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Author Topic: RimWorld - basically the sci-fi Dwarf Fortress  (Read 856289 times)

Damiac

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Re: RimWorld - basically the sci-fi Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #3795 on: July 12, 2021, 11:39:18 am »

The problem is that you can't build defenses that scale with the attackers in a way that's practical when tunneling enemies are a thing. You get damage sponge enemies that require a bunch of concentrated fire to kill, but they can and do attack where you don't have concentrated fire.
Well attackers tunneling into your base have the advantage of avoiding fixed defenses, but they trade that for the huge disadvantage of coming in through a long skinny choke point.  You can body block the entrance with 1-3 melee guys, and everyone else is taking free shots at guys out of cover.  And you usually know where they're tunneling toward before they get there.

If forces you out of your comfort zone, but I think it results in an easier raid, if you are flexible enough to respond properly.
A cool effect of this is it's one of the few times it makes sense to move a bunch of furniture to use as improvised cover. 

And keep in mind, there are already raids where they just air drop into the center of your base right through the roof. 

Personally, I find the first siege to be one of the most troublesome raids, where I'm on a time limit, as the siegers set up a base with sandbags then mortars, so the longer it takes me to respond the harder it gets, and they choose the battleground, meaning I might not have much cover when I engage them.

All subsequent sieges can be dealt with using the mortars you got from the first siege, after that point they're basically just free supply deliveries.

Crashed ship parts with scythers without mortars are another big one, although at least you can prepare somewhat before waking up the mechanoids there. I find the rest of the mechanoid types pretty easy to deal with, a melee guy can shut down lancers and pikemen before they get damaging shots off, and the caterpillar type mechs are so slow you can kite them pretty easily. 
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Chiefwaffles

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Re: RimWorld - basically the sci-fi Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #3796 on: July 12, 2021, 02:58:54 pm »

Having competent melee pawns is in my opinion one of the most important tools when dealing with raiders. It wasn't particularly intuitive for me at first, but it did gradually make sense. A competent pawn (ideally with a shield belt) can body block small entrances and force the enemy there (which isn't likely great at melee) into melee combat. Meanwhile, all your ranged pawns can pile up next to the melee pawn to fire at the enemy stuck in melee. Once that enemy is gone, the next one tries entering only to be blocked and for the cycle to continue.

My last big save had the usual killbox and defensive perimeter, but with a bunker redoubt in case the enemies started to break through the killbox. Pawns could pile in and enact the mentioned strategy where the enemy is forced to enter one-at-a-time while all your pawns pile on the unlucky victim whose number just came up. The bunker redoubt was pretty nice too. Had a small mini-hospital to allow for medics to more properly field treat the wounded, and some emergency supplies as well as drugs.
The rest of my base was also designed with this in mind though it isn't exactly hard. A wide hallway segmented into different parts each connected by a single 1-tile door allowing the same melee strategy so at pretty much any point in defending the base I could retreat to the next segment and continue. It was also partially inside a mountain, so I had the good ol' insect bait room at the back. Completely unlit, large, unfloored & unwalled room that was all but guaranteed to have any bugs spawn there. Then I could design bug defenses accordingly.

Man. Talking about this stuff makes me want to play Rimworld again but I also want to wait for the DLC. My life is so hard.
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Grim Portent

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Re: RimWorld - basically the sci-fi Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #3797 on: July 12, 2021, 04:29:19 pm »

Article

So the the DLC will apparently be adding social roles and rituals to the game, which is neat to me because I usually played with cult mods anyway and having something inherent to the game should be a bit less clunky in some ways.

The article indicates that colonists will have different ideologies, so presumably there's ways to convert them to your preferred beliefs and principles, but it means it's not going to be as simple as checking a box to make everyone a cannibal.

Roles are a leader, which provides buffs to other colonists, makes speeches and can accuse people of crimes and hold trials. Kind of interesting, I would like the ability to punish people for breaking stuff when they get stressed, but obviously we don't know quite how it will work.

