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Author Topic: Space Thread  (Read 367021 times)

Sheb

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Re: Space Thread
« Reply #870 on: June 13, 2015, 09:56:40 am »

Although I do wonder if the dust plays much of a role. What's the density of dusted martian air versus undusted Martian air?
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10ebbor10

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Re: Space Thread
« Reply #871 on: June 13, 2015, 10:06:20 am »

Quote
7 x 10-5 kg m-3 during a dust devil

Neglible compared to the atmospheric density of about 0.010-0.020 kg/m3 .

http://congrexprojects.com/docs/11m24_docs/02apr_1630_chicarro.pdf?sfvrsn=2
« Last Edit: June 13, 2015, 10:08:39 am by 10ebbor10 »
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Arx

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Re: Space Thread
« Reply #872 on: June 13, 2015, 12:03:02 pm »

Just over a month!

In case anyone isn't already hyped for New Horizons's rendezvous.
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Rose

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Re: Space Thread
« Reply #873 on: June 13, 2015, 12:52:49 pm »

I'm hyped for dscovr to start operations.
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MonkeyHead

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Re: Space Thread
« Reply #874 on: June 13, 2015, 01:26:02 pm »

Just over a month!

In case anyone isn't already hyped for New Horizons's rendezvous.

Waaaaaayyyyy back in the day (Late 90's to be more precise) one of my first assignments as an undergrad was to present to the assembled faculty about any one NASA mission that was in early planning, and to justify why it should be the one chosen. This was the one I chose ahead of other (at the time) more high profile missions to Mars or Jupiter/Saturn. Since then, I have watched it with abundant enthusiasm (especially as it was canned at least once and possibly twice), and see it finally getting to Pluto as some odd closing of a circle.

wierd

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Re: Space Thread
« Reply #875 on: June 13, 2015, 04:32:57 pm »

The "chaotic" orbits of Nix and Hydra around the Pluto-Charon system is of particular interest to me. The "Three body problem" has been a thorn in the side of complex orbital systems for many years.  Better observations of this system, which appears to have a stable configuration, could be very valuable to science.

The interesting conformation of Nix and Hydra (ellipsoids instead of spheroids) is very likely not accidental there. Makes me wonder about the physical shapes of orbiting bodies in N-body solutions greater than 3.
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MonkeyHead

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Re: Space Thread
« Reply #876 on: June 13, 2015, 05:07:51 pm »

To me it seems like the complex nature of the orbits results in some rather extreme tidal forces, hence the ovoid shapes. I await good data with enthusiasm.

Dorsidwarf

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Re: Space Thread
« Reply #877 on: June 13, 2015, 05:27:22 pm »

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Il Palazzo

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Re: Space Thread
« Reply #878 on: June 13, 2015, 05:48:39 pm »

To me it seems like the complex nature of the orbits results in some rather extreme tidal forces, hence the ovoid shapes. I await good data with enthusiasm.
The actual shapes are not actually yet determined. There's pictures floating around that portray them as ellipsoids, but these are from shapes used in simulations/artist impressions. I wouldn't expect much regularity in the real thing.
That they're not spherical is no surprise, considering that they're too small for hydrostatic equilibrium.

The "Three body problem" has been a thorn in the side of complex orbital systems for many years. 
Oh, wierd. Why do you do this to me?  :'(
What does it even mean? And what does Lagrange think of it?
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wierd

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Re: Space Thread
« Reply #879 on: June 13, 2015, 07:45:58 pm »

The Pluto-Charon + Nix and Hydra system is a classic n-body system. You have 2 bodies of mostly similar mass orbiting around a baricenter that is not contained within one of the bodies, and objects in stable orbits around them.  Lagrange only produced 2 of the now 16 computed possible solutions to the 3-body problem. Having a physical model of such a beast to study is worthwhile. If nothing else, it helps confirm the models used to date.

I remind you that only the "Restricted" 3-body set has been solved (Orbits are constrained to circles and ellipses; complex shapes are not permitted) . Where N>3, the problem still persists.  The Pluto+Charon+Nix+Hydra system is a 4-body system in stable configuration.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2015, 07:57:54 pm by wierd »
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Sheb

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Re: Space Thread
« Reply #880 on: June 14, 2015, 07:31:38 am »

So apparently the re-established contact with Philae. Apparently the lander had "woken up" a few times earlier (when it gets enough energy I guess), but didn't managed to communicate with Rosetta.
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MorleyDev

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Re: Space Thread
« Reply #881 on: June 14, 2015, 07:34:04 am »

Yay. Wait, "Philae shut down on 15 November 2015 at 1:15 CET"...I think there's a typo in there somewhere.
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10ebbor10

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Re: Space Thread
« Reply #882 on: June 14, 2015, 08:25:05 am »

Yay. Wait, "Philae shut down on 15 November 2015 at 1:15 CET"...I think there's a typo in there somewhere.
Dammit, we told it to use the Red Phonebox, not the blue one.
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penguinofhonor

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Re: Space Thread
« Reply #883 on: June 14, 2015, 08:49:06 am »

.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2015, 11:20:58 am by penguinofhonor »
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Il Palazzo

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Re: Space Thread
« Reply #884 on: June 14, 2015, 09:54:28 am »

snip
I've got more issues with your response than with the original statement, but I'm not going to nitpick. I do get your main thrust - it's a system with interesting dynamics.
I just wish you were more precise with your statements, and make sure you don't say things you are not certain about - as a self-proclaimed armchair scientist you should hold yourself to high standards of discourse, IMHO.
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