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[Kyzrati]

Haha, you and JobLeonard over on TIGS are totally on the same page. Very fitting description, really. And it's even more fun with sound, but I'll start out with some GIFs for now.

[Kyzrati]

ASCII-plosions! Been busy blowing things up:

[Retropunch]

ASCII-plosions! Been busy blowing things up:

Hold me.

[Arcvasti]

0_0

It is terrific.

It was inevitable.

[Kyzrati]

Later today I'll be getting around to enabling melee knockbacks to smash robots into machines, which will send debris flying. Tip: Doing this around explosive machines will usually not be a good idea. Also: don't let enemy brawlers knock you into something explosive! I hope to hear stories from players learning that the hard way

[Alev]

PTW

Will this be Windows only?

[Retropunch]

So this is a bit of a strange question regarding explosions as they are by their very nature explosive, but how/is there a way for the player to tell how bit the explosion will actually be as it seems a bit random?

That's fine if it is as explosions kinda should be, but I do wonder about it's effect on tactics.

[Kyzrati]

Will this be Windows only?

Unfortunately it probably will. It would be too much work to port for the relatively small player base outside Windows (around 10% for Cogmind, by my estimates). It does work in Wine, though. If I had unlimited time I'd love to port it, but... I don't

So this is a bit of a strange question regarding explosions as they are by their very nature explosive, but how/is there a way for the player to tell how bit the explosion will actually be as it seems a bit random?

That's fine if it is as explosions kinda should be, but I do wonder about it's effect on tactics.

Not strange at all, certainly a good question, and even related to a topic I was thinking about just earlier today: Uncertainty in roguelikes.

It's a pretty wide spectrum with some players always wanting to know every possible outcome so they can calculate what will be the absolute best course of action (essentially the "puzzle" end of the spectrum), and others who enjoy dealing with whatever the RNG throws at them (the random "gamey" end). No game can please everyone in this regard.

So where does Cogmind fit in? I'd say somewhere around the middle. There is a lot of information available to make informed decisions, but there are also some unknowns in there like damage ranges (though these can be avoided with certain weaponry). There are ways to control the unknowns, but you can never have everything completely under control.

The unknowns also work fine in context because there is a good amount of leeway with the numbers--you have quite a bit of integrity (HP), and this is far from a one-hit-kills game. You'll generally lose to attrition over many encounters rather than a single encounter (which is part of why there is no way to restore core integrity besides reaching the next depth). This somewhat mitigates the effect of the randomness, and you often know you're likely to lose before it actually happens, giving you a chance to change strategy.

Regarding explosions in particular, the damage is random within a certain (sometimes large) range; the radius is pretty close to a static value by explosion type (all these numbers are available via weapon info), but the amount of damage can affect that due to falloff. Despite the heavy damage potential of explosives, the impact is reduced by the fact that they spread damage across a target.

When preparing to fire your own explosives, you can even see the predicted explosive radius, which takes into account dampening by walls/obstacles as well.

Spoiler: (like this) (click to show/hide)

I should mention that almost all of the explosions in game are caused by yourself, since very few enemies have explosives (in the 7DRL none did), and only some of the machines explode, so it won't be difficult to get used to how it works.

In response to player feedback during the 7DRL aftermath I did also add an optional mode in which you can see all of the factors and numbers that are calculated into each hit roll. This mode is still available because I know some people like their details

Also, on re-reading your question I should add that the visual style of an explosion may not always be an accurate representation of the actual area of effect. The visualized radius prediction (and corresponding number value) is a much more reliable way to determine what will be affected. This is another area that Cogmind deviates from many roguelikes with their simple but "cell-perfect" AOE animations, to leverage the fun visual effects of the particle engine, of course!

[tompliss]

When preparing to fire your own explosives, you can even see the predicted explosive radius, which takes into account dampening by walls/obstacles as well.

I don't think I've asked before :
Do you take into account the explosion echo that can cause walls ?
If I fire a grenade in a corridor, is it susceptible to deal more damage to the bots in this corridor than if they were in open ground ?

