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[tompliss]

I don't think that's a good idea.

From an external view, it would be as those MMOs that get a P2P release then become F2P after a year : it means they failed.

I think that a Kickstarter (or similar crowd-funding) would be better. Most of the people at Bay12 that would want to invest in you would give more than the base 5-10€ you want to sell it during the first year, and would do it however you let us do it (higher starting price, non-base offer on Kickstarter, 4-game pack, ...).
But selling it at a higher price at the beginning, when it's a beta, would be probably become bad image for the future of your game(s).

Please do not make an early release at a higher price. I am willing to give you more money if you do not release it early ._.

[Kyzrati]

Thanks for the opinions. I agree with tompliss that it would probably be taken pretty poorly, and in the end really has too few benefits for the drawbacks (bad image, slower release, people mistaking it for the actual price because this would be an odd thing to do, etc...) Just popped into my head yesterday and I got curious about what the core audience would think about it. The only thing that keeps me from simply choosing KS is it's a fair amount of extra headache since I have to do it through someone else.

Just don't cave in to forum-whiners.

For sure. I would never compromise the integrity of the game as designed, though there's always room for improvement. So many good suggestions came from here back in 2012--that's how the 7DRL grew to have an even more usable interface.

And on eventual earners down the track, have you considered licensing out the engine? (it doesn't have to be ASCII based, but I do consider it one of the premier text/font/tile based engines currently in development).

Cogmind and X@com wowed me on what is possible in the format/genre.

No, it won't be called SyndicateRL. But damn........

Suuuuure it won't... but even if not in name, we are well familiar by now with the game you want to make

Maybe I'll make that after X@COM. It seems so suitable for this engine and style... But to your question, there's really not enough demand to make licensing the engine viable; plus I think such an action would be taken poorly by the community. (Closed source being already frowned upon by some, despite many of the most popular roguelikes actually being closed source...) Besides, providing technical support is also not my idea of fun

On a related note, I should mention that multiple times over the years I've mused at the thought of selling my services to work for others on a monthly basis making whatever roguelike they wanted. I wonder if anyone out there would actually pay for something like that. "Personal freelance roguelike dev for hire"

[sambojin]

Yes, they probably would. No, I'm not sure that any living person has done something so wrong, so evil, to be deserving of a punishment like that.

I can imagine the requests:
"Kyzrati, I kind want it to be like, umm, you know, the one with the guy and the thing. But I want it to also include one of those whatchamacallit systems from, you know, that really popular one from a few years back. Except I want mine to be heaps better. When can you have that done by?"

And you wanted less customer roadblocks and tech support?

edit: I incidently now consider myself copyright owner of any game called "The Guy with the Thing." Although the title could probably fit onto many genres of entertainment, even adult.

[Kyzrati]

Ha, obviously like any freelance work I could choose to refuse a job. I was imagining those who have a true idea for a roguelike but lack the time or technical skills to implement it--they would actually do most of the designing, at least in general terms, while I'd make it playable. Quite different from pure tech support. Could be challenging, and fun!

Good, you do The Guy with the Thing, and I'll take SyndicateRL--just yesterday was reading up on Syndicate for nostalgia

In Cogmind news, I've suddenly been forced on a detour from map design/implementation to creating half of the robots that have been missing (for the opposing faction), as well as rare late-game items and robots. You are going to want to steer clear of some of these guys.

[qazcake]

Seems really interesting. I will try it once rouge basin comes back on line unless i am missing a link somewhere that directly leads to the game.

[Kyzrati]

The link is kinda buried, since the only version available right now is the old prototype, a 7DRL from 2012, which doesn't much reflect the current experience. But you can try it out nonetheless over on the old blog.

[Kyzrati]

New post about CONSUMABLES, and why Cogmind doesn't have them.

And also why it does have them

And also the Terrabomb:

[10ebbor10]

If you want to do a pre-release it might help if you don't advertise it as such. Calling it a deluxe Gold Ultra special platinum edition or something will probably convince people it isn't the finished price.

[Kyzrati]

Good point, and it could even actually be a premium edition by adding value through other perks, more or less like a higher-tiered KS reward. I'll keep it in mind if I decide to release early and a regular KS is out of the picture.

[sambojin]

It should be fun finding all the wild and whacky uses for consumables, not to mention the consumables themselves. I noticed that you mentioned exploding scenery/computers (or something) at one point. Are there any "trap-like" consumables planned? Rather than a piece of the map, something you purposely put at a location/chokepoint to help destroy enemy robots? Or are they all "instant-use" effects?

[Kyzrati]

Are there any "trap-like" consumables planned? Rather than a piece of the map, something you purposely put at a location/chokepoint to help destroy enemy robots? Or are they all "instant-use" effects?

Interesting you ask because I was just thinking about this again yesterday, especially after having started playing Caves of Qud for the first time and reaching Golgotha, though others have asked about this earlier in development. Nothing like that is planned right now, because it doesn't really fit in the game design on multiple levels (balance, UI, etc.). I want to keep the environment relatively simple and focus on just parts and robots, though I did add interactive and non-interactive machines because we do need more atmosphere than just empty rooms, and they help meld together many other elements of the gameplay. Even consumables themselves are very rare and won't play a huge part in the game. They're all late-game special items that you'll have to go out of your way to find, though several of them will be incredibly helpful when used properly.

You'll find that Cogmind is not very "X@COM-like" in its items and mechanics--that game has a much broader range of crazy possibilities. When starting I did spend more than a week porting X@COM's ability system over to Cogmind, but I haven't even used it yet, and may not ever, simply because it will make the game a lot more convoluted. That said, for the consumables and some other special items I have been hard-coding effects that could otherwise have been scripted using X@COM's SA system, mostly because I'm trying to avoid using it entirely if I can.

Time is another major issue here. Cogmind was supposed to be a simple re-write of the 7DRL that would take no more than a year, and has since blown up into a minimum 18~24-month project... While I believe environmental hazards could be a whole new interesting element of the game, there's not enough time to fit them in. They are, however, a feature best limited to certain areas, and thus something I can tack on later if we want more content. Part of the reason for passing them up early in the design phase was the lack of enough good ideas to evenly distribute them throughout the game in an interesting and logical manner.

Special consumables alone are taking longer than planned (and there are only like 15 of them...). Yesterday I took this screenshot of the result after firing what is now the game's most powerful weapon, a disposable one with which you can do some serious damage but are going to have to try hard not to trash yourself with

[sambojin]

I'll be happy with pretty one-shot death attachments. It was a strangely convoluted thought sequence that made me ask the question anyway (from Overgrowth's fighting system, to it's newish stealth systems, to considerations of stealth in RLs, to whether they're worthwhile for any more than insta-kills, to traps, to wondering if Cogmind would have traps to place against enemies).

It was late and I'd just finished work. Yes, it's suprising what can keep me awake at night sometimes

[Kyzrati]

No, it's still a good idea and would definitely be something to consider for expanded content. Just have to draw the line(s) somewhere

Stealth in roguelikes is an interesting topic, and I do want stealth to be a viable approach to Cogmind (although that will only get you so far in some cases, and may work more as a "supplementary strategy" unless you have a lot of the right parts).
Traps are a good mechanic for making stealth even more viable, though in the case of the new Cogmind, terminal hacking also takes on that role in that you will be able to manipulate robots elsewhere in the level, such as diverting enemy patrols headed to investigate your location, or instructing guards to leave their post.

[Kyzrati]

Read about robots.

[Aoi]

Soooo... if that particular robot dossn't have legs, does the image reflect that? Say, via damage.