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[Imp]

Why were you guys so interested in that other Witch?

Because once again, somebody with the powers of a vanilla townie is still safer to attack than an unknown who could be a werebear or some other nasty. We have some good roles, and we expected town to have equally good roles, so the prospect of a werebear was looming over our heads every night, and a witch ain't that. In a game with unknown roles, vanilla townies become targets.

Thank you, that reasoning makes perfect sense and wasn't in my list of things to consider.

[Max White]

Also, scum killing replacement-needing players is a meta tell that you have a nice scumteam that wants a fun game.

Has there ever not been a nice scum team?
When you aren't feeling all frustrated at having to build a case and make it actually work out, and can instead just view the game from above, it is a lot more relaxing.

[Imp]

Because they could claim, not get counterclaimed, and be almost certainly town.  It would have been a safe claim for Tiruin.

Gods, I wish you'd guys done that.  -And- that I'd inspected Tiruin.  I do assume that a converter shows up as a changer, which is what I -believe- an illusionist would show as.

But we've had an inspect of a mason witch before.  And there's no way you'd sell me on a Converter result for someone who claims Survivor inspect role.

In fact, I'd have dropped NQT for that, without a backwards glance.  Sure, he might have been an issue because of how Scummy I thought he was game as a whole (NQT, I'm sorry, but you do look sooooo Scummy to me this game.  I now want to beg you for that talk - if only to help me understand why and how -you- are not misrepresenting things when I read your words)

But for Tiruin to flip as a named role that I expected NQT to flip, for the game not to be over yet...  Madness would ensue, possibly enough insanity and doubt to have peeled me off NQT.  And Toaster as killer was prime suspect 'if it wasn't over' period.

[Max White]

Yea, if Tiruin had have gotten lynched that last day then our chances didn't look great.
Toaster would have most likely used the mafia kill, rather than the hunter kill to get rid of you Imp, leaving only NQT, Persus and himself. With the cult kill flavor it would be feasible to claim that he chose not to kill that night and that left somebody as the last cult member, but it would be a hard sell.

[Imp]

Tiruin:

...Imp, you'll be really shocked NQT is town. Please don't think lesser of him for that. :S

I.  Don't anymore.  Now I think lesser of myself.

[Imp]

Huh, I recall thinking about the wallflower (..or context-clues?) that it weakens the integrity of the wall and if anything happens to it, then the whole thing is compromised.

...The more you know
^{I think that's me..}

That would be a keystone (if you want to reference an arch specifically) or a structural support (if you meant any building type at all).  Technically either of those need to be part of what they destroy, they're not applied from without.

Only outside working in thing would be like a sapper maybe.  Not the kind that knocks people on the back of the head, the kind that tunnels under walls during medieval sieges with the intention of bringing that wall down.

[Imp]

Also, scum killing replacement-needing players is a meta tell that you have a nice scumteam that wants a fun game.

Has there ever not been a nice scum team?
When you aren't feeling all frustrated at having to build a case and make it actually work out, and can instead just view the game from above, it is a lot more relaxing.

Yes.  I've seen a Scum member who almost bent over backwards to be an offensive and antagonistic bleep.  As his preferred playstyle that game, before he was under suspicion.  After small bunches of lurky, he came out swinging and -rude-.  Flat out bullying rude.  That's the person I was referring to when I mentioned that maybe you'd seen what I'd been through in another game and had decided that you were -not- going to be nasty with me, period.

[Max White]

Well that is a little jerkish.
I mean yea, mafia can be very frustrating, but it is a game. At the end of it you just have to laugh at all the silly things you said and did... Most good scum teams will choose to kill people that need to be replaced or even that are lurking a lot. Most good townies will accept that even if the game is balanced, they personally are disadvantaged and are fighting an uphill battle (Except there are more people fighting this battle) and be good natured about it.

[Mephansteras]

Another role that might be useful for town, though, might be a Squire, who can choose to protect somebody that night with their own life. So less powerful than a wizard, but still useful if Meph wants to give the town a little more defensive measures without anything too powerful.

A bodyguard role? Not a bad idea.

[Tiruin]

Tiruin:

...Imp, you'll be really shocked NQT is town. Please don't think lesser of him for that. :S

I.  Don't anymore.  Now I think lesser of myself.

D:
Well both sides did errors. It's my fault there! sorry for that..

And yeah, I really hope NQT would be back. He played very nicely with his manner of scumhunting (the psychological approach I have is also what I'd be using in the future..just for posterity) but..but...
Oh man do I feel bad that I hit on him there.

[Max White]

Scums gonna scum. Would you feel better about just letting somebody win, robbing them of the right to ever say they won on their own merit without help?

[Tiruin]

....Riiight x___x

[notquitethere]

Expect a fuller breakdown of my reflections on this game in about 12 hours time. It's nice to see that my scum hunting technique works, this was just more of a closed set up than I'd been led to believe. A game where the town's possible roles are all known but the scum's are secret is like trying to play a boardgame with someone who doesn't allow you to look at all the rules and thinks they're clever when they win.

[Caz]

GG.

[Imp]

Expect a fuller breakdown of my reflections on this game in about 12 hours time. It's nice to see that my scum hunting technique works, this was just more of a closed set up than I'd been led to believe. A game where the town's possible roles are all known but the scum's are secret is like trying to play a boardgame with someone who doesn't allow you to look at all the rules and thinks they're clever when they win.

Except the Town's roles are only somewhat known, I reference the addition of Werebears to play before their addition to the list of known town roles and the two known flavors of Witch - which suggest that other known Town roles may well have multiple flavors and formats...  Heck we know they can, at least slightly: how Monster hunters have both had and didn't have an investigate.  And how one, but apparently only one Warlock has been redirection and block proof (by the strength of his magic) (or a warlock gets a secret clue - if there's no Illusionists in play, they don't get told that they are redirection and block proof).

One thing that might have made -this- game's set up more balanced would have been to replace one of the less useful roles - and for this, given that there was no content about killer identity in the 'you're now dead' PMs, I pick the warlock - with a Sage.  At the very start of play, the game that had a Sage had 3 clues at the start of play.  For all that I now deeply understand that roleclaiming something safe to hit 'helps' Scum (though they may or may not use that information - NQT made it to end of play despite having been a safe hit, and despite being somewhat frightening to Scum because his analysis was actually identifying primarily Scum, and that I was not chosen to be a night kill either despite being a safe and potentially threatening target... HRM Scum and risk analysis, must think more about)...

Anyway, I think if I'd been seer I'd have 'blown my load' of Clues immediately D1 (even before going out on my Branch) and continued to report any new 'hints' I was given every day I lived.

That might have helped.  Or not.  Didn't happen so I don't know.