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[Teneb]

I'd say it's a bit of more of the same, with the quality of the storytelling being about as good as it was. There are a few surprises here and there, though, that I stumbled upon by accident. There's also a new ambition that can be picked at character creation: immortality.

Spoiler: Actual Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Turns out, leaving the eastern edge while underwater results in something different. Doing so regularly notes how the sea is lit from below. Going below before proceeding lets you see the source firsthand. And instead of being deposited at Irem or Kingeater, you end up in one of the new ports: The Gant Pole.

For those that don't want to pay for the DLC, they also added a bunch of new stories free for everyone.

[Urist McScoopbeard]

Looks like great fun, very tempted to buy it! While what Silfurdreki explained/collated in his last post has actually helped my understanding of the Fallen London universe immensely, I can never help but want to see MORE of it. I know that getting the expansion will only leave me drained and with more questions than answers.

[Majestic7]

Nice, got the expansion for free since I bought SS in Early Access.

[Silfurdreki]

Looks like great fun, very tempted to buy it! While what Silfurdreki explained/collated in his last post has actually helped my understanding of the Fallen London universe immensely, I can never help but want to see MORE of it. I know that getting the expansion will only leave me drained and with more questions than answers.

If you want more of the Fallen London lore I'd recommend this Tumblr that answers questions and writes short summaries of the lore. It's mostly focused on Fallen London, but much of the broad strokes apply to Sunless Sea as well. I read through quite a bit of it a while back and it's a really cool universe that Failbetter have created.

I'm having a blast with Zubmariner, the new locations all seem to be quite good. From doing a few of their stories they seem to be on par with the more complicated ports of vanilla Sunless Sea, places like Varchas, Adam's Way or The Khanate. I especially appreciate Athe, now that I realize how it works:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

In Athe you can "go sharp" in various body parts, which gives them superhuman abilities. E.g., going sharp in the lungs allow you to breathe poisonous gas or hold you breath longer. Each thing that goes sharp opens up various storylets and combinations open up even more.

Also, the underwater map sailing is a bit more dynamic than the surface sailing, which is really nice. Various things randomly spawn on the sea floor that can do anything from just give you some fuel to start a mini-quest in a shipwreck.

[Greenbane]

Does the expansion reduce any of the grind, or make the gameplay more interesting? I already have it since I bought SS while it was in Early Access, but after pouring just over 30 hours into the base game (half of which was retreading my first captain's steps), I was ultimately disappointed. The lore was great, the stories were great, but all the mechanics around them (i.e. the actual game) felt immensely lacking. Combat was boring and unrewarding, trading non-existent and permadeath was slapped on merely because it was in vogue at the time, with the devs not really knowing how to properly integrate such a feature into the gameplay.

If Zubmariner is just more of the same, chances are I'll give it a pass even though I needn't pay for it.

[Teneb]

Does the expansion reduce any of the grind

There is no grind. If you are grinding you are playing it wrong. Port reports and a couple of hauls from the Salt Lions are all it takes to get yourself some nice stuff. But is is more of the same, though. Those that liked the base game will like Zubmariner. Those that didn't...

[Greenbane]

Does the expansion reduce any of the grind

There is no grind. If you are grinding you are playing it wrong. Port reports and a couple of hauls from the Salt Lions are all it takes to get yourself some nice stuff. But is is more of the same, though. Those that liked the base game will like Zubmariner. Those that didn't...

"Playing it wrong", heh, if that's a possibility in an open world game, then what's wrong is something with the design.

And yeah, the whole progression is ultimately superfluous, so there's technically no need to grind, do repetitive tasks and amass echoes. One could say getting most bigger ships was even counter-productive, given how you lost speed unless you bought bigger and bigger engines, and even then you'd be travelling at similar speeds as on the starting boat but consuming much more resources.

Too bad I actually wanted a Frigate, though. If only for the show of it, disregarding the fact the increased combat power provided next to no practical benefit, just like the dedicated cargo ship's increased storage. That was my choice, when the game was evidently telling me, "do the stories, forget about everything else". I guess I was expecting more than a glorified Choose Your Own Adventure book with an RNG and nice music.

Anyway, thanks for the information, and excuse my rant. It just gets me that Sunless Sea could've been so much more if the developers had shown some boldness.

[Majestic7]

I haven't played Zubmariner yet. However, in SS I found the problem to be that the devs made an open world game, then tried to force the player play in a certain way. Basically, during EA they made earning money by hunting, trading and so forth practically impossible by design. This was to make the players go after the storylets in ports instead of, say, trading themselves into a better ship and then killing monsters. While I understand their desire in this, I think it is a weakness in the game in that the game forces you to play in a certain way.

It is a bit like starting a tabletop RPG campaign with the understanding it will be an open world sandbox thing, then the GM railroading you into following a plot. Even if the plot is most excellent you feel betrayed because you expected X and were promised X, but instead receive Y.

I still like SS a lot, it just could have been better with more freedom in options and design.

[LASD]

Anyway, thanks for the information, and excuse my rant. It just gets me that Sunless Sea could've been so much more if the developers had shown some boldness.

Boldness is a strange way to put it. I think Sunless Sea was an incredibly brave game to make. A quasi-RPG that relies almost completely on it's narrative and atmosphere. There's really nothing that would distract the player from that focus. The lengths they went to support the atmosphere through mechanics is something a lot of developers would not dare to do. Giving you a ship that is so slow and inefficient with resources that going to the other side of the world actually feels like a big, scary, uncertain adventure. And that saving resources will make you stick to light and shores, lest you go slowly insane. Every system just works together so well.

Second only to Her Story, Sunless Sea was the most interesting and bold game that came out last year. Or that is at least how I see it.

P.S. Zubmariner is great. Being underwater is actually really scary and cool. And now with the new content I keep making new mistakes that turn into great stories.

[Greenbane]

It's an interactive fiction game, a Fallen London with a bit more framework. There's little boldness in relation to its browser-based cousin/spiritual predecessor.

In the end, that's debatable to some extent. What I really can't concede is the notion that the mechanics work in any but the most superficial way. Yes, the fuel and sanity mechanics contribute to the atmosphere, but it's one eventually dispelled once you realize you have to be extremely stupid to be lost at zee. That or random instadeath moments like running into Mt. Nomad without foreknowledge, or the RNG giving you the finger during a quest.

What other mechanics are there? Nothing of note. Combat is as uninteresting as it is pointless and avoidable, same with trading and in consequence bothering to upgrade your ship or equipment. Your boat is, after all, just a vessel to get you from story hub to story hub, with no other complexity. It initially provides the illusion of an open world, but sooner than later the game's encouraging you to treat it like Fallen London, and just do the stories, disregarding everything that could've made it something more.

I'll leave it there. Clearly this is a polarizing game, and different people expect different things from videogames. Different levels of interactivity, one might say. Some of us expect as much "game" as "video" in them, so to speak, while others are content laying back and letting the "game" take the backseat, if the "video" is interesting enough.