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Author Topic: NOOB QUESTION! How to melt the river?  (Read 6511 times)

A_S00

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Re: NOOB QUESTION! How to melt the river?
« Reply #15 on: September 11, 2013, 03:39:11 am »

Silly question, whats with magma above the ice?
Like in an artificially created, magma-safe channel?
Well, in order to keep it from interacting with the water one z-level below it, I'd have to build a magma-safe floor in exactly the same place as the ice I'm trying to get rid of, so...not helpful in my situation.

In general, though, I think it'd probably make the water in the z-level below flow, just like it does for one z-level up.  I haven't seen it tested, though; don't know for sure.
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Merendel

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Re: NOOB QUESTION! How to melt the river?
« Reply #16 on: September 11, 2013, 03:40:55 am »

well it is possible to make an artificial river underground if you just want it for power but it does kind of exploit the games definition of flowing water.   All you really need to do is make a cistern somewhere with a nearby map edge.  cut a tunnle to the map edge from the cistern and carve a fortification into the last block so water can drain out.  Put a door/floodgate/bridge in the tunnel and link to a lever.  Fill the cistern, once done open the floodgate till some waterflows off the edge of the map then close it agian.   Top off the cistern and you've got a useable area for water wheels with no FPS loss like a dwarven water reactor would have.

I know that wont help your cave adaptation room have mist but you could slightly expand the room underground and put a mist generator in that section not exposed to the sky so it wont freeze. also wont help your obsidian farm but you could just fill a cistern in the summer months thats big enough to last till the next thaw for your needs.
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Berossus

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Re: NOOB QUESTION! How to melt the river?
« Reply #17 on: September 11, 2013, 03:47:59 am »

Ok, how about this: a magma-tube inside the river.
You can dig out a frozen river (3 tiles wide and deep), build a hollow magma-safe tube that is sealed on all sides and pump mountain blood through it.
All tiles adjacent to the tube should be heated, no? So if you create a U-turn and pump it continously, the river should flow.
Or something like that.
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Preferrably from a distance.

A_S00

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Re: NOOB QUESTION! How to melt the river?
« Reply #18 on: September 11, 2013, 04:01:21 am »

I know that wont help your cave adaptation room have mist but you could slightly expand the room underground and put a mist generator in that section not exposed to the sky so it wont freeze. also wont help your obsidian farm but you could just fill a cistern in the summer months thats big enough to last till the next thaw for your needs.
Yeah, there's definitely workarounds for each individual thing I want my setup to do that are functional; I'm just disappointed that my over-arching goal of "use magma to keep the river thawed so my cool water-powered stuff doesn't stop working in the winter" turns out not to work.
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Domicrow

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Re: NOOB QUESTION! How to melt the river?
« Reply #19 on: September 11, 2013, 12:57:22 pm »

Good Lord! This all sounds like such a piss about =P i think i will just discontinue this fort because if i get just one dwarf in hospital i am done.
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GiglameshDespair

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Re: NOOB QUESTION! How to melt the river?
« Reply #20 on: September 11, 2013, 01:24:39 pm »

Dig down to the caverns.
Pump water up, make a well, or move dwarves down.
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Oaktree

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Re: NOOB QUESTION! How to melt the river?
« Reply #21 on: September 11, 2013, 08:00:22 pm »

If you are looking for a source of water, not power generation, it is not that complex, but you do need access to enough magma to set something like this up:

1. Pick a section of creek you want to liquify, say 4x4.  All the work will be sub-surface - you want nothing exposed to being "above ground" as once you do that square will freeze water almost instantly if not being actively heated by nearby magma.  For this reference let's assume your fortress lies south of the creek and you want your water cistern in that direction.

2. At creek level you want to tunnel up adjacent to the selected section.  Here you can install a flood gate to stop flow as desired.  To the south of this you want access to your cistern - a set of stairs will work fine to get water down - and can be the way your workers initially got to that level.  Stairs can go down and once you are down a few Z-levels you can dig out more space to hold water.  Or use some tunnels if you want the cistern and well elsewhere - though then you can lose water to evaporation unless you keep the water depth 2 or deeper.

3. On the Z-level *under* the creek you want to mine out the 4x4 under the section of creek to be liquified.
At the northeast corner of the 4x4 dig a channel to the east (accessing the next Z-level down).  Two tiles south of that on the east side dig a three tile long tunnel and then another channel at the end of that tunnel. 
This chamber is going to be filled with magma.  The first chamber is a drain down to the magma storage.  The tunnel is going to be the site of a pump constructed of magma-proof materials and the second channel as the pump's access to get the magma.
A tunnel for dwarves to access the pump can go out the south.

4. On the next Z-level down the bottom of the two channels need to be connected to make a chamber large enough to hold a supply of magma.  It can be loaded via whatever method best suits your resources.  I couldn't make mine too large since I was filling the chamber using mine carts dumping down the access the pump was going to use.

Once the magma is in place -
a. Open the flood gate
b. Send dwarf to man the pump
c. magma will flow into the upper chamber via the pump and drain back down via the other channel.  This causes *moving* magma under the frozen water of the creek and thaws it.
d. The now liquid water (4x4+ of depth 7 water) will flow past the flood gate and down the stairs (or hole) into the cistern and tunnels
e. When the water depth hits 1 (or even at 2) stop pumping magma and close the flood gate.
f.  The depth 1 water in the creek re-freezes to full depth ice in a little while after the magma drains out

Repeat.

You will lose magma to evaporation when it is either depth 1 in the upper or lower magma chamber.

I use a system like this in my current fort (Relicblaze).  Permanently frozen creek in a snowy embark with no aquifer and no water in the caves.  So if I needed water I had to either do this or dfhack "liquids".  I repeat ran it enough with the same section of creek that I was able to fill a cistern to keep a well for the dwarves as well as get enough water to power a DWR and fill a secondary cistern used in a "water gun" as part of the defense system.
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