[Retropunch]

Thanks for the very informative answer. I too enjoy a mix between predictability and the dark sorcery of RNG, and as long as there is some moderately sure fire way of telling what's going to happen then I'm sure everyone will be happy.

[Kyzrati]

When preparing to fire your own explosives, you can even see the predicted explosive radius, which takes into account dampening by walls/obstacles as well.

I don't think I've asked before :
Do you take into account the explosion echo that can cause walls ?
If I fire a grenade in a corridor, is it susceptible to deal more damage to the bots in this corridor than if they were in open ground ?

No, blasts do not reflect in any way; nor are there any reflective weapons (aside from manually guided ones, anyway--those can turn corners). Interesting ideas for potential implementation one day, though reflective explosions are probably not worth the trouble. I was considering adding penetrating weapons--projectiles that can continue through walls and/or enemies. Still letting that one simmer on the to-do list for a while. Those might not make it in until much later.

Right now the game is at the stage where there are plenty of mechanics implemented, so I'm only putting together the remaining essential parts so we can get this show on the road. AI is the next area for development. I added many new classes of robots that need unique behavior. That's always fun to test

Thanks for the very informative answer. I too enjoy a mix between predictability and the dark sorcery of RNG, and as long as there is some moderately sure fire way of telling what's going to happen then I'm sure everyone will be happy.

No problem, I enjoyed thinking about it for a bit and, who knows, could maybe use the content in a blog post one day

I think the mechanics will hit a happy medium for most, but I have no doubt it won't be for everyone, as no game is. Personally I don't like my roguelikes to be too puzzle oriented since that takes away much of the fun of unexpectedness. That said, if players find there aren't enough cues about a given effect that should be obvious, I'm all ears for making adjustments. We'll see what the reaction is in time.

[Retropunch]

I was considering adding penetrating weapons--projectiles that can continue through walls and/or enemies. Still letting that one simmer on the to-do list for a while. Those might not make it in until much later.

Please add penetrating weapons if you can! I really do think they really open up some interesting tactical options, and I love using them in games that allow it. The feeling of smashing through a number of enemies instead of just picking them off one at a time is great.

[Kyzrati]

Re-thinking the save mechanics. What do you think?

• Before: The simple solution used in the 7DRL was to save only when manually selecting "save & exit," and delete the save game on resumption.
• Now/planned: Auto-save on every new map, and whenever the window is closed. The save is only deleted on death.

The original method meant you could lose your progress whenever something happened to the game* or your computer--obviously uncool. (*The 7DRL wasn't 100% stable because it was... a 7DRL The engine now has a dedicated way to locate the sources of hard crashes and should be bug free by 1.0.)

I was considering adding penetrating weapons--projectiles that can continue through walls and/or enemies. Still letting that one simmer on the to-do list for a while. Those might not make it in until much later.

Please add penetrating weapons if you can! I really do think they really open up some interesting tactical options, and I love using them in games that allow it. The feeling of smashing through a number of enemies instead of just picking them off one at a time is great.

Yep, I think they're lots of fun, and while playtesting I did feel that the game was missing something without penetrating projectiles. Trying to resist any urges to add new features right now. Need to push towards an alpha release first.

[sambojin]

While it might open up the game to savescumming, that's not necessarily the worst thing in a single player roguelike. Especially one in development, as it can ease bug-finding and fixing tremendously. It also allows players to share those moments-of-awesome (or oh-shit! moments) with others, allowing people to ask about tactics to use or to legitimately brag about certain achievements.

It's pretty rare in a RL that anyone brags if they've scummed their way to victory, so only hardcore purists will really care (hell, I can savescum NH, Slash'em and offline-DCSS, so no system is perfect). I think there's far more to be gained from a "save whenever" system then there is to be lost by having it.

[Kyzrati]

It seems everyone's pretty much in agreement on "who cares about save scumming." So the new save system was implemented and saves on every new map, and whenever the window is closed (even if you don't use "save & exit"--just close the window and the game will save). No matter what kind of protection a game uses, if it's not server-side then there are easy ways around it. No sense in wasting time on it. Kinda like anti-piracy efforts in commercial software: Not really worth it, especially if they annoy legitimate players.