Moral Guides are basically priests. Lead rituals, comfort the unhappy, convert the heathens and so on. Sounds like a more in depth version of the various preachers and ritualists from cult mods. You need at least 3 pawns with a given ideology to assign a Moral Guide to it.

Specialists focus on one job at the expense of becoming unable to do certain others, with each ideology having favoured jobs. I'm not clear if this means that each ideology only has one kind of specialist or if they can all make every specialist but get bonuses to one.


Rituals sound fun, dance parties, gladiatorial combat, feasts and so on. Big lavish events, with a big and lavish enough event having various potential benefits. Once again sounds like an expanded version of the sort of thing you'd see in various mods, but that's not a bad thing by any means.


What I'm not clear on is if there's going to be a few preset ideologies and we'll have to mod new ones in, or if you can make and adjust and ideology in game as you go along.
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Re: RimWorld - basically the sci-fi Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #3798 on: July 12, 2021, 07:34:05 pm »

Tynan stated (On Reddit, I think) that there's pre-made ones but you can also edit them yourself in-game.
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Re: RimWorld - basically the sci-fi Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #3799 on: July 12, 2021, 08:00:55 pm »

Specialists focus on one job at the expense of becoming unable to do certain others, with each ideology having favoured jobs. I'm not clear if this means that each ideology only has one kind of specialist or if they can all make every specialist but get bonuses to one.

One of the pictures show an ideology with two specialists, farming and doctoring.
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Mech#4

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Re: RimWorld - basically the sci-fi Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #3800 on: July 13, 2021, 03:53:31 am »

I think part of the Rimworld event A.I. is to keep ramping up the challenge until a pawn dies? Like, if you survive a raid with no casualties you'll get another raid quickly, then another until you lose someone, then the raids will back off and give you space to breathe.

I'm playing a settlement at the moment and had had a number of raids, fought them off successfully with no casualties. Then I got two raids at once, one including 11 and the other 15 against my 7 pawns.
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Re: RimWorld - basically the sci-fi Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #3801 on: July 13, 2021, 04:46:01 am »

That's probably due to the fact that colonists have inherent values to their person. A highly skilled, healthy pawn, have high values; than say, a pawn with low amount of skill and banged up a bit.
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Dostoevsky

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Re: RimWorld - basically the sci-fi Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #3802 on: July 13, 2021, 01:55:13 pm »

I think part of the Rimworld event A.I. is to keep ramping up the challenge until a pawn dies? Like, if you survive a raid with no casualties you'll get another raid quickly, then another until you lose someone, then the raids will back off and give you space to breathe.

I don't think so, though storytellers do have a target range of pawns within a colony. In other words, they have a desired minimum, maximum, and extra-maximum number of colonists. Being under that number makes it pretty likely to get new colonist events; being over the maximum heavily throttles the availability of new colonists.

The vanilla storytellers are largely pretty similar, with a desired minimum of 4 and maximum of 13, though Randy has the 'critical' population level all the way at 50 instead of 18.

The non-Randy vanilla storytellers do have a sort of ramp-up system of threats with breathers interspersed, however, which could explain what you're seeing.

(Mod storytellers of course can deviate from these numbers.)
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lemon10

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Re: RimWorld - basically the sci-fi Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #3803 on: July 13, 2021, 05:11:12 pm »

I think part of the Rimworld event A.I. is to keep ramping up the challenge until a pawn dies? Like, if you survive a raid with no casualties you'll get another raid quickly, then another until you lose someone, then the raids will back off and give you space to breathe.

I'm playing a settlement at the moment and had had a number of raids, fought them off successfully with no casualties. Then I got two raids at once, one including 11 and the other 15 against my 7 pawns.
The strength of raids and events slowly but inevitably ramps up (to a max) until a pawn dies, as far as I know this has no impact on how frequent events are or the type of events that triggers.
This can of course result in really bad scenarios where you get like half your pawns injured in a super-strong raid since nobody has died in the past three years then having another super strong raid come and wipe everyone out while like five people are still unconsious.

You can avoid this pretty easily by sacrificing a useless pawn in a raid or even just turning off/modifying the ramp setting so it isn't an issue you even need to deal with.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2021, 06:04:34 pm by lemon10 »
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Mephansteras

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Re: RimWorld - basically the sci-fi Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #3804 on: July 13, 2021, 05:16:11 pm »

Huh, this is good to know. I'll have to look up how to modify that.
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lemon10

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Re: RimWorld - basically the sci-fi Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #3805 on: July 14, 2021, 01:47:53 am »

Huh, this is good to know. I'll have to look up how to modify that.
Changing it is pretty easy actually.
Go to storyteller settings->custom->then set the damage adaptation settings to 0%.

Its important to note though that damage adaptation is a pretty big part of the difficulty and assuming you don't lose people (E:especially if its due to being a dirty save-scummer like me) turning it off results in a significantly easier game. Because of this you might want compensate for it by upping other difficulty settings.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2021, 02:23:36 am by lemon10 »
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Mech#4

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Re: RimWorld - basically the sci-fi Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #3806 on: July 14, 2021, 01:55:17 am »

Yah, I find myself getting overly frustrated at some events in the game. Particuarly since I play with a bunch of mods that I want to focus more on researching and construction and, eventually, combat.
I have turned off the Cold Snap and Heat Wave events. Having a heat wave when you're playing a medieval mod and no effective way to deal with temperatures of 50c other than the passive cooler is... not fun.
Some others I'm probably going to be disabling is the Toxic Fallout and Volcanic Winter events. Volcanic Winter isn't too bad but Toxic Fallout is just everything dies and you can't do anything outside. Even hunting the few surviving animals is useless since they rot immediately.

Sure, preperation and all that. I'm not very good at that but coupled with the frequent raids it's all a bit too much for me.
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Re: RimWorld - basically the sci-fi Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #3807 on: July 14, 2021, 06:42:11 am »

The one thing about raids in general, is at least they happen once in awhile. In DF, even when settling right next to a hostile civ of any sort, it takes ages for them to come and assault you.
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Dostoevsky

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Re: RimWorld - basically the sci-fi Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #3808 on: July 14, 2021, 09:25:38 am »

The strength of raids and events slowly but inevitably ramps up (to a max) until a pawn dies, as far as I know this has no impact on how frequent events are or the type of events that triggers.

Do you have a source on this? The chatter I'm seeing from some searching is that it's not just pawn death but also a pawn being downed. (Still different than I had thought above, admittedly.) I'm also seeing claims that it's possible for the adaptation to make threats smaller than normal, not just greater than normal.
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Vivalas

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Re: RimWorld - basically the sci-fi Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #3809 on: July 14, 2021, 10:37:23 am »

Yah, I find myself getting overly frustrated at some events in the game. Particuarly since I play with a bunch of mods that I want to focus more on researching and construction and, eventually, combat.
I have turned off the Cold Snap and Heat Wave events. Having a heat wave when you're playing a medieval mod and no effective way to deal with temperatures of 50c other than the passive cooler is... not fun.
Some others I'm probably going to be disabling is the Toxic Fallout and Volcanic Winter events. Volcanic Winter isn't too bad but Toxic Fallout is just everything dies and you can't do anything outside. Even hunting the few surviving animals is useless since they rot immediately.

Sure, preperation and all that. I'm not very good at that but coupled with the frequent raids it's all a bit too much for me.

Hehe, this makes me want to try medieval again because I'm having flashbacks to my heat waves where it just felt like a pythonesque comedy sketch and all the peasants were just collapsing in the streets. Actually I don't think I lost anyone to heat waves which I think was because at night the heat would go away enough for pawns to lose the hediff in a room with lots of coolers, provided they went indoors to a room that delayed the heat wave during the day.

I really want a good medieval rimworld setup but the Vanilla Expanded one kept spawning raiders with heavy artillery as opposed to catapults and the other medieval one isn't compatible with CE so I eventually built a new modset and kinda threw that medieval save in limbo.

Playing medieval does make a normal colony afterwarss seem very easy though!
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