey, if none of you want the win I'll happily lay claim to it. Illegitimate, unsupported claim is still claim, right?

E: Actually, the poor bugger before me apparently subbed in twice. Give them the victory

[Delta Foxtrot]

Vanarus claims!

Sounds like this game should have ended a while a go. Do you guys have any hindsight as to what could have fixed it? Lesser throne requirements? Map issues?

[Darkwind3]

Both! Valanis is not a great map for MP, for all sorts of reasons (which I could go into if you'd like). Additionally, the throne requirements (17/24) effectively amount to total map control being necessary to actually win the game. Even if R'lyeh and Ermor both gave me all of their thrones without a fight effective immediately, Agartha's thrones are deep enough into its heartland that I'd have to grind them down completely to actually win the game - and the same is true of Agartha defeating me. I think 50%+1 is a more reasonable number to end the game before it's already over - Agartha could win with a good push into Ermor's and former Mictlan's territory, and I could win by forting the thrones I gained from Mictlan and Agartha's (formerly R'lyeh's, formerly Marignon's) territory and just blitzing R'lyeh for their throne. I think R'lyeh would have been fairly close to victory back when they were actually a power, as